[Survivalguy72]

Terrorists Now Targeting Walmart stores

It's about time!:

Welcome.

 

[thescarlettgoose]

I believe that we should spread the knowledge that extremist muslims have killed, and are continuing to target, Americans on our own soil.

I fully agree with you, in fact I believe profiling would be 10 times more effective than grabbing grandpa's balls.

I also changed the 1st paragraph to say "terrorism has declined when compared to the previous 10 years. "

The letter is meant convey the fact that terrorism is simply a tool to grab power and install systems to hold it. I would site sources if I could convince the editor to let me write a full blown article. Hopefully my reference to April 2009 and "the see something, say something" will give those interested more than enough info to do a google search.

Thank you, I would hate to be dismissed because of people thinking I am misinformed. I was under the impression that the Fort Hood shooter was just crazy, I did not know he was a Jihadist.

The "0 deaths since 9/11 to domestic terrorism" comment reminds me of a story:

Early each morning, a man would walk out on his back porch and scream at the top of his lungs for 60 seconds. Then he'd go back inside.

His neighbor finally could take it no longer. He approached the neighbor about his daily scream. "Why on earth are you doing that?" he asked.

"To keep the lions away," replied the neighbor.

"But there are no lions around here!" exclaimed the man.

"See?" said the neighbor; "It works, doesn't it!"

------------------------------------------------------------

The fact that there have been 0 deaths simply means that, nothing more. It doesn't mean we should do nothing, doesn't mean we shouldn't remain vigilant, doesn't mean we should stick our heads in the sand and ignore what's going on in the world, and around us.



If the feds knew of a potential plan targeting Wal-Mart and did nothing, and a terrorist plot succeeded where it might have been thwarted if people had been warned, they'd be skewered by everyone--and rightfully so.

Instead, they're ramping up some awareness (nobody complained about alert level colors, did they?), and now they're being skewered for that.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. If that's the case, you might as well be damned for doing something as opposed to doing nothing.

It may well come down to this: If there is in fact some intelligence suggesting a Wal-Mart targeting, this action may serve as a deterrent.

And that may keep the lions away, at least for now.

If we still had all the money that has been spent on "remaining vigilant" we would have enough money to bring those killed by your lions back from the dead. So if I understand your reasoning correctly, you believe we should run the constitution through a shredder because of the possibility of terrorism. Our 4th amendment has been completely wiped and we are dangerously close to losing the 1st and 2nd. You would have us turn into a police state because of the possibility of terrorism? Sir you have the very mindset of those bringing this disgusting garbage to life. Do you understand the implications of what the Bush and Obama administrations interpretation of "remaining vigilant" are? Find a citizen of the former Soviet Union and ask them how nice and safe they felt.

 

[can see it happen]

Could someone tell me why Americans in small towns shopping at Walmart feel like they are in tel aviv? What has happened? or is happening? I havent heard or read a thing about that so I am curious.
Thanks

 

[thescarlettgoose]

Could someone tell me why Americans in small towns shopping at Walmart feel like they are in tel aviv? What has happened? or is happening? I havent heard or read a thing about that so I am curious.
Thanks

No one feels that way, which is why it is crazy. I was using a story to show that the DHS's unprovoked actions are wildly unnecessary.

 

[Howey01]

Hello goose welcome from KY good post reporting terrorist activies is one thing but spying on your neighbor for disagreeing with the governments current attack on U.S.citizens is totaly out of the question for me

 

[Josh97526]

Yep, it's here. We are all being watched now. No, I am not being sarcastic. As soon as you step out your front door, unless you live in the woods, you are on camera somewhere. Your cell phone tells people where you are. The products you buy are being kept track of to help with advertising. The things you search on google (which I no longer use) are being cataloged to build profiles...it goes on and on.
Most of us are already feeling un-comfortable about all of our extra "security". It's suffocating us to a point where even going to the grocery store is becoming an exercise in frustration. The question is, what can we do about it? We all agree that it's going to far, but how do we stop it? And even if we did stop it, how do we keep it from going on behind our backs? It's not an extremist point of view to want your privacy. Nothing will change until millions of us all decide to stand up at once. The powers that be need to see how many of us "right wing extremists" there really are. Apparently, judging from the 2010 election results, enough to get whatever we want!

 

[outdoors]

for those that think this is a wonderful idea, just consider the abuse that might follow.. some one thinks your weird becuase you prep.. " he is so strange always buying extra food and ammo.. gotta be a right wing nut case.. im gonna call DHS." or " I really cant stand Bob. he ticked me off bad saturday Ill show him.. Hello DHS "

beyond all that I always thought americans in general should be alert enough to spot potential danger.. boy was I naive LOL.

 

[Peter]

DHS is starting to sound a whole lot like KGB...Having neighbors spy on neighbors was a favorite tactic of the KGB. Apparently vodka isn't the only thing we are importing from Russia.

 

[bltjr1951]

Heck, they don't even report shop lifters.
One winter it got real cold and snowy, almost every mexican in town was walking out with new winter goods they didn't pay for.
I hope it gets real cold again, some moved to CA.

 

[FXjohn]

the average rugged individualist/survivalist would never survive without a walmart to drive a hoverround in and buy canned food

 

[goose3]

If we still had all the money that has been spent on "remaining vigilant" we would have enough money to bring those killed by your lions back from the dead. So if I understand your reasoning correctly, you believe we should run the constitution through a shredder because of the possibility of terrorism. Our 4th amendment has been completely wiped and we are dangerously close to losing the 1st and 2nd. You would have us turn into a police state because of the possibility of terrorism? Sir you have the very mindset of those bringing this disgusting garbage to life. Do you understand the implications of what the Bush and Obama administrations interpretation of "remaining vigilant" are? Find a citizen of the former Soviet Union and ask them how nice and safe they felt.

You're taking things out of context and riding the horse of hyperbole. Re-read what I said, and this time, if you choose to respond, don't try to put words in my mouth.

The Wal-Mart thing is telling people to remain vigilant. If you think that means I believe we should run our constitution through a shredder, I'd like to know from where you got that.

This kind of arguing is, sadly, too common: there isn't a good argument against what the person says, so some other thing is invented, something the arguer wishes they'd said but didn't, and then they argue against that. It's what's known as a Red Herring.

Re-read what I wrote. This time, please think about it, instead of the hyperbole-laced knee-jerk reaction you brought the first time.

And as you do that, ask yourself, if there was evidence of planning for a Wal-mart terrorist incident, what you think the feds *should* do in response to something like that.

What should they do? Ignore it? Not tell people? Wait until it's over and then say "well, we heard some things but since warning people to be alert might be thought to be running the constitution through a shredder, we decided to put people's lives at risk instead."?

Sheesh.

 

[Crutch]

What should they do? Ignore it? Not tell people? Wait until it's over and then say "well, we heard some things but since warning people to be alert might be thought to be running the constitution through a shredder, we decided to put people's lives at risk instead."?

Sheesh.

Not stepping in your and his debate, I just wanted to respectfully add my two cents, and a nickle.

I was at Home Depot and a lady noticed I had a concealed weapon when I was pushing a cart. Normally my cloths hide my fire arm better, but for what ever reason she noticed.

At the time I was helping a friend of mine run for Sheriff and it was very necessary that I stayed armed. He had been threatened, even shot at for running against a corrupt Sheriff, but I digress. In NC open carry is legal, and my conceal carry is current.

She tells her boss and as I am pushing the cart and holding onto my sons hand he grabs my shoulder and applies pressure to get my attention. I am about to react as I am turning around to face him, when he says "sir, sir, are you a cop"? I answer "whats the problem, are you alright?". Him still holding my shoulder asks "sir one of our employees noticed your fire arm and she was afraid. Why don't you come over here with me?"

As this starts to cause unwanted attention to other customers, he escorts me over to the Customer service desk and I notice a young black lady wide eyed and nearly clapping with delicious Dramatic excitement. The manager again asks me if I am a police officer. I ask him if he is. He says no, then goes on to tell me having a fire arm in Home Depot is illegal and I could go to jail. He explained that I need to leave the store or he is calling the police. I tell him, fine I'll leave but under GS132 I am going to need a copy of the security tape and you'll be arrested soon. You also might want to sneak a no concealed weapons sticker on your front door, but it wont help your case.

He getting worried he might have done something wrong decides to call his manager. His face grows pale and he calmly, methodically asks me to leave the store. I do.

Question time:

1) What laws did he, or I break if any?
2) How could this have been avoided? (both on my part and theirs)
3) If I was in fact a mad gun man, how would confronting me deflate the situation?
4) What are the store managers rights regarding shoppers?

 

[FXjohn]

menard's has a sign saying no concealed weapons. does home depot?

 

[Zombie Hunt Club]

I was humbled by the wall of words.

Good post though. Now that you are no longer a lurker OP - welcome!

 

[thescarlettgoose]

You're taking things out of context and riding the horse of hyperbole. Re-read what I said, and this time, if you choose to respond, don't try to put words in my mouth.

The Wal-Mart thing is telling people to remain vigilant. If you think that means I believe we should run our constitution through a shredder, I'd like to know from where you got that.

This kind of arguing is, sadly, too common: there isn't a good argument against what the person says, so some other thing is invented, something the arguer wishes they'd said but didn't, and then they argue against that. It's what's known as a Red Herring.

Re-read what I wrote. This time, please think about it, instead of the hyperbole-laced knee-jerk reaction you brought the first time.

And as you do that, ask yourself, if there was evidence of planning for a Wal-mart terrorist incident, what you think the feds *should* do in response to something like that.

What should they do? Ignore it? Not tell people? Wait until it's over and then say "well, we heard some things but since warning people to be alert might be thought to be running the constitution through a shredder, we decided to put people's lives at risk instead."?

Sheesh.

How many lives have been saved by the putting people through body scanners and feeling up 12 year old girls? How many lives have been saved by wire tapping American citizens communications and monitoring their credit card transactions? I reread what you said but I am a simple man and probably nowhere near your intelligence.

Help me to understand what how hearing of a "potential plan" can justify starting this campaign in 600 Walmart stores in 32 states. If the DHS knew of some plot, why wouldn't they state it specifically in their check out line video? Instead, Napolitano leaves it wide open for simple people like myself to interpret. Please explain how "we heard some things" is justification to treat law abiding citizens like criminals? Please explain what Benjamin Franklin meant when he said, "He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither."

If the DHS is building policy on, "we heard some things" then its just a matter of time before the Jihadist's start making stuff up to watch us tear our selves apart from the inside out.

I am all for battling terrorism but American citizens are not terrorists. Until I see the average Walmart shopper blowing themselves next to the dog food, I will never accept Napolitano's face on a screen, telling me to "remain vigilant" while I shop.

 

[Crutch]

menard's has a sign saying no concealed weapons. does home depot?

Nope. And they still don't.

I talked to the District manager and she got the whole matter straightened out. I even got her to not fire him.

Really cool lady.

 

[jitterbug5157]

Glad you got that situation straightened out, Crutch. One thing I always notice when I am in Home Depot is that I always have salespeople and plain clothes security employees popping up wherever I am in Home Depot. It used to bother me at first, when it started three years ago. I figured it is because I am a 'prissy' looking female who lingers in several different departments before I actually put the items I decide to buy into my cart. I can't stand pushing a heavy shopping cart around.
I am very aware of it also in Target and WalMart. I even had to say something to one of the Target managers who has known me for years. An acquaintance who worked in store security said I fit a 'profile.'
The profile is:
1) I am well-dressed and don't look like a shoplifter (whatever that means)
2) I always shop with a large purse on my shoulder that doesn't zip shut.
3) I have no organized pattern to the way I shop the store. I may go from school supplies to clothing to electronics and then to camping or hunting.
4) I open my purse to take out my cellphone when I get texts or phone calls
from my kids or husband asking why I am taking so long. LOL

 

[Mic]

I have enjoyed reading the survivalist boards for over 5 years now. Until now I have not felt the need to post. The government has crossed the line in the sand and I can not hold my tongue any longer. Please read my post and if you think it is worthy I will turn it in to my local editor. Please feel free to help out with clarity, and punctuation.

In order to make the country more secure the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) started a campaign called, “if you see something say, something” in almost 600 Walmart stores across the U.S. Why is the federal government asking shoppers to spy on their fellow citizens? The DHS has not given reasons other than the broad stroke of "to make communities safer". No terrorist activity has taken place at shopping centers of any kind and as of yet the DHS has not reported terrorist plans to do so. Since September 11th terrorism has in fact declined, when compared to the 10 years previous to 9-11.

So if terrorists are not to blame, what possible reason could the government have to ask citizens to become unpaid informant of the Department of Homeland Security. To answer this question you can look to world history to see if this sort of thing has been done before. You need not look far to find that it was the practice of the Third Reich to ask citizens to turn in enemies of the state. Enemies of the state included any and all Jews, those that supported or hid the Jews, and any person who publicly disagreed with Adolph Hitler.

Still not convinced? Last April the DHS published a report to help local law enforcement identify and battle terrorism. In this report the DHS basically labeled American citizens who do not agree with the actions of the federal government “right wing extremists.” If you take these two recent, separate actions seriously it is easy to foresee that the DHS may soon ask citizens to turn in people who don't agree with the government.

A excerpt out of George Orwell's science fiction novel 1984? All of what you just read is true. The DHS is ramping up security all across America to battle domestic terrorism. Since 911 airport security has tightened to the point where many Americans would rather stay home than travel for pleasure. The FBI is building a probable criminal database on Americans that have committed no crimes. Credit card information is being obtained without warrants on Americans who have committed no crimes. To top it all off, the DHS is asking American citizens to spy on each other. All of these measures are being put into place to protect us from terrorism. The problem is that we have not had a terrorist act (excluding alleged attempts) in almost 10 years. If there is no terror in small town America, the only reason to implement Third Reich style tactics is because your conditioning the people for more. Thats right; more government control, more regulation, more security, and a lot less if any freedom.
thescarlettgoose at youtube.com

Maybe I am missing something here. Anyone who has read any of my posts around here knows how I feel about Big Brother, but I am wondering why so many people are so upset at being vigilant, which is what this looks like to me.

First, as other posters have pointed out there has been deaths attributed to Muslim extremists since 9/11, but far more importantly there has been multiple attempts with some of them being stopped deliberately and some by dumb luck. That being said does anyone think these animals plan on giving up and not trying to hurt anyone ever again?

I attended a recent training at a tactical shooting school on dealing with the "Active Killer" which includes terrorists and one of the key things they taught us was staying extremely vigilant and warning people when we see something going down, which I thought was sound advice.

Another point is according to research I have done the terrorist mentality right after 9/11 was the next hit had to be even bigger and better, well that is pretty difficult to pull off these days so they decided that ANY soft target where they can kill Americans is a good target now, i.e. shopping malls, Wal-Mart stores, Times Square in New York City, etc.

Now I am not saying I am any type of government stooge and would rush off to report Right Wing Extremists, especially since I am considered one of them or Christians, or spying on my neighbors, but being vigilant and reporting people I truly think plan on hurting a bunch of innocent people is a good thing and if I can stop them rather than simply report on them I will do that as well. Am I missing the point of this debate?

 

[goose3]

How many lives have been saved by the putting people through body scanners and feeling up 12 year old girls? How many lives have been saved by wire tapping American citizens communications and monitoring their credit card transactions? I reread what you said but I am a simple man and probably nowhere near your intelligence.

I'm beginning to believe that.

When terrorists have been deterred, how can you figure out how many lives have been spared by policies--policies started by GW Bush, I might note--that have kept terrorists from trying further airline-related terrorism?

Surely you can see how that's a silly question.

This is why I related the "lions" story at the beginning. How can you prove that shouting at the top of your lungs keeps the lions away, when you never see any lions?

Help me to understand what how hearing of a "potential plan" can justify starting this campaign in 600 Walmart stores in 32 states. If the DHS knew of some plot, why wouldn't they state it specifically in their check out line video? Instead, Napolitano leaves it wide open for simple people like myself to interpret. Please explain how "we heard some things" is justification to treat law abiding citizens like criminals? Please explain what Benjamin Franklin meant when he said, "He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither."

I don't *know* what has or hasn't been heard, but then, remember back in the Bush/Cheney days of the color codes warning of high alert, not so high, and so on?

In what way is anyone treating citizens like criminals?

Further, suppose that Napolitano or others had said something like "Wal-mart is being targeted by terrorists; stay away until the crimes are finished, then resume shopping." Silly, right?

So, as before, what would you do if you knew that terrorists were planning on an op at Wal-mart. Would you ignore it, and simply sacrifice Wal-Mart shoppers on the altar of whatever it is you're arguing?

What would you do?

Your red-herring approach is wearing thin. I'm at this point thinking you're a troll, because nobody is this dense unless intentionally so.

If the DHS is building policy on, "we heard some things" then its just a matter of time before the Jihadist's start making stuff up to watch us tear our selves apart from the inside out.

Again, suppose they'd heard something; after all, prior to 9/11 there were indications of the operation nobody took seriously enough.

You're on the spot; if you'd do nothing if you knew someone was being targeted, why? And what would that mean to your presumed oath to preserve, protect, defend?

I am all for battling terrorism but American citizens are not terrorists. Until I see the average Walmart shopper blowing themselves next to the dog food, I will never accept Napolitano's face on a screen, telling me to "remain vigilant" while I shop.

I see. So this is about Napolitano's face. What if it had been Sarah Palin's face?

You have the right to your opinion; you also have the right to post on the internet, and to ignore the questions posed by others, as you have done with me.

And you also have the right to have others, like me, point out the problems with your arguments.

Hope you're enjoying that right. As for me, I don't have a whole lot of time for trolls.

 

[thescarlettgoose]

Am I missing the point of this debate?

The point is, where does it stop? If you are willing to accept this are you willing to accept current airport security measures to enter Walmart? You obviously enjoy owning and shooting firearms, are you willing to give them up for increased safety? What about police with enough authority to enter your home because someone thought you were suspicious at Walmart?

If we were serious about stopping terrorism in this country we would profile and monitor those that commit these acts. Instead the fed spends its time fighting wars they can not win and monitoring people who have never committed any crimes. Totalitarian governments are born on the backs of a fearful people.