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Will people / gangs assault you for the groceries in the parking lot?

Will they hijack your car for food and get the gas as a bonus?

Will gangs descend on food stores to clean them out instead of stealing worthless purses?

Will there be diesel to power the trucks to even deliver food...or grow it?

Lots of questions to answer in a SHTF world. At the very least, maybe a team of two armed persons would have to food shop. One to load the car and one as a lookout.
 

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The SHTF is just starting….and in some places you may not even be safe when grocery shopping.

We just got home late yesterday evening from our semi-annual trip to the “big-city” (over 100K people) which has a Costco and a Sam’s. While it is certainly very a safe city as compared to most other areas in the US, we were on alert when going to our vehicle to put our purchase into the vehicle.

While the likelihood of us having an issue was near zero…..most bad things happen to those that are oblivious to their surrounds/situation! By now, everyone should have elevated their awareness level to at least a high “Yellow Zone” awareness! memtb
 

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Will people / gangs assault you for the groceries in the parking lot?

Will they hijack your car for food and get the gas as a bonus?

Will gangs descend on food stores to clean them out instead of stealing worthless purses?

Will there be diesel to power the trucks to even deliver food...or grow it?

Lots of questions to answer in a SHTF world. At the very least, maybe a team of two armed persons would have to food shop. One to load the car and one as a lookout.
That would be different from now, how?
Lol!
I think once you see LE disappear, something else will fill the void. People hate chaos.
So, if there are stores, they will be armed to keep thieves out. Like minded people will form "brute squads" for better or worse.
 

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This really depends on what your perception of SHTF is?
Realistically you may want to consider what happens in Third World countries where SHTF has already happened from a perspective of someone looking out from a First World country.

So what really happens in place like Africa for example?

Criminal gangs operate freely in cities and towns and largely control the flow of goods and services coming and going into those spaces. Even they are not stupid enough to horde all the food.

Smaller marketplaces exist with highly inflated prices controlled by these gangs......basically you should look at this like a marketplace tax.

Certainly criminal gangs will operate outside of this structure making transporting and storing your own items risky. There will be carjackings and home invasions.

Roadblocks paying tolls to the local warlords will become somewhat of a norm. But in the absence of a true governmental structure other types of order will be established.

Certainly the US has a long way to fall to get to this level......and a lot of this will really hinge on preservation of our 2A rights. Loose that and we're really not that far off.

We already see criminal gangs operating in our cities without restriction. If you haven't noticed the amount of motorcycle and bicycle gangs starting to operate in those cities you should take notice as this is the precursor to what you are really talking about and what you see in Third World countries.

HK
 

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This really depends on what your perception of SHTF is?
Yep, for some people SHTF can mean unexpected job loss, loss of a spouse or child, or a 2 week power outage after an ice storm.

For others, it can mean a slow economic collapse/Great Depression Part II

For still others, nothing less than thermonuclear war with EMP taking out the grid of all of North America and Europe qualifies.
 

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Will people / gangs assault you for the groceries in the parking lot?

Will they hijack your car for food and get the gas as a bonus?

Will gangs descend on food stores to clean them out instead of stealing worthless purses?

Will there be diesel to power the trucks to even deliver food...or grow it?

Lots of questions to answer in a SHTF world. At the very least, maybe a team of two armed persons would have to food shop. One to load the car and one as a lookout.
Have family and friends all shop at once same day, strength in numbers... Quell hostiles repel boarders.
 

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Will people / gangs assault you for the groceries in the parking lot?

Will they hijack your car for food and get the gas as a bonus?

Will gangs descend on food stores to clean them out instead of stealing worthless purses?


Will there be diesel to power the trucks to even deliver food...or grow it?

Lots of questions to answer in a SHTF world. At the very least, maybe a team of two armed persons would have to food shop. One to load the car and one as a lookout.
In some Dimocrat neighborhoods, this been common for years.
 

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I have to wait around at bus stops in marginal neighborhoods and I can't carry a gun (mentally ill). So I carry a stun gun.

A lot of people think grocery delivery is the answer but based on the irate customers storming my store daily it is not.
 

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Will people / gangs assault you for the groceries in the parking lot?

Will they hijack your car for food and get the gas as a bonus?

Will gangs descend on food stores to clean them out instead of stealing worthless purses?

Will there be diesel to power the trucks to even deliver food...or grow it?

Lots of questions to answer in a SHTF world. At the very least, maybe a team of two armed persons would have to food shop. One to load the car and one as a lookout.
LOL,I guess you haven't been to LA or Frisco lately commiefornias finest... 🤣
 

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LOL,I guess you haven't been to LA or Frisco lately commiefornias finest... 🤣
What are you talking about? My friends in SF haven't mentioned any shopping risks. Neither have my family members in L.A. Nor have I encountered or observed any at the Costco in Santa Rosa.

I get that everyone loves to hate California, but that's no reason to make stuff up when people are trying to have a serious conversation about risks and how to mitigate them.

Let's try to keep actual survivalism discussions fact-based.
 

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Not a chance... for quite awhile.

Society and civilization RAPIDLY decay without utilities, police, etc. Look at any major hurricane, refugees, etc situation. The grocery stores, pharmacies, gas stations, etc are shuttered in less than a week. Martial law is in place.

You will be wise to stay FAR from people. Keep in mind that 1 in every 5 or 6 people in America depends on psych meds (not takes them... DEPENDS on them). Even more USA people than that own guns. Put 2 and 2 together. People revert to being animals amazingly fast. Proceed at your own risk with bartering with randoms, lol.

Many years down the line, after years of starvation and die-off and population shrinkage, there will likely be basic trade, farmer market, etc setups. They will still be somewhat dangerous (think frontier days, wild west, etc). It obviously depends on how exactly SHTF goes down, but in any widespread one, you can count on being largely dependent only on your group or yourself.
 

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I've lived through a few SHTF and there was fuel/shopping. (Cities in OK, OH, NY) You might not have gotten exactly what you wanted, for the price you wanted to pay, in the desired quantity (gas rationing), at the first place you tried (kind of like now) but it was never the circus some imagine. Not saying there was none, but personally I never saw gangs looting, carjackers, kidnappers or any assaults that involved more than 2 people or more than bare hands.
Everyone has their own definitions of acronyms but what you describe comes closer to my TEOTWAWKI. In which case, the the answer is still no. Before the elites lock themselves in the bunkers they will assure a clean sweep topside. People will drop so fast they won't have time for any of that.
 
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What are you talking about? My friends in SF haven't mentioned any shopping risks. Neither have my family members in L.A. Nor have I encountered or observed any at the Costco in Santa Rosa.

I get that everyone loves to hate California, but that's no reason to make stuff up when people are trying to have a serious conversation about risks and how to mitigate them.

Let's try to keep actual survivalism discussions fact-based.
TTK,

In all fairness to geography, both LA and SFO are large places with some different socio-economic environments throughout city limits.

......

Not related to foods but at Forum I mentioned that SFO Bay is larger than the state of Rhode Island.
 

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I've lived through a few SHTF and there was fuel/shopping. (Cities in OK, OH, NY) You might not have gotten exactly what you wanted, for the price you wanted to pay, in the desired quantity (gas rationing), at the first place you tried (kind of like now) but it was never the circus some imagine. Not saying there was none, but personally I never saw gangs looting, carjackers, kidnappers or any assaults that involved more than 2 people or more than bare hands.
Seriously, we're were you in 2020.

.
 

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After a real SHTF, I think it would be wise to go shopping with a few trusted neighbors. I'm thinking 3 pickup trucks, 3 people each one, all armed. One guards truck while the other 2 shop,(one shops and the other protects). So the parking lot has 3 trucks with 3 gunners, and inside there are 6 shoppers w guns.

Of course anyone could be overwhelmed, but this seems a prudent approach that could be modified as needed.
 

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Seriously, we're were you in 2020.

.
Right here, refuting the rumors Tulsa was going to burn (again). I'm sure all the people who came for the rally were sad to see it still standing when they left.
 

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The closest I came to SHTF situations were the Seattle riots in 1999 and Kincade Fire evacuation in 2019.

In 1999 I and a few coworkers were trapped in our offices in the Westin Building for two days while the rioters and police raged back and forth below us.

When we ventured out, almost everything was closed. My car was locked in the parking garage with no attendants present, and we had to search a few city blocks to find a store that was open (a liquor store -- we bought snacks and brought them back to the group so we could eat while discussing what we'd seen and what to do next). The buses were not running, and I had to hoof it about a mile south before I could find one.

Ever since that experience, I've always kept one of my office desk drawers full of food.

In 2019 we evacuated to a friend's house in East Bay (actually turned out to be a friend-of-a-friend's house, which our friend volunteered without asking permission, upsetting the actual owner a bit). Unlike in Seattle, it was business as usual despite the fires and pseudo-refugees (like ourselves), and we were able to buy food and other things.

In short, yeah, what others have already said -- it depends on the exact form of SHTF, but it has to get pretty bad before food becomes unavailable, and even then the impact might have a small footprint, outside which it's business as usual.

As for a scenario where all of western civilization collapses and food stops getting trucked into the cities, I expect shopping would be dangerous for a short time, and then all the food would be gone. The urbanites would need to leave or die.

Out here in the sticks, I would hope the farmers market would continue to operate so local farmers could sell their produce. Even if it didn't, we'd ramp up our garden and chicken flock anyway, and I'd look for some way to trade with other local producers. It's nice to live where the food comes from, but without some way to trade it would be hard to keep a diverse diet.
 
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