Dont buy a hybrid. Do some serious research about "how green hybrids are"

 

So what happens in a hybrid when the batteries go bad?

 

Take a look a the tdi vw's. They have been the best kept secret for well over a decade. For some reason diesel has not caught on here like in other countries (wonder why that might be?) Anyway my 01 tdi golf (169k miles) has averaged 58mpg for the last 4 years and it has been 100% problem free. I have a friend with a 02 tdi jetta he averages 49mpg. His has 240k miles on it currently. Think about a automobile that will last for 300k miles getting 50+ mpg that entire time. Or pick up a hybrid that you will replace the battery pack at least 2 times over the same time span and will get worse fuel economy. Here's a article autoweek did a couple years ago. I remember reading this article in the magazine and there it also mentioned that the prius's on board computer deliberately misled the mpg it displayed to the driver. http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060424/FREE/60417021/1008

 

THanks!

I hadn't really considered diesel, but now we will. I had heard something about people making their own bio-diesel fuel, have you tried that, does that work in a VW TDI?

 

Hybrids are gay.

 

i'd go with the vw diesel for sure. take very good care of the motor. then, when the body rusts away you can transplant the diesel into a suzuki samurai for a real bov!

 

Good to know that the engine should last that long! Thanks.

 

As far as hybrids go, the prius is the only hybrid worth considering. All the other ones only give a marginal improvement in fuel economy. Well, ok, the Honda Insight from the early 2000's got in the 60's for mpg's but they are a 2 seater.

The 2nd generation Prius has a "B" button by the shifter that engages the regenerative braking which slows the car. When the batteries are full, the car automatically switches to an engine braking of sorts that slows the car down. It's very similar to down shifting.

Regarding the battery... When it eventually fails at around 200k miles, you have to buy the pack for 2k and pay $800 to have it installed. The prices are set by Toyota to prevent dealer gouging. You can also install it yourself and Toyota will still accept the old battery back for recycling.

I bought my used 2005 Prius with 65k miles for $8900 fully loaded. The car reports 51.4 mpg for its lifetime. I have a notebook that I keep in the console to calculate the mileage and I have averaged 55 mpg since I bought it.

Yes, the TDI is a nice engine(sans timing belt), but the car around it is not so great. I had a TDI and it was a reasonably reliable, but it did need constant maintenance to run well.

And my last point will be that the only TDI you will find for 10k or less will have 150-200k miles on it. The engine may go the distance, but the car might not.

Another point. People rave about TDI's gas mileage but that is usually with a standard. The automatics usually get a decent chunk less. All Prius's get their mpg's with a CVT automatic.

 

The 2nd generation Prius has a "B" button by the shifter that engages the regenerative braking which slows the car. When the batteries are full, the car automatically switches to an engine braking of sorts that slows the car down. It's very similar to down shifting.

THank you for your entire post, but particularly the part of engine braking! Good to know.

With our mountains here, I bet I could recharge the batteries to full on the regenerative braking just coming down from the continental divide.

We still haven't made a decision on what route to go. Our Jeep gets 16mpg and it's frustrating.

Have you rigged up a power-out system off of your prius to power stuff like a freezer?

The other reason we haven't decided yet is cuz I like the higher clearance and 4x4 of our jeep. Have you (or anyone else reading) driven a prius in the snow or on ice? I guess I could always keep a set of studded tires, but for our purposes, the 4x4 on our jeep has been sufficient for moderate blizzards.

 

The hybrid battery pack is never "full" or "empty". It stays between 40% and 80% to preserve battery life. There are a lot of those sweeper highways where it drops altitude slowly and gracefully. The battery usually ends up charged after a few miles and just stops. I assume after that, the brakes could charge the 12v battery but I am pretty sure there is an alternator. These cars are confusing though. I have a set of blizzak winter tires and this car is glued to the road in storms. My record for distance without the engine is 9 miles on the AlCan Highway. They are a great car though. They are just boring as vanilla like most Toyotas. Best of luck though, just let me know if you have any questions. A year ago I would have never bought a Prius but reading up on them changed my mind.

 

My brother has 2 Priuses and had an AWD Highlander hybrid, and I have an AWD Escape hybrid. For snow cars they're just fair, especially when braking. He swears it's because of the low rolling resistance tires and swaps them out with snow tires each winter. I just changed mine out for more aggressive LRR tires, so we'll see what next winter holds.

The priuses are getting mid 50s for gas mileage, and my Escape's getting just over 30.

 

Been driving my wife's Prius since 2008. Zero maintenance problems so far with 70k miles. Spend about $10 week on gas. No problems on mountain roads. The car has a special downhill mountain gear you can select on the shifter. Traction problems in slippery conditions but controlled with good snow tires in winter.

PM me if you want more details.

 

Add $5-9k to that price for the batteries you'll have to replace in 1-2 years. That car is 5-8 years old and those batteries are getting tired.

 

I can fully appreciate people having differing opinions about cars. I sure as heck would have never bought a Prius a year ago. However, I read up on them and they are excellent cars. The traction batteries cost $2200 or less from dealers. You are allowed to install them yourself for free. It's supposed to be easy, just follow the instructions and don't electrocute yourself.: After you are done, the battery will be accepted by Toyota for free for proper disposal. The cost to have it installed is around $700. Yes, 3k is not a trivial amount of money, but it is not like you didn't knowingly buy a car that will EVENTUALLY need a new traction battery.

These cars are being driven by normal people with over 100k miles on them everywhere and rarely failing. There are Prius's, Camry's, Highlanders, and Ford Escapes(they licensed the tech from Toyota), being used in major cities as taxis for a damned good reason. Because they work. These taxis are constantly eclipsing 200k miles and still running strong. The statistics are there if you look. Toyota makes excellent cars, and the Prius had to above and beyond excellent to make hybrids mainstream.

As a useful tool for buying a Prius, you can get the traction battery tested to see if it is still charging properly. This $200 test will show whether you will need a new battery or not. If it is still working well at 100k, you should make it to 200k easily.

These cars are not for everyone, but to say that a common service job costs from 160-300% more than it really does isn't very productive. As far as reliability, go ask a Toyota tech what they think. They are the ones who work on these cars and can tell you how reliable they are.

And yes, VW makes a nice diesel engine, they just need to make a decent car to surround it. After what my 2005 TDI put me through, you could never get me to buy ANY VW...

-The engine ate a timing belt at 62k miles and I needed a new head because all the lifters got smashed. $4600
-Ignition snapped and needed a new ignition as well as 2 new outside key cylinders and an ECU. $1900
-Transmission gave out at 66k $3300
-Turbocharger failing with 71k. $1900
-Window dropped. $200
-Headlights decided not to work $300
-Airbag system went out. Free since I was too poor to fix it.
-Cracked connecting rod at 79k, priceless!

Call me jaded but buy a Toyota.

 

I have one acronym for you. TDI

 

The skinny: Replacing the battery on my friend's wife's Prius cured me. A 2003, battery started to die in December 2011. Toyota wanted over $3,000 for the battery, PLUS installation. We bought a rebuilt battery from a fellow in Healdsburg who knows his stuff for $1,800. Pretty straightforward, but a definite learning curve, and we've both worked on a/c and d/c power systems for 30 years. No way. best bang for the buck is a 10-15 year old Honda/Mazda/Toyota with low miles. I just bought another one (97)with under 50k miles for $3,500 to replace my 93 that had over 50k in Mexico alone. It was pretty beat, but ran great......

 

I just got a 2012 brand new tdi its not a hibrid but it gets 42 hwy and not broke in and will hold 140 mph no prius will do that also it is a auto with the dst trans 6 speed just went on a 1300 mile rd trip used 130 worth of diesel fully loaded with 4 people andall luggage ac on full and it ran like a sewing machine all the way to 11500 ft in altitude i am sold on it i recomend it YOTE !!!

 

hybrid :rofl:

why?

homer

 

And no one here mentions a Chevy Volt.
Upwards to 80 miles on a charge, and when it runs out of charge it kicks in a standard engine that spins an electric turbine to keep the car running. I've got a friend who has had to fill his cars tank 3 times in 2 years.
And..it's a chevy.

 

The Volt is pretty neat. I'd look into one if they were 20k instead of 40k. Maybe in a few years they will be cheaper. And there is nothing wrong with a Chevy!

 

We're looking at getting a 2004-2007 hybrid for about $10,000. First, do any of y'all think that there's hybrid that's as good as the Prius that we should consider?

Depends on what you want.

Btw, the Toyota Prius wins all environmental awards in German tests since some years. It's not made in Germany, so there is little point in believing that those test are favouring Toyota.

Also, do these cars have gears? I know, sounds silly, but I'm wondering how these cars do on mountain downhills.

They will recharge the battery. After that one is fully recharged you can use your gas engine to brake similar to a conventional one. There's a extra driving mode for long downhills.

In Europe the batteries of most old Prius are still fine, but people here usually don't drive as much...

For Germany it is important to know that after driving 180km/h for some time the battery empties quite a bit. But this is a "problem" you will not have in the US.

I think that it is a nice (but expensive) car if used mainly within European cities, where it is very efficient. The US car market /culture is different though.

PS: My favourite hybrid would be a BMW i8. Available from 2013. A "bit" more expensive though...

It's even a plug in hybrid.

 

Oh, I love my Toyota's, but they are real trucks and not hybrids. Wife's toyo has 220k+ miles on with no major problems. My toyo has 321k+ miles on it, I just replaced the original steering rack, only thing major done to it. No way I would own a toyo, or anything else newer then 1999 though.

Sounds like most of your problems on your VW were caused by a lack of maintenance.

homer

 

A kit with all the parts needed to replace the timing belt properly is $348.03. Plus installation if you so choose.
http://www.ecstuning.com/Volkswagen-Jetta_IV--TDI/Engine/Timing/ES5753/

Sounds like most of your problems on your VW were caused by a lack of maintenance.

I am very well aware of how to service a car properly.
Synthetic oil every 3k
Transmission fluid every 15k
Coolant every 15k

I have what is probably one of the only vintage Land Rovers on the continent that doesn't leak anything. It has a Mercedes Benz OM616 which is a diesel. That has about 60k on it from me and had 200k when I bought it and overhauled it. 260k and it still purrs like a loud kitten.

I know what a lack of maintenance causes. If my car failed so miserably because I didn't maintain it, I would have nothing to say. However, when I maintained it to perfection and it still failed, I reserve the right to blame the manufacturer. It may have been a lemon, but it was a sour lemon.

 

True hybrids burn gas AND rubber...

 

Has anyone dabbled in converting their TDI VW into a Waste Vegetable Oil burning machine?

With a good connection to a restaurant with a fryer, it's like free fuel. Which is my favorite way to increase your MPG savings.

Any PROs & CONs from the community?

 

junk



DO NOT BUY THIS HUNK OF JUNK!!! a friend bought one and after 100000 miles or so the battery fails and yes it got the same mileage without the battery as it did with it. NOW he is stuck with it cause of the battery oh a 12000 dollar repair these cars suck on hills and cannot carry much weight IF you bought a prius you could not carry all your bug out gear and supplies it just would not fit nor could it handle the weight. a chevey s10 or ford ranger either in a king cab straight drive will do just as good be sure to get a pre 95

 

Friends of ours just traded their Prius in for another larger one.
Toyota gave them, no joke, $1000 for it.

They ran the thing into the ground with 125k. Hybrid battery died on them. Those auto turning head lights died on them.

Car was a real crap box on the road. Got good mileage though.

Seems like they were putting new tires on it every year.

I would pass on a Prius after their experience but they liked it so much they bought the bigger uglier lookin Prius.

 

the nature of pump gas these days require you to either use it or have it go bad in just a very few months. just another thing to consider when buying a hybrid.

 

From an Energy website I maintain - Some data is a little dated.

Prius - Well thought out combination of efficient engine, battery, computers, electric motors and more. It is a high mileage automobile but remember every watt of energy used is from the gasoline in the tank.

Why no plug in Prius or any other mass produced electric auto yet?
Deep charge and discharge of the newer battery technologies is a challenge to accomplish and still ensure long battery life. Manufactures are reluctant to gamble on battery warranty of plug in electric vehicles.

With all the high tech advantages the Prius has, why does it not get even better results?

The computers #1 directive is PROTECT THE BATTERY

Toyota tries to keep the Prius battery in the 40 - 60% full charge range at all times. This leaves room for regen braking to charge the battery and gives the battery the best chance of lasting to warranty end.
These self imposed battery restrictions limit the electric-only driving range to around 1 - 3 miles.

Yes there are ways to use more of the Prius battery and get outstanding mileage. Many aftermarket modifications are available including plug in, but you are playing with the useful life and voiding the warranty of a $5000 battery. - Toyota battery warranty is 8 Years - 100,000 miles

Just a quick note - Next year the Prius will have a solar roof option. Many will see this as powering the car for free. Far from it.
Media articles may mislead you to believe that it runs the air conditioner. Not quite!

It powers a small ventilation fan which keeps the car cooler when the car is sitting in the sun. This helps the cars air condition by not having to cool down a 160 degree interior when first starting out.
These solar panels are not even connected to the main drive battery. If they were connected to the main battery and charged all day in the sun additional range would be very little.

 

... Just a quick note - Next year the Prius will have a solar roof option. Many will see this as powering the car for free. Far from it.
Media articles may mislead you to believe that it runs the air conditioner. Not quite!

It powers a small ventilation fan which keeps the car cooler when the car is sitting in the sun. This helps the cars air condition by not having to cool down a 160 degree interior when first starting out.
These solar panels are not even connected to the main drive battery. If they were connected to the main battery and charged all day in the sun additional range would be very little.

Those have been an option for over a year already.

 

Thanks ezman.

Does running the ac reduce battery life?