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Discussion Starter #1
I have no idea how unique or plain this thought is, but here it goes: Could it be that a robber would have a higher chance of survival if you, the victim is armed, assuming you have extensive self-defense and/or martial arts training?

Armed victim: The robber makes his attempt to rob you, with knife, gun, or otherwise, you sidestep and draw on him. Now, he has a chance here to both give up or run away, both of which result in him surviving. There's also the stat I've heard thrown around that only 1/25-30 times a defensive gun is drawn results in the victim firing a shot.

Unarmed, but trained victim: Robber makes his attempt to rob you, you counter by grabbing his whole arm, taking the weapon, while simultaneously breaking his wrist, arm, and dislocating his elbow and/or shoulder. You, now having his weapon, can turn it on him or let him survive in his battered state.

Here's my point and what I'd like comments on... if you were a victim trained in martial arts or other self-defense, but were carrying and were robbed, wouldn't you draw on him first (assuming the unrealistic scenario for pure conversation's sake that you considered both drawing down and going for his weapon to be viable options)? If so, then like I described earlier, the perpetrator has a higher likelihood of getting out of the encounter uninjured and alive, but if you only had the option of going for his weapon, he's certainly to get hurt, badly.

It should go without saying that we're not a bunch of Bruce Lees or anything, but even a little training can go a long way, and in any robbery there is no option that ensures your safety, even passive compliance with the robber, as that still frequently ends with you getting hit...

I figured this would apply to the urban survival forum due to this type of issue being much more pertinent in the cities... like DC, which I'm close to.
 

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Unarmed, but trained victim: Robber makes his attempt to rob you, you counter by grabbing his whole arm, taking the weapon, while simultaneously breaking his wrist, arm, and dislocating his elbow and/or shoulder. You, now having his weapon, can turn it on him or let him survive in his battered state.
Unless the criminal is ALSO trained, in which case, you are badly hurt, if not dead.

Or we get to play the romantic battle of the combat styles, as each man searches for a weakness in his opponent's guard, assesses the balance, speed and ability of the other, probes for holes in the defense, while trying not to expose himself needlessly...:rolleyes:

Seriously...weapon wins NEARLY every time.

You've heard the old saw, never bring a knife to a gunfight?

Same thing applies to a knife hand strike or nifty grappling technique.:thumb:
 

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Discussion Starter #7
If you draw your CCW gun, shoot and stop the threat.

The BS about holding the perp till the police arrive is going to get you killed. What has the perp got to loose then, your going to be hamburger.
Agreed. Especially in an urban environment.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Unless the criminal is ALSO trained, in which case, you are badly hurt, if not dead.

Or we get to play the romantic battle of the combat styles, as each man searches for a weakness in his opponent's guard, assesses the balance, speed and ability of the other, probes for holes in the defense, while trying not to expose himself needlessly...:rolleyes:

Seriously...weapon wins NEARLY every time.

You've heard the old saw, never bring a knife to a gunfight?

Same thing applies to a knife hand strike or nifty grappling technique.:thumb:
Odds of some thug from the SE DC projects being trained? Just about zero.

Not necessarily... you can immobilize an arm holding a gun in your face MUCH faster than he can decide to shoot and pull the trigger. I'd feel far worse with a knife held to me or a gun pointed at me from 10'-or-so away as my options are much more limited.
 

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I often have a disposable wallet and an old cell phone with no sim card or battery to hand over and i train a lot in SD CCW classes with my EDC.

One thing is almost every time true, the perp knows when and where he or she will attack you.

In a SHTF situation, after initial outages of power and supplies are evaporating, no one will want your cell or wallet, but your food, weapons, fuel and any script drugs you have and your life will be very cheap. Perp will snipe you and pick over your dead body.
 

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Why get your hands dirty......


I carry, rest assured, I will either have him at gunpoint or he ain't gonna be happy
 

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Odds of some thug from the SE DC projects being trained? Just about zero.

Not necessarily... you can immobilize an arm holding a gun in your face MUCH faster than he can decide to shoot and pull the trigger.
Hope you never have to prove that.:thumb:
 

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In your case, much would depend on whether you're in Maryland or Virginia. Checking out the laws would be a good thing. I'm in Texas so if I were threatened I could just shoot but you need to know how much legal aggravation it would be for you in your state in order to make the best decision for you.
 

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If you draw your CCW gun, shoot and stop the threat.

The BS about holding the perp till the police arrive is going to get you killed. What has the perp got to loose then, your going to be hamburger.
Also you don't know if the robber is alone.. or not. Shoot first, get rid of the body later.
 

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Here's my point and what I'd like comments on... if you were a victim trained in martial arts or other self-defense, but were carrying and were robbed, wouldn't you draw on him first (assuming the unrealistic scenario for pure conversation's sake that you considered both drawing down and going for his weapon to be viable options)?
Anyone who has the type of training to defend themselves as you describe, also knows that there is ALWAYS injury in a true fight. I always follow RUF guidelines, I will meet my attacker with equal or greater force.
 

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Unless you are a Gurkha, do not intentionally bring a knife to a gunfight.





There can be legal issues to pointing a gun at a person. Prosecutors in some states have successfully argued that pointing a gun at someone and not shooting is essentially a crime. You must fear for your life to use deadly force, which includes pointing a gun at someone. Obviously you must not have feared for your life because you didn't shoot...

Ask local attorneys about this, and think about it for yourself. "The Law" is not nearly as cut and dried as it is often presented. If you righteously shoot someone you can still end up going through legal hell and get sued to the poorhouse in civil court even if you win in a criminal court. If you illegally point a gun at someone and that person doesn't call the police, or the police don't arrest you, or the prosecutors don't care, then in hind sight it would have been foolish to shoot them even legally.

Before you go into a dangerous area, ask yourself a few questions:
What race/ political persuasion will the arresting officers likely be?
How about the prosecutor? Judge? Jury?


"In 2009 he [Brian Aitken] was arrested and later imprisoned for possession of handguns legally purchased in Colorado and transported in New Jersey from one residence to another. His case has become a battleground for gun control advocates and opponents alike after he was sentenced to seven years in prison."

"During the jury instructions, Judge Morley did not charge the jury with the exemptions to the New Jersey law despite arguments by the defense that Aitken met one of the exemptions and was therefore innocent of the charges. The jury returned three times requesting to be made aware of the laws that provide exemptions for lawful possession; however, all three requests were denied by the judge."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Aitken
 
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