[LilRedNeckGirl]

and to stay on point here, we are talking about "CONTRACTORS" not the maroon home owner, who after a few beers, proudly and boldly says, " I got this", and grabs a few tools and gets started in soomething he/she knows nothing about....

 

[kokosmom2]

If you watch the TV show with Mike Holmes, you know all this bad stuff happens when people use sub-par contractors

 

[LilRedNeckGirl]

I have 21 years as a business owner. been there, seen that, many times, and assured, it wont be the last time.
the sad part, with the internet, state licensing boards, its all preventable. angies list is a biggie. referrals and reviews from former clients. gospel from the horses mouth. did the OP ask the planning zoning people about the contractors history? I would have.
as afore mentioned, some " get what they deserve and pay for". they shop the lowest price, sans any history or knowledge of the contractor. and then they cry when a heating system isnt ducted anywhere but into the ceiling joist cavety, when electrical wires are hung by nailing through the wire with 16 penny nails, when rooms and walls are out of square and plumb, windows wont open and doors wont shut, and when sheet rock cracks at every seam and after the painter finishes, seams to wall ceiling are not streight, and insulation is removed and water lines are run in outside walls in areas where they surely will freeze ????
and they expected better, with no permits or inspections, ????

beats me, but who am I? I woould just really be leary, of any contractor, that beats down on the permit system, saying its " Just a money grab, a tax on your imporovments, by the government"
You should know better then that. Its there for you protection, both in quality of work and over all safety.

And the flip side of the story, The homeowner has to be willing to pay a fair price for quality work. Sure, I can paint a room in my house, for myself, with 4 gallons of paint, ceiling, walls, trim. perhaps 150.$ in material, but a contractor that asserts they can do your room for that HAS TO CUT CORNERS to make anything. same thing applies with every aspect of building. get your quotes, look at the matterial lists, price them out and compare them, often the truth will be clear at that point.

Nuff Said.

 

[wldwsel]

Lots of folks are disagreeing with the OP, but when we built our house, we were right here on the property every day. Stayed out of people's way, but paid attention. Also cleaned up after the subs in the evening.

Their attitude was "if I can't see it from my house, it's OK". We saw nearly everything the OP spoke of attempted on our house. We caught it because we were here, We also made them fix it. Most of our subs were licensed.

One thing he didn't mention was the thing that P***** me off the most was clean up. We found bushel baskets full of trash they had left between the joists, under the porch, and between the walls. It was like there Mamas never taught them to clean up after themselves. It seems that every time a sub picks up a nail gun, he has to fire off a dozen or so toward the yard (and driveway) before he even puts one to wood. We picked up a full 5 gallon bucket of nails by the time the house was finished and they still floated to the surface over the next two years. We picked up another 5 gallon bucket full we paid for but didn't get used and were thrown into the woods. We were finding trash in the woods for almost a full year after the house was built. Some of the "trash" had been whole stacks of 2x4s and 2x6s that were ordered and left out until they were too warped to use.

Yeah, some of you guys may be upset with the OP, but as an owner who saw and paid for a lot of this, I think there's some accuracy in what he says.

Before you say we should have gotten different subs, it was hard enough to get them to come out here in the country to begin with. They would get here (sometimes @ 1000 hrs) and say "oh yeah, I forgot a tool - I have to run back to town" - they mostly didn't come back that day. We had contracted with a local builder who built high-end homes, where we would be the "contractor" and he would be a "consultant" who supplied the subs and made sure the job was done right by supplying a supervisor and he personally would check the site regularly. The supervisor was pretty good - the consultant showed up twice in 8 months. All in all, the house came out well - not because of them, but because we paid attention.

WW

shoot straight - stay safe

 

[LilRedNeckGirl]

yep, yep, you got a good job because you were dillagent. sure, you had to get your hands dirty, do some clean up, but end result, you got a good job. ' house came out well" @ your words.
clearly, you didnt, choose an unknown contractror, blindly let them work away and not stay on top of things, or assume that because they were there working, that things were all good.
that is, in part, what is required to get a good job. you have to be involved, take the time to pre screen, then stay involved.
your one mistake, handing the final check over before the site was final cleaned. that was their job.... not yours.

our contracts say all trash and debris removed, project broom swept.

then before we ask for payment, we ask one question to the homeowners,
" are you satisfied".

 

[Don H]

"One thing he didn't mention was the thing that P***** me off the most was clean up. We found bushel baskets full of trash they had left between the joists, under the porch, and between the walls"

Contractor for 26 years now.

I had an electrician working for me that was fond of leaving all his scraps where they dropped and never cleaning up after himself. I told him I would deduct $10 for every outlet that I had to pick up scraps at. Problem solved

I'm glad I don't run my business like the OP, but I never have problems finding work either, without advertising.

 

[Cabinet Maker]

Do you know the go to "contractor" for the city of long beach doesn't have a license, insurance, bonded, or workmans comp. He does all the major jobs for the city for cash. Big jobs
That towns head electrical inspector even had the nerve to ask to use my license for a side job . Don't buy anything in that place the whole city's shady:thumb:

Wow. I guess anything's possible. I've done work there over the years but didn't have to deal with the Building Dep't.
With all of the paperwork to be filled out and CYA documentation that most municipalities require, I don't know how TPTB would get away with that anymore. One worker hurt without Workers Comp would have every lawyer in the State fighting for that case.

As far as the "sharing" of your license, I've heard that the going rate here is 10%. If you don't get your cut, send an invoice to the city. :thumb::

 

[BrianWorf]

I have read this thread and seen just about everything mentioned. I did alot of pre-wire work for GCs over the years (Low-volt - TV, phone, computer, alarm) and every bit of my work not only passed inspection, but the inspectors asked for my cards to do work for them. I have been on large major construction projects where OSHA and building inspectors came down hard and cited every sub for every little thing. Except me. I may not agree with all the rules, but I know them and follow them.

The comments about not knowing why a GFCI is needed because a breaker will trip shows why sometimes rules don't seem to make sense but are needed. In the case of the GFCI, the current difference between what goes out on the hit and returns on the neutral can be no more than a few milliamps. That is because it only takes a current of about 10 milliamps across a human heart to stop it and kill the person. If a person is using a faulty electrical item that is faulting current to the person, the current flows through the person to ground, which could be a puddle outside, or a sink basin, etc. A 15 amp breaker would never trip before a person was dead. Thats where the GFCI comes in. Yes they are a pain in the ass, but I would rather have a pain in the ass than be dead. Or worse, see somebody else get killed.

I ALWAYS provide a quote and stick to it. I always add a buffer to cover most issues that may come up, and usually my final bill is for LESS than what was quoted. The only times it is for more, is if the customer has added work and we then do a MAC (Move, Ad, Change) to the original quote. I treat people like I expect to be treated.

My rule on the job is "The days work is not complete until the jobsite is neat" means I pick up my trash. AND I don't leave it in the customer's waste baskets at their desk, I haul it off. I have had many compliments from customers about my cleaning up. Also, I recycle my electrical scraps. Copper still pays pretty well at the recycle yard.

I encourage all contractors to just live by the simple rule of how would YOU want to be treated.

 

[Cabinet Maker]

Close, but not quite correct.
They monitor current flow for ground faults, not current surges.
This condition happens when the current on the hot leg and the neutral are not equal.
Might want to educate yourself a little bit before you decide weather or not the need to be installed.

Current on the hot leg and neutral will never be equal, because whatever's plugged in (load) uses some power for the "work" done.
The GFCI strictly senses current going through the ground line. If everything is working properly, there should never be current flow through that line.

 

[BrianWorf]

Current on the hot leg and neutral will never be equal, because whatever's plugged in (load) uses some power for the "work" done.
The GFCI strictly senses current going through the ground line. If everything is working properly, there should never be current flow through that line.

Cabinet maker, you are actually not correct. The current between the hot and neutral MUST equal out, some of it is not "used" by the load. If you have 10 amps going out on the hot, 10 amps somehow must be returned to the neutral. It may be through the neutral wire, or through a ground back to the multi-grounded neutral at the breaker box.

The GFCI doesn't sense ANYTHING at all on the ground. It looks for a misbalance between the outgoing hot and the incomming neutral.

http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/GFCI

 

[woowoo2]

Current on the hot leg and neutral will never be equal, because whatever's plugged in (load) uses some power for the "work" done.

Errr..... nope.
Hot and neutral should be equal.

http://ecmweb.com/content/how-gfcis-work

Quote:
With the exception of small amounts of leak-age, the current returning to the power supply in a typical 2-wire circuit will be equal to the current leaving the power supply. If the difference between the current leaving and returning through the current transformer of the GFCI exceeds 5 mA (61 mA), the solid-state circuitry opens the switching contacts and de-energizes the circuit.

http://home.howstuffworks.com/question117.htm

Quote:
A GFCI monitors the amount of current flowing from hot to neutral. If there is any imbalance, it trips the circuit. It is able to sense a mismatch as small as 4 or 5 milliamps, and it can react as quickly as one-thirtieth of a second.

 

[Cabinet Maker]

I stand corrected. I've never had a GFI pop when there wasn't a third prong plug used.
I do know that if you take your Wiggy and test across hot to ground, instant pop. Thanks.

 

[Hershel Green]

No matter the contractor....I control the cash flow, and ensure that with every contract there is a penalty clause for being over budget, sloppy work, or not meeting the deadline. The last cheque goes out "after" the building inspector has signed off the job and cleared all permits and the contractor's accounts have been audited....

 

[Runamok]

If you don't get multiple quotes, ask a bunch of people who they would use AND slowly give them their cash as the work is complete than YOU are the idiot.

Thank you for providing examples of what to look for in this thread.

 

[PaulKersey]

Do you know the go to "contractor" for the city of long beach doesn't have a license, insurance, bonded, or workmans comp. He does all the major jobs for the city for cash.

I have a California license. General Engineering Lic# A-37XXXX. I've never seen that happen before and I've done a lot of work in So Cal, including the City of Long Beach.

This story sounds like a myth that will circulate forever. :

 

[oldgoat]

And this, boys and girls, is why we hire actual licensed contractors who carry Liability Insurance and are bonded.
As much as I detest California, they have a fairly good set of rules to become licensed, and a way for a customer to get help if they are screwed over.

I have a California license. General Engineering Lic# A-37XXXX. I've never seen that happen before and I've done a lot of work in So Cal, including the City of Long Beach.

This story sounds like a myth that will circulate forever. :

Pm me and i will send you their numbers