I don't mind the plastic as much as the width, blockiness and chunkiness, grip angle and trigger. If they changed all of those, I'm sure I'd love the gun in either polymer or metal.

 

It would need normal rifling to appease me. No gun that won't shoot cast bullets is worth a second look in my estimation.

 

I agree there!

 

There are lots of pistols out there that already have all those attributes, I don't think Glock needs to do something different to become just another 'me too.'

Polygonal rifling supposedly gives more FPS and accuracy than standard rifling, and I've used cast lead bullets in my Glock extensively without any issues. YMMV, and you can always by an aftermarket barrel if it's a huge concern for you.

The grip angle statement always puzzles me.
The difference between a Glock, and a traditional 1911 is what? Maybe four degrees, as measured from the front strap? By some measurements it's exactly the same. (there are 110 degrees of arch between the front strap and bore of both designs). Either way, it's negligible.

I'm also a fan of the trigger. For defensive shooting it's about perfect for me by just adding a <$20 connector. I never liked the light 1911 triggers, found I was having unintentional double taps when using one in a class. But that's me, I understand lot's of people prefer the 1911 trigger. I would too for range time or target shooting I guess.

As for the frame material, the durability and weight advantages of the polymer are one of the things that make Glocks great IMHO. I have a 21 year old Gen 2 19 police trade in that's about perfect. The poly resists scratching and rub marks really well, esp from holsters.

Not trying to sell anyone on Glocks, either you like them or you don't, but there are plenty of good pistols out there to choose from, and I don't think Glock is hurting for sales. So I guess it's win-win, no matter where you fall on the issue.

 

If you don't have big hands glocks suck even then they aren't comfy. Right now id just go with M&P series I just wish they made em in 10mm

 

So what if Glock made an aluminum, or even steel-framed pistol?

It would be perfect less blocky chunckiness and even look good but it would cost at least 1K

 

I think the anti-polymer bias is pretty much gone now. Almost all serious manufactures now make firearms with some plastics. Glock was just the first to use a substantial amount thus has gotten the lion's share of criticism right or wrong. Heck everyone that owns a "tactical" shotgun has plastic all over it. Half of the budget junk I see people hang off of their ARs are plastic.

Cast lead can be shot out of a normal Glock barrel. But it will fowl quicker thus there is a slightly higher probability that you might have an issue. That is to say, if you never clean your pistol, which is an entirely different issue. Even if you are scared to shoot cast lead in your OEM Glock barrel, buy a drop-in replacement. I have a Storm Lake for my G26. But the bottom line is that if you clean your barrel, you will not have an issue.

Grip angle; yea I like 1911 / Sig style a little better. But it's a fleeting issue. If you use something for an extended period of time, you get used to it. So I don't have a problem with it and I don't think changing it would improve anything.

Glock can do whatever they want. I've seen 3-D printed aluminum-matrix 1911 frames at the last SHOT Show. Maybe that is the future, I don't know. But I do know that Glock sells a heck of a lot of guns without being super innovative over the past 20 years. And a lot of MFG's flattered Glock over those years with imitations. So they are getting something right.

 

I think the anti-polymer bias is pretty much gone now. Almost all serious manufactures now make firearms with some plastics. Glock was just the first to use a substantial amount thus has gotten the lion's share of criticism right or wrong.
ht.

HK actually.

 

I know other manufactures offered "elite" series guns (like steel frames instead of the normal aluminum).

Glock could make a run of aluminum guns and sell them for $1000 or steel guns and sell them for $1500 and they WOULD SELL! THere are a lot of crazy Glock guys out there.

Personally, I have 7 Glocks...all their 9mm's (except the 18 and an C models) and the 42.

 

There are a few companies that make aluminum frames mainly for competition. The solid frame flexes less and is supposedly more accurate.

 

People buy Glocks for some very specific reasons:
1. Value - For $550 you can own a new, very reliable, reasonably accurate pistol.
2. Simplicity - It's a clean pistol which makes it simple to operate.
3. Police - Glock is known as a "police gun" thus has a history people like.
4. Accessibility - Every gun store carries Glock. Every store has Glock accessories.

I'd argue that the biggest boon for Glock in the past 20 years was the wide acceptance of CCW in line with the launch of the Glock 26 in late 1995. Excellent CCW platform, excellent price at the right time. At that time no one made anything comparable except for maybe Kahr. And it took everyone else 10 years to catch up. M&P, XD, SigPro, PX4... way late to the game and in some cases still not even close to as carry-friendly.

Could Glock make some premium models and sell them? Probably. But I'd argue why even bother. What they really need to do is focus on what's going to keep them out front. The competition is almost caught up. Then need a new, real innovation more than premium models. Anything they come up with will likely cannibalize some of their existing, profitable products so I'd bet there is hesitation. If they release something that kills say, the G19, it better be something game-changing. Kind of like when Apple released the iPhone... they knew it would kill iPod which was their#1 product at the time. But it was a paradigm shift across all digital devices and set the table for a whole new market.

Someone sooner or later will figure out what the shift will be for pistols. That should be Glock's #1 focus. What is next.

 

yeah, my guess is it would still look like a soul-less brick, just in metal instead of plastic. Still not buying.

 

Well one could order a CCF raceframe for @$300
Swap your parts out into the new frame and then sell the original.
At least make part of your money back.

http://www.ccfraceframes.com/options.php

Different grip angles possible, aluminum or stainless.
And even using a new Glock for the project you still are only @$825.

Don't like the trigger, try a SI flat trigger.

 

Aftermarket frames and stuff -
I know there is a niche for race guns. But for the average shooter Joe, if you want a metal frame and this and that, why are you even looking at a Glock? Dropping another $1000 into a $500 pistol sounds a little askew to me. I've been a performing guitarist for 30 years and I see that same thing with guitars all the time. Somebody drops $500 of "upgrades" in a $500 guitar. Makes me laugh but to each their own.

Souless pistol -
They are all souless mechanical devices. Your car, pistol, knife... HVAC. Expressing your supposed individuality through purchasing an item commonly found at any gun counter is not a soulful activity. Do you honestly think you are expressing your individuality by purchasing a product? No. You are part of the commerce cog. You bought your individuality in a box... which is as sorry as it sounds.

 

Some follow-up points:
-yeah, the polygonal barrel thing is way overblown from what I understand, much ado about nothing. Just clean your weapons.
-I wasn't neccessarilly saying they NEED to change the grip geometry, just mentioned it since this has long been a frequent complaint.
-while polymer has gotten widespread acceptance, there is still a large segment of gun owners that loathe it. The "anti-polymer bias" is definitely not gone.
- I don't see why a aluminum or steel framed Glock would have to cost $10000 or $1500. There are already many quality, metal-framed guns out there that cost much less. Even Colt 1911's can be found for under a grand, I can't see a steel framed version of the Glock needing to cost a grand and a half to make a profit.
-I wasn't suggesting this was necessarilly a great idea that Glock needs to consider, as i said, this just occured to me and I presented it more for the sake of discussion than anything. That being said, I think it has possibilities as it would largely sidestep a couple of the big objections some folks have about them (some folks seem to feel plastic is "soul-less", while steel,somehow is not .)
-Anyway, thanks to Late2prep for posting the link to the company that's already making aluminum and stainless frames, that's news to me. I'm curious to see how much traction this gets, though I would think that it might get more acceptance if it came directly from Glock.

 

Sorry, couldn't resist :

 

A metal frame Glock would not add one iota of positive to the overall package. It would totally defeat the polymer frames positives. Glock are so popular because they work. Simple as that. You can fancy them up all you want with aftermarket slides and etc but the stock Glock is still one of the most solid firearms you can buy.

If you want a solid metal weapon then purchase a 1911. Then spend another $500 on getting your mags to work.

 

Agreed about the Glocks.

But... instead of a 1911, a metal frame CZ, Sig, Beretta, or third gen S&W... all are pretty reliable and proven. Just heavier.

 

Other Basic Safety ConsiderationsTo Be Addressed? ...

The Crock would need more than a materials change in the frame. Like already said better before me it would need a basic total redesign including a better grip angle, a grip safety, ambo thumb safety, loaded chamber indicator, a cocked striker indicator and what not. Just like what the Springfield Armory XD T 5" .45 TS already has.

 

The Crock would need more than a materials change in the frame. Like already said better before me it would need a basic total redesign including a better grip angle, a grip safety, ambo thumb safety, loaded chamber indicator, a cocked striker indicator and what not. Just like what the Springfield Armory XD T 5" .45 TS already has.

So a little tweaking then?

Change everything completely and that would...just about do it. :xeye:

 

****ing One Star Wanker strikes again.


...O well. Automatic 5 stars to balance the douche factor.

 

not much can be said that hasnt already been said about why people do not like glocks.. i think theyre ugly, the grip sucks for a number of reasons, not a fan of the trigger, dont like the feel of plastic.. but nothings more annoying about them than their legions of fanboys who believe theyre infallible, despite performing average at best in any number of trials and torture tests while being about as ammo-picky as anything else

by time glock got done designing one that was ergonomic, good trigger, strong steel frame, youd end up with something entire different and lets face it, glock cant do different, theyre like colt in a sense theyll be riding the same old design for decades

 

Then you would have a Sig imo and the increased price along with it.

Glock has zero reason to change. They do what they do to put out a reliable pistol at a reasonable price. Since they were the first to start mass producing polymer lowers they have become firmly entrenched as the leader in this area. Their redesigns aren't ground breaking because they don't need to be and must focus on previous generation compatibility more than something revolutionary.

On top of that, with the wide acceptable of the LEO/military community they really don't have to change anything either. The aftermarket for their pistols is so ubiquitous that there isn't a gun shop that doesn't have some of their pistols, mags, and holsters for sale. Other than a few revolver specimens there are few that can make that claim.

justin22885's claim that they are like Colt is actually a very astute observation. Once a manufacturer/company has invented or produced something that long or that revolutionary they become the defacto leader and some other complete change up is needed to unseat them. That is why the M&P, Xd, SR, etc. will never be as popular because they are just playing catch up.

 

Except one of them is going to get the Military contract (while Glock won't) and that will be a game changer.

Just like it did for the Beretta 92 back in the 80's.
.

 

Typical Glock Fanboy response.

I don't hate Glocks, I actually think they make a very reliable gun.

Just not to my liking but to each their own.
If it was the only option I had I wouldn't feel like I didn't have enough gun.

I can appreciate many guns, but funny thing about Glock boys is they get so invested in their Glockdom that they can't see ANY positive qualities in any other guns. As soon as anyone even mentions another gun, they immediately go on a rant about how the Glock is the ONLY gun worthy of owning, and if you prefer something else you obviously don't know **** about guns.

Just like the ignorant trolls who love to get into ridiculous arguments over AK vs AR, really?

Look back at my posts and see where I trashed the Glock?
Now look at your own.

Are you 5?
.

 

Oh no. Here we go.

You obviously appreciate Glocks.

There are definitely other guns than Glock that have positive attributes.

I agree with you.

No need for us to get into a slapping contest. :thumb:

 

I Fear Crocks Because I Am Only Human ...

I do not hate Crocks. I fear Crocks. I also fear myself. I am human. I will makes mistakes. I have made mistakes. With the Springfield Armoy XD 5" T .45 FS, I am less likely to make a very painful or fatal mistake.

For all you Vulcans out there who never feel the need to be human or never make handgun mistakes, feel free to pick and choose the Crock, the most dangerous handgun in the world ... for humans. Perhaps not Vulcans.

And thats a fact Jack? Nothing can change it? No argument can possibly win so perhaps better not even to try? Some pistols are safer than others. The Crock is not one of them. When you shoot yourself, you will understand this.

Has anybody done a scientific study involving AD and ND events with handguns? I for one would be curious which handgun brand leads that list. We can assume but that is not polite. I carry the XD T 5" .45 TS in .45 Super.

 

I carry the XD T 5" .45 TS in .45 Super.

I too have a XD T 5".45 but don't carry it, it's a little big for that on my frame.

Personally I have both, Glocks and 1911's, I've had equal reliability from both, no issues with either, I carry the Glock mainly because of capacity, but don't feel bad if I carry the 1911. The 1911 feels better to me, and point ability is better, for me, but they both have positives.

 

"A Mans Got To Know His Limitations" ...

I do not hate the Glock. I fear it. I also fear myself and know my limitations. I have had and will have close calls with handguns. I have had close calls with the 1911 which I grew up with, now have now over 50 years experience with (off and on) and I will NEVER be able to burn through the lack of a grip or thumb safety.

Also I have had close calls with my usual (not always) carry piece, my Springfield XD T 5" .45 TS pistol. Embarrassing but true. My handgun skills do not rank up there with that of Vulcans who never make mistakes and can never admit that they might just be humans made up from Hollywood actors using very non forgiving handguns.

What did thay Poppi cartoon character say? " I am what I am and that's all that I am ... I'm Poppi the sailor man". "Toot toot". Sorry to all who do not choose to understand what I am trying to say. The Glock scares me. Also I am very sad about the stuff in Paris. Perhaps it is affecting my posts and the way I am writing this. Sorry.

 

A Glock in .22lr would be epic

 

I don't mind Glock. Their high capacity mags are a pretty cool option. I went with a Steyr M9 though, grip angle is absolutely amazing..sights are different, but intuitive