I love to visit Maine in the summer, especially Acadia and Bar Harbor. Always a nice relief from the heat in Texas. But the winters must be completely brutal. That alone would keep me from living there.

But even my short vacation time in Maine confirms some of these observations. For example, I have noticed that there are almost no stores of any kind that are not absolutely necessary. You might see a grocery store here and there, but I do not really recall anything like a Sears or a Walmart. (There are, of course, places that cater to the tourists, like art galleries and such, in tourist rich areas, but tourist areas are never indicative of day-to-day life.)

But state income tax, AND sales tax, AND property tax? In Texas we have no state income tax, so our property taxes are higher than many places. But our sales tax is pretty reasonable. But to have all three is abusive, for sure. I guess that's the "democracy ends when the electorate figures out they can vote themselves money" theory in practice.

There are other Maine residents on the board. Perhaps they shall chime in.

 

But state income tax, AND sales tax, AND property tax? In Texas we have no state income tax, so our property taxes are higher than many places. But our sales tax is pretty reasonable. But to have all three is abusive, for sure. I guess that's the "democracy ends when the electorate figures out they can vote themselves money" theory in practice.

Connecticut has those three taxes too. The property tax on my mom's 3 bedroom house on 1/4 acre is almost $10,000 a year. The state income tax on my paycheck (only about $450 gross) is about $50 a week. Sales tax recently went up to 6.35% from 6%. We also have negative population growth.

There's also an idea being tossed around by the powers that be-- Waterbury, Bridgeport, Hartford, and New Haven (the largest, poorest, and most dangerous cities in the state) are tired of paying the bulk of welfare costs (even though THEIR residents are the ones that use them most) so they're thinking of instituting a *regional* tax on the suburban areas. In essence, they want us suburbanites to foot the bill when Wanda the Welfare Queen in the ghetto two cities over needs more free medicine, housing, and food.

We are leaving. Along with many other families and businesses--small and large.

 

As far as taxes go there's a reason for having so many. It makes the net large enough to catch most everyone. So property taxes get the owners, renters, and customers. Income taxes get a piece of the earners. Sales taxes get the state's share of what you consume.

Revenue is revenue. No matter how it's raised. Taxes, fees, regulatory costs and permits. If you want to reduce those there is really only one way. Reduce spending.

NH isn't a garden paradise. With no sales or income taxes they must generate the bulk of their revenue with real estate taxes and other lesser taxes. They keep expenses pretty much contained at the state level. But. The local property taxes are hefty. The reason is mostly the schools. The state has mandated that school costs be leveled across the state. This means that money from richer communities helps pay for poorer towns school systems. Socialism at its finest. After all it's for the children.

The property taxes on my modest 1700sq/ft house are approaching $7000/yr.

Compare that to my FIL's place in mid coast Maine at under $2000/yr.

You can see there's a huge discrepancy and that's because of the other taxes and revenue streams that would offset.

We like Maine and would probably move there if it were not for the hordes of liberals that have moved in over the last 30 odd years.

NH is suffering a similar fate and the disease seems to be spreading at an alarming rate nationally. I hear the same complaints from others in the west. If you look at a map graded with Lib/Con states. You can see that the east and west coasts are solid Lib. While the heartland remains largely Conservative.

I'm still undecided on what to do when I retire in 5 or 6 years.

 

Trust me I know man I lived in NH for 2 years. So far I wont go back, and I saw the liberal trend moving pretty fast. I do think NH is on a fine border right now and could go either way. Im not sure how the Croyden School decision went. That will show how school costs pan out across NH. Im also wondering if there's any point in moving or just dealing with what we have. If the feds import more people in every state to vote Socialism then whats the point in going anywhere else. Wait for the collapse then re-shape everything afterwards.

Thought of moving to Canada though, at least they have strict borders, less crime and less incarceration.

 

Progressive liberalism is a sickness, and it is very contagious. When you send your kids to a public school, they intentionally try to infect your child with the disease. You must provide massive doses of common sense to your children to counter the disease. Question them often and counter the stupidity that they hear. I have raised 3 children. 2 of the 3 turned out ok, the 3rd is still a work in progress. He just receives too much propaganda from CNN and MSNBC. This once great nation is being destroyed by the liberal sickness that is being spread. It is a more subtle form of a Zombie.

 

Well the financial end of things will have a bigg effect on the final decision but it won't be the only factor. Weather, climate, lifestyle stuff are concerns for us. My wife is 7years older. She'll have to sign off on any major decisions.
I've really never spent any time outside of New England so I would be reluctant to move wholesale to say Nebraska or Texas.
My older sister moved to Florida but they are renting a house to see how they like it before committing to staying. Vero Beach area. We'll see what's what after this storm.

 

No I didn't. CT has been working towards putting the tolls back up on our section of 95 for a while though, but I didn't hear anything about truck tolls. These people are truly insane.

Not to mention Malloy's (our governor) eagerness to allow as many Syrian refugees into our state as possible. They're actually trying to build low-income housing units (aka projects) right next to my job exclusively for the Syrians. My town WAS a really nice place to live...there goes the neighborhood. LOL.

 

The good news is that real estate is super cheap.

We like to vacation in Maine in the winter. It's great for snowshoeing, x country skiing, snowmobiling, etc. Tons of snow and super cheap. Just stay away from the coast.

Az

 

Sorry- didn't want to derail the thread.

Maine always struck me as a weird area. Back when, the majority of it was woods and owned by, I think, Paper Companies. Most of the population back when I went there was consolidated to a fairly small area in the state.

I admit my understanding of Maine is very narrow. Growing up, we went to Moosehead Lake for years every June for vacation. I loved that area. Then the fish died out and we stopped going. But as a young lad, I thought I was in the middle of the woods and had a great time there. I wandered around for miles and never saw another person. I enjoyed it a lot. That was when I was about 9 to 13 yos.

More recently, I went to Bar Harbor and three times to Freeport (my wife is an LL Bean fan). Had nice visits but never really looked around much past our destinations.

I never considered Maine as a retirement home- it's too cold and I hate the cold. I had heard the lumber/paper jobs died out years ago and there were massive amounts of people on welfare.

I honestly don't know if things have turned around up there.

 

Maine. Freezing cold and poor employment. 35% of its states revenue come from the federal government.
Maine is one of the ten top states receiving federal money. We all pay for Maine.
Not fit for anything other than a visit for some lobster.

 

I havn't lived in Maine a very long time

Welcome to Maine.

... Nobody wants to live in Maine. That's the thing, in fact not only does nobody want to live in Maine but in 2013 Maine had NEGATIVE population growth.

Young adults leave Maine, while retirees move to Maine.

Most years these two migrations are about even.

... I live 10 minutes away from the NH border. There's no Sales or Income tax in NH.

Low income households do not pay income taxes in Maine, which is part of why it is attractive to retirees with pensions.

... The land rules and regulations are pretty strict and you can't do much with your land for business anyhow.

Most of Maine [52%] is controlled by LUPC. It is NOT strictly regulated at all.

If you live in a town where things are tightly controlled, I suspect that you live in an organized city. Those 'tight' controls are written by your town councilmen. Don't blame the state for what your town does.

... We have ballot initiatives here, so every 2 years out of state groups come here and pump a ton of money to get %0.5 of the population to sign petitions to get questions on the election. All I've seen in the past few years in straight liberal spending, taxes and regulations. Let's review this years questions which made the ballot ...

# 1 - Regulate and Tax Marijuana: Okay hooray liberals you can own weed in Portland. More Taxes and Regulations, this is not a good thing. Only legalizing without taxing and regulating is a good thing, because this isnt going to negate current taxes.

# 2 - 3% tax over $200,000 - So the rest of the businesses and wealth will leave.

# 3 - Increase background checks on gun sales - Private sales wont exist anymore if this makes it

# 4 - Increase minimum wage to $12 / hr - Great idea, tax the wealthy business owners AND increase their cost of employment

# 5 - Rank-Choiced Voting - The only question I might vote for just to see what the hell happens.

# 6 - $100 million in bonds for transportation - Yes, please help people up north get out of the state easier.

And guess what, repealing Sales Tax didn;t make it on the ballot !

It is like this every ballot. Usually the ballots are loaded with bonds to raise higher taxes.

.. So the positives are, basically, there's pretty much no gun laws and the lowest crime in the country. That's about it. Thanks to the most retarded public population the spending will probably sky rocket, nobody is going to be here to work and pay for it and the little freedoms we have will go away.

Cheap land, we paid $350/acre and $900/acre for our forest parcels. Another poster on this forum bought land next to mine this spring, he paid $600/acre.

Low property taxes, we pay $1.05/acre for our land, which includes 1/4 mile of river frontage.

Low COL. The average household income is low $20ks.

Most of Maine has never had drought. This year there was a little bit one down along the Southern end of the state. I live in The Southern half of Maine, but even here there was no drought.

As you stated, good gun laws and low crime.

 

Most of Maine [52%] is controlled by LUPC. It is NOT strictly regulated at all.

If you live in a town where things are tightly controlled, I suspect that you live in an organized city. Those 'tight' controls are written by your town councilmen. Don't blame the state for what your town does.



Cheap land, we paid $350/acre and $900/acre for our forest parcels. Another poster on this forum bought land next to mine this spring, he paid $600/acre.

Low property taxes, we pay $1.05/acre for our land, which includes 1/4 mile of river frontage.

Low COL. The average household income is low $20ks.

Most of Maine has never had drought. This year there was a little bit one down along the Southern end of the state. I live in The Southern half of Maine, but even here there was no drought.

As you stated, good gun laws and low crime.

I like Maine for right now. Im staying for right now.

Maine ranks one of the worst on the Freedom Index by the CATO institute, it's at 42 out of 50. Personal Freedom is high but economic is very low ...

http://www.freedominthe50states.org/

"Maine is one of the most regulated states for land use in the country. Indeed, we show that exclusionary zoning leaped upward in Maine between 2000 and 2006 and has risen further since then. "

"Maine is the most free-spending state on public welfare in the country, going even beyond Alaska and Vermont, and it also spends more than average on housing and community development."

MA is moving up towards Portland, Im worried more liberals are going to just vote away all the good aspects of Maine. You're safe in the woods until the Liberals are allowed to vote your land away by preserving the areas outside the Seacoast and forcing you to sell. Agenda 21.

Like I said Im gonna stay, I'd like to see areas north that arnt welfare trailer trash because thats all I saw over the NH border up north. Where would someone reccomend in the backwoods of Maine that has a few good folks ?

I see since 2000 Washington County has had a big decrease in population. Why is that ? I'm still not understanding why if Maine is such a great place to live everyone is leaving ? Why not go to a place like Utah or Idaho, where people are moving, land is wide open and has good freedoms ? I'm not convinced Maine wont turn into a very liberal state in the next 10 years. I mean Rank-Based voting is probably going to pass, and then there will def. be either a Democratic or Liberal-Independant Governor within the next 4 years. Considering LePaige barely won the last election, Rank-Based voting would knock any Republican Governor out permanently.

 

Don't come to Maryland! Too close to DC, too many liberals. They tax the hell out of everything; 6% sales tax, property tax, income tax, hell they even taxed the rain (not kidding google Maryland Rain Tax). And want to carry a gun for protection? forget about it, only cops and politicians get guns.

But if you don't want to work this is the place to be. All kinds of free programs so you can live for free in comfort, play on the internet, watch TV and smoke dope.

I don't know where to go. Any suggestions?

 

I always enjoyed going to Maine, but, yes, bringing in Somalis will destroy a nice area.

 

You live in the wrong part of Maine. Portland and points south should have stayed with MA in 1820.

I don't expect the prohibition on FTF transfers to pass. Not in the state that just passed constitutional carry.

 

I have a brother that left Texas for Bar Harbor 15 or so years ago. He's disabled. Has been in a place with enough support in various ways to live without being homeless, and a decent life to be honest. I won't go into detail about the disability.

I can see this being a huge problem. I love my brother but I also understand the burden. And if any percentage of welfare was so easy for someone that just moved in state, yikes

 

One thing I wanted to point out about NH is there is a libertarian initiative to get people to move to the state now that enough people have pledged to move and could actually give the right a foothold in the northeast.

 

Why New Hampshire? I don't want to move further North. What about Delaware instead?

 

Well, I flat-out refused to retire to Maine, despite heavy lobbying from my daughter and her hubby, who have settled into a Portland Subbub. Back land may be cheap, but it's cold and snowy in the winter and hot and buggy in summer. Black flies give way to deer flies, with a deep stratum of mosquitoes the whole time. How do I know? I'm a born and bred swamp Yankee who had family in Maine (Yarmouth and Poland), with whom I was made to "summer" from about age 8. Loved the sailing, got far too little of it, hated the bugs. But at least native Mainiacs (yes, that what they called themselves in the '50s), were practical, hardworking people. Now Portland is becoming San Fran Freako East. Gay this, gay that, fern bars and "art" museums everywhere. Only serious people left work at the shipyard. Fishing fleet is almost gone. Maine lobsters? They likely came from Narragansett Bay. Yes I still go there for a few days every other year. Try to stay away from Freeport, so I won't have to look at what L.L.Bean's has become. Lewiston is fast becoming Mogadishu from what I hear. Only plus I can find about Maine now is that it has become a Consitutional Carry state.

I would not say that Maine is destroying itself. It's being destroyed by an invasion from Boston and New York, (and Somalia).

I refer to myself to people I live with now as a refugee from New England. I'm an old man now, and I hate what my country is becoming.

[/rant]

 

@240Geezer

If you would like to retire where the land is a lot like New England, try the Ohio River valley. Where I am in S.E. Ohio constantly reminds me of what N.H. and Vermont were 50 years ago. Lot of small farmers still making a living.

The Ohio River itself is an industrial corridor, so you want to get about ten or fifteen miles back from the river. West Virginia, Ohio, Indiana and Kentucky are all bordering states. I kinda wish I'd researched Indiana more, but Ohio is OK. Only big gripe I've got is that it's often a long way to a doctor. And I kinda wish I weren't on top of the Marcellus Shale. Gas drilling and pipelines everywhere, but it's not enough to make me move. Downriver from Marietta there's none of that.

 

What do you expect from a state that allows felons to vote while IN PRISON?

 

Just like Vermont getting convicted does not remove your rights as a citizen.

 

New Hampshire was initially picked for what was called the 'Free state project' in 2001 I think.
The goal being to initiate the movement of 20,000 libertarians to one of the low populated states.
I love NH but always thought that the selection was flawed and the state that finished in second place in the voting, Wyoming, was a better choice. My reason, of course, was the Boston metro area which had already begun the invasion and I saw no end to it.

 

I think Maine's biggest problem is that wacko in the Governor's mansion.

Not that you asked. :

 

He vetoes every legislature attempt to raise taxes.

Every bond to raise taxes that the electorate passes, he refuses to 'issue'.

He has lowered state taxes. In some cases, some towns have had to raise their town taxes to compensate for lost state revenue. But not all towns. Towns that have heavily relied on state grants to operate have been the towns that have been 'hurt' by the lower taxes.

My property taxes have dropped. Property taxes in most of the state have dropped.

He is a total boob whenever he gets in front of a camera. He can not manage to speak into a microphone without saying something stupid. He is always insulting someone or cussing, or being an idiot.

We keep re-electing him though.

 

At the very least Maine should thank N.H. for slowing down the influx of Mass. expatriates.
Should you feel compelled to tithe, I live in Grafton N.H., not too hard to find.

 

Totally unrelated and unimportant. My (I don't know how many greats) grandfather was Joseph R Bodwell, 40th governor of Maine. My grandma actually looks like him, it's bizarre .

 

I still can't get past the winters. Same reason I haven't looked at ID or Montana. But you bring up a lot of good points on why it's nice up there.

Figure I make 55K a year in pensions and are about ready to start claiming SS which should give me another 12 to 18K or so. What will my taxes be? 15% is high, I think on top of the other taxes and the fed.

 

Military pensions are now exempt.

The 15% talked about previously is the Federal tax bracket. Maine does not have any 15% tax bracket.

The highest tax bracket Maine has is 6.75%

But it depends a lot on what other deductions you have.

I have never paid Maine Income Taxes as I am a farmer and I have always had plenty of write-offs. Now that military pensions have became exempt, I no longer need to use any write-offs for state tax.

 

CT just exempted military pensions also. Just about the time I'm leaving.

I do like the land prices and property taxes you have been saying though. If I can hide inside for the winter- long up there last I knew, I may have to reconsider my plans. I remember as a kid jumping off the dock into Moosehead lake to swim in June and July, that water was still cold as heck though.

But you are starting to make me rethink where to go. :thumb:

 

I am not sure where the water comes from going into Moosehead Lake. I drove around the lake once, and of course across it. I assume it stays cold because it is so large and deep.

Where I am, there are a lot of peat bogs and fens. Water is shallow and moves slowly, so I think it gets warmer before feeding into our river.

 

I love fridgid cold places just because nobody else wants to or knows how to live in the climate.

Really, mid $5,000 range for 100 - 200 acres of land ?

 

Add a zero. It's about $300/acre. I got 125 acres for $49,900, and the seller financed 85% over 15 years, though I'll have it paid in 5.

 

If I had wanted a high pay job after I retired I could have gone other places seeking such.

I came here because, I wanted a place where I could support a family on my pension. Where I could buy a lot of land, build a house, grow crops and raise livestock. Where droughts are not common, etc. I see bear, moose, dear and turkey on my land. I often see eagle flying right over my house. Here I am among people who produce their own food, fuel and fiber.

If SHTF 99.95% of our nation's population will be screwed.

If SHTF I plan to continue to grow crops, raise livestock, and enjoy the eagles flying overhead.