Survivalist Forum banner

Is the Nation Debt "YOUR" debt or theirs

  • Yes, it's my debt too

    Votes: 8 8.9%
  • NO, I didn't sign up for this mismanagement and incompetence

    Votes: 82 91%
21 - 40 of 42 Posts
I have to admit I feel a little offended when I hear people tell me "MY" personal share of the Governments debt, some 13.2 Trillion dollars.

IIRC, it something like 41K per tax payer.
You're a little behind on your bills. Your personal share of the debt is $180,058 and your family's share is $688,247! Well, that's not really true, because that debt is for every CITIZEN, not every taxpayer. The TENS OF MILLIONS OF LAZY DEADBEATS in this country don't have a share of the debt. Worse yet, you not only owe your share of the debt, you owe their share of the debt AND YOU ARE SUPPORTING EVERYTHING THOSE DEADBEATS DO - from free food to free healthcare to free housing to free cellphones - YOU OWE IT ALL!

This debt isn't going to be repaid with dollars, it's going to be repaid with blood. Millions (if not billions) will have to die to pay for the out of control debt - it happens EVERY TIME socialist/marxists/communists/progressives take control. What was the result of communists taking over China? MILLIONS DIED! What was the result of socialists taking over the Soviet Union? MILLIONS DIED! What was the result of the Great Depression? MILLIONS DIED (in WWII). That is the price to be paid for our stupidity.
 
Feeling "differently" is not a legal defense :)
The Gov's debt is your debt my friend, it's your life, leveraged. Its the only debt you can have that you didn't agree to or approve of, but it is for sure yours and YOU will be held accountable.
Theoretically this is true, but realistically it is not. You have options and ways to avoid being responsible for their debt.

You could leave the country and renounce your citizenship (and assume the debt of where you move to, hopefully much lower). Or you could take up activities that avoid (or minimizing) the amount of taxes you pay....lower your income, grow your own food, use solar/wind for power, etc.

In fact, other than property taxes (which are not federal anyway), if you own your own land and are completely self sufficient, I don't see you paying for any of the federal deficit under the current system. The system could change of course, but then we are really getting onto hypothetical turf.
 
You're a little behind on your bills. Your personal share of the debt is $180,058 and your family's share is $688,247! Well, that's not really true, because that debt is for every CITIZEN, not every taxpayer. The TENS OF MILLIONS OF LAZY DEADBEATS in this country don't have a share of the debt. Worse yet, you not only owe your share of the debt, you owe their share of the debt AND YOU ARE SUPPORTING EVERYTHING THOSE DEADBEATS DO - from free food to free healthcare to free housing to free cellphones - YOU OWE IT ALL!
What American Citizens receive in the form of welfare is NOTHING compared to what the U.S. Government provides to corporations in the form of welfare and what the U.S. Government gives to other countries, even our enemies, in the form of foreign aid.

Where would those "tens of millions of lazy deadbeats" even get a job anymore if they wanted to, eh? What has not been outsourced overseas to slave labor is handled by illegal alien slave labor here. Where are the jobs? They don't exist. We have no manufacturing base any longer and those jobs were sent overseas thanks to the willing accomplices in the republican party, the very same people that you are parroting.

The sooner everyone gets it through their head, the better off we will be.

The Government cares more about someone in Iraq or Afghanistan than they do you, very simple. They get absolutely excellent healthcare from the Special Forces Medic or Navy Corpsman up to and including being MedEvac'd to U.S. Military Hospitals. We pay terrorists not to be terrorists, too. How do you like that?

You need an enema.
 
Maybe I'm confused here - the majority of posts reflect YES - we are responsible for the debt being brought on for the Country.

-- However, the votes lean heavily to NO- we are not responsible


-- ?
As I said up above, most people think it's a crock but they don't want to talk about it or get flamed because they don't believe they are responsible for the debt. A lot of people are voting but not posting, what is so hard to understand?
 
Feeling "differently" is not a legal defense :)
The Gov's debt is your debt my friend, it's your life, leveraged. Its the only debt you can have that you didn't agree to or approve of, but it is for sure yours and YOU will be held accountable.
Thats not completly true. Some of us have already made more money then we can spend in this lifetime. So thats why we decided that we are just gona shut down our bussiness and enjoy our money before they can spend it for us. Its already been taxed so we will just enjoy and then they can choke on the taxes they would of got from us and our employees. Let them figure that into there scams.
 
Thats not completly true. Some of us have already made more money then we can spend in this lifetime. So thats why we decided that we are just gona shut down our bussiness and enjoy our money before they can spend it for us. Its already been taxed so we will just enjoy and then they can choke on the taxes they would of got from us and our employees. Let them figure that into there scams.
My thoughts exactly. Ever read "Atlas Shrugged".

When the productive people finally get their belly full they can simply convert their wealth into non taxable tangible wealth and retire. They can then let the whole corrupt system burn down and rebuild a new society from the ashes.

Sorry if this sounds cold hearted, but what the socialist are trying to turn us into dairy cows to be tied up and milked.
 
Where would those "tens of millions of lazy deadbeats" even get a job anymore if they wanted to, eh? What has not been outsourced overseas to slave labor is handled by illegal alien slave labor here. Where are the jobs? They don't exist. We have no manufacturing base any longer and those jobs were sent overseas thanks to the willing accomplices in the republican party, the very same people that you are parroting.
Well, obviously, the government is directly responsible for our jobs going overseas. Their over-taxation and over-regulation of business in the USA has caused those jobs to leave. So, to get the jobs back, the socialists need to lower taxes, lower regulation, and get rid of the minimum wage. Let the market determine wages and allow our companies to compete with other countries on taxation and regulation. We also need to cut off all the entitlements so that people have an incentive to work instead of sitting home all day in their Section 8 house watching Judge Judy on their big screen tv and waiting for their welfare or SSDI check!

You need an enema.
The USA definitely needs an enema in the form of deporting all the socialists and stopping all the entitlements. It's time to TAKE OUR COUNTRY BACK!
 
No debt of the US Government is mine, though I currently pay taxes.

Section 4 of the 14th Amendment, the Red Amendment, prohibits questioning any debt incurred by the US Government AND prohibits anybody paying any of it off.

Section 4. The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned. But neither the United States nor any State shall assume or pay any debt or obligation incurred in aid of insurrection or rebellion against the United States, or any claim for the loss or emancipation of any slave; but all such debts, obligations and claims shall be held illegal and void.

And, No, this has never been held strictly to mean the debts of the civil war. It include EVERY debt since...they only pay the interest!
 
I have to admit I feel a little offended when I hear people tell me "MY" personal share of the Governments debt, some 13.2 Trillion dollars.

IIRC, it something like 41K per tax payer. I don't know if that includes the unfunded mandates 120 plus Trillion.

Legally, they may view me as a responsible party but I feel differently.
Sooo, let me see if I understand this. Every dollar the private banking cartel known as the "Federal Reserve" makes is actually a dollar of debt for me, my forebears and my descendants. To make this even better the Federal Government spends in a manner that no self respecting drunken sailor would ever even consider; creating more debt than the world has ever seen in its entire recorded history. And now I am supposed to sign on and ditto for my children and generations yet unborn to pay this off?

WTF!

This cannot be paid off. It was intended to be impossible to pay off. The last thing the company store wants is for its slaves/debtors to be able to pay them off and tell them to go to hell.

This is slavery of the banks plain and simple. It was what Jefferson and Jackson warned about. It is here today folks. Time to hit the reset button because sooner or later someone will and every day we wait only makes it worse.

Do you really think that our children are going to pay this? If you do or if you believe that we as a nation should; then I have a deal for you. Ocean front property in Arizona, going cheap, please no checks, just small bills in non-sequential order. If you act quickly I will throw in a wonderful bridge in Brooklyn NY.

I agree OhioMan, it is time to tell TPTB to F-off. This undesirable is not getting in the cattle car nor signing on the dotted line.
 
The working/middle-class are struggling, but the rich didn't pay their fair share -- even though they run the US Govt. It's their debt.

Some of you might call them socialists, I'll call them the private elite that attend the Ivy League and spend money that isn't theirs. In doing so, they enrich the pocketbooks of friends and those who got them selected to office. If cronyism = socialism to you guys, I guess I'm fine with that even though you've got your terminology messed up.
 
My thoughts exactly. Ever read "Atlas Shrugged".

When the productive people finally get their belly full they can simply convert their wealth into non taxable tangible wealth and retire. They can then let the whole corrupt system burn down and rebuild a new society from the ashes.
Since you enjoyed that fairy tale so much, perhaps you would also be interested in, The Night Before Christmas and other cool stuff...Tooth Fairy, Easter Bunny, etc.

People who want to make a load of money will always step forward to take the place of the people who throw a temper tantrum.

Now, I do believe the tax burden sucks for those who end up paying it, but the stuff Rand spoke of is just stupid. If there ever was a "Galt's Gulch," rest assured, other people would step forward to take their place, to make the money they turned their nose up at.

Sorry if this sounds cold hearted, but what the socialist are trying to turn us into dairy cows to be tied up and milked.
So are authoritarian conservatives and libertarians at times.

Well, obviously, the government is directly responsible for our jobs going overseas. Their over-taxation and over-regulation of business in the USA has caused those jobs to leave.
That's the refrain but that doesn't make it so. We could take away the over-regulation and kill a lot of workers, screw them out of workman's compensation and a host of other things and cut the taxes incredibly low and they would still stay overseas because they have a taste of that sweet thing called "slave labor."

They are never coming back unless you give them the choice, "Come back or be banished from the United States forever."

That's what should be done.

So, to get the jobs back, the socialists need to lower taxes, lower regulation, and get rid of the minimum wage.
Let's bring back child labor, too. And let's block fire exits and/or chain them shut so the slaves can't leave the floor, too. Let's not care what a company dumps in that local stream, pond, creek or lake. Let's not care what happens, business will take care of itself, business will always do what is in its best interest and that of the surrounding community, you know, just like is happening now in the Gulf of Mexico! The TransOcean Rig was apparently manufactured in The Marshall Islands, not up to our standards...multi-billion dollar corporations saving cents compared to the destruction they unleash. No sir, we have had enough of that.

Minimum wage?

What planet are you on?

Let the market determine wages and allow our companies to compete with other countries on taxation and regulation.
Oh no, we already played that game buddy! The labor market decided that they didn't want to work at nasty jobs for little pay under bad conditions and the employers BROKE THE LAW and IMPORTED SLAVES in the form of ILLEGAL ALIENS. YOUR WAY DOESN'T WORK! The market did decide, the wages should have went up, but they did not and the wonderful wealthy BROKE THE LAW and they should be imprisoned for doing so and damaging their country.

There are no "jobs Americans won't do." There are wages they won't work for and conditions they won't work under.

The market decided, finally, and then the market was screwed.

We also need to cut off all the entitlements so that people have an incentive to work instead of sitting home all day in their Section 8 house watching Judge Judy on their big screen tv and waiting for their welfare or SSDI check!
Yeah, let's give it all to the multi-million and multi-billion dollar corporations, they need it more!

The USA definitely needs an enema in the form of deporting all the socialists and stopping all the entitlements. It's time to TAKE OUR COUNTRY BACK!
If everything you cited is your idea of taking the country back, you would just be taking it back for wealthy people and enslaving your fellow Citizens, I'm sorry, I would rather this country fall and perish and vanish from the face of the planet forever if that would be the case.

Sooo, let me see if I understand this. Every dollar the private banking cartel known as the "Federal Reserve" makes is actually a dollar of debt for me, my forebears and my descendants. To make this even better the Federal Government spends in a manner that no self respecting drunken sailor would ever even consider; creating more debt than the world has ever seen in its entire recorded history. And now I am supposed to sign on and ditto for my children and generations yet unborn to pay this off?

WTF!
Yeah, that about sums it up.

This cannot be paid off. It was intended to be impossible to pay off. The last thing the company store wants is for its slaves/debtors to be able to pay them off and tell them to go to hell.

This is slavery of the banks plain and simple. It was what Jefferson and Jackson warned about. It is here today folks. Time to hit the reset button because sooner or later someone will and every day we wait only makes it worse.
But right in this very forum about three months ago, I said the very same thing about credit card companies purposely designing schemes to trap people in a debt cycle and the response was, "You signed the contract." So, I guess they feel the same about this, "They popped out of the vagina here in this country," same as signing the contract.

The working/middle-class are struggling, but the rich didn't pay their fair share -- even though they run the US Govt. It's their debt.
They never pay their fair share.

Some of you might call them socialists, I'll call them the private elite that attend the Ivy League and spend money that isn't theirs. In doing so, they enrich the pocketbooks of friends and those who got them selected to office. If cronyism = socialism to you guys, I guess I'm fine with that even though you've got your terminology messed up.
Some of the people in this thread envision a United States that I would not want to live in. They won't get it, though. The People are on to them as they are on to the rest of the scams. That "Patriot" up there, he's just another looter griping about the little people who receive NOTHING compared to what corporations and foreign governments receive.
 
Discussion starter · #36 ·
The working/middle-class are struggling, but the rich didn't pay their fair share -- even though they run the US Govt. It's their debt.

Some of you might call them socialists, I'll call them the private elite that attend the Ivy League and spend money that isn't theirs. In doing so, they enrich the pocketbooks of friends and those who got them selected to office. If cronyism = socialism to you guys, I guess I'm fine with that even though you've got your terminology messed up.
Ivy league.... like Barack Obama?

The political tilt on any Ivy league campuses is decidedly to the left. I agree they are the 'private elite" and they are running the country.

You say the rich don't pay their fair share: So why do the top 10% of wage earner pay 71% of the taxes?

http://www.ntu.org/tax-basics/who-pays-income-taxes.html

Sounds like to me the evil rich pay plenty!
 
I'd like to say that there is no way that they'll make me pay, but they have a way I can do nothing about.

The post above about deadbeat taxpayers is irrelevant. EVERYONE will pay. Here is how.

They are going to monetize the debt. They are going to PRINT $13,000,000,000,000 and use it to pay the debt. How will that make me pay? A loaf of bread will be $150. A gallon of gas will be $500. That is how they will spread the debt onto all of us with no recourse. History repeats itself. Weimar Republic anyone? Once the politicians figure out that they can spend money THEY print, it will be a few years before fascism, possibly communist fascism, grabs our nation. We, the citizens, will have to rise up to stop it. Are we built of the same stock as our ancestors? Time will soon tell.

Get ready for the ride, and STOCK UP NOW. Even if we find a miracle out, it will still be a very painful ride.
 
There's that left/right diversion again. What's left or right about attending one of the most expensive schools in the nation, a plaything for the landed gentry? Try rich vs. poor, powerful vs. powerless. You won't find many 60's-style peaceniks at Harvard or Yale. But you'll find plenty of sons and daughters of the West's elite there.

Are you wealthy yourself? For me, wealthy would be $10 million or more in assets. Since I'm not a member of that class, there's no sane reason for me to defend that level of wealth, control of resources, or the fact that a statistical minority controls the majority of the planet's resources.

If you lived in feudal times (other than our own) would you be defending Genghis Khan? Or would you be railing against the poor working slobs who say it's unfair that so few control so much?

Next question, what is the ultimate justification that so few control so much? The answer, then as now: whoever controls the army can justify his wealth. It's no more or less than that.

Ivy league.... like Barack Obama?

The political tilt on any Ivy league campuses is decidedly to the left. I agree they are the 'private elite" and they are running the country.

You say the rich don't pay their fair share: So why do the top 10% of wage earner pay 71% of the taxes?

http://www.ntu.org/tax-basics/who-pays-income-taxes.html

Sounds like to me the evil rich pay plenty!
 
That "Patriot" up there, he's just another looter griping about the little people who receive NOTHING compared to what corporations and foreign governments receive
.

NOTHING is exactly what the lazy deadbeats in this country SHOULD RECEIVE! In addition, I'm 100% against corporations and foreign governments getting handouts from the taypayer too. Government's job isn't to take my money and give it to the ubber rich or the lazy deadbeats. Government's job is to follow the constitution and beyond that - GET THE HE** OUT OF MY WAY AND MY LIFE! Freedom is what we need, not the government posing as our mother and father!

If you feel "entitled" - I feel sorry for you.
 
21 - 40 of 42 Posts