[HippieSurvivalist]

I've been watching clips of some of the politicians who are running for office this fall, and it strikes me that a) they all identify as Christian, and b) they are telling bald-faced lies.

I don't mean like telling someone who is kind of homely that you think they are cute, or eve just exagerating a little bit about some accomplishment in their history. I mean real lies, things that they KNOW, based on other statements they theyselves have mad, are untrue!

Where is the outrage? Where is the public calling for people, who are claiming to want to serve the public, to stop lying to the public? Isn't lying to the public a bad thing?

Are we so used to lying that it's not even a sin anymore? I was raised catholic and had it hammered into my head "don't tell lies/thou shalt not bear false witness". I do in fact try to adhere to this instruction, and I expect the people in my life to adhere to it as well (assuming they ever learned that lying is wrong!) If someone lies to me, i will hold it against that person, and although I might later forgive the person, I will NEVER forget being lied to by them.

Does ANYONE share my outrage?

HippieSurvivalist

 

[mgd_only]

never its a sin

 

[nebguy]

never its a sin

so... if you had to tell a lie to save your mother's life you wont do it because its a sin?

 

[nebguy]

I've been watching clips of some of the politicians who are running for office this fall, and it strikes me that a) they all identify as Christian, and b) they are telling bald-faced lies.

I don't mean like telling someone who is kind of homely that you think they are cute, or eve just exagerating a little bit about some accomplishment in their history. I mean real lies, things that they KNOW, based on other statements they theyselves have mad, are untrue!

Where is the outrage? Where is the public calling for people, who are claiming to want to serve the public, to stop lying to the public? Isn't lying to the public a bad thing?

Are we so used to lying that it's not even a sin anymore? I was raised catholic and had it hammered into my head "don't tell lies/thou shalt not bear false witness". I do in fact try to adhere to this instruction, and I expect the people in my life to adhere to it as well (assuming they ever learned that lying is wrong!) If someone lies to me, i will hold it against that person, and although I might later forgive the person, I will NEVER forget being lied to by them.

Does ANYONE share my outrage?

HippieSurvivalist

can you please identify a "lie" told by any of the candidates, and how you know it is a lie?

 

[Straight Razor]

You must mean McCain 'cause Obama ain't no Christian. Now, it is okay for Muslims to lie to non-Muslims so Obama has an exemption.

 

[BudgetSurvivalist]

how you know it is a lie?

Their lips are moving.

{drum riff}

 

[Ihatebugs]

They do it in this forum all the time.

 

[Pointblank]

I've been watching clips of some of the politicians who are running for office this fall, and it strikes me that a) they all identify as Christian, and b) they are telling bald-faced lies.

I don't mean like telling someone who is kind of homely that you think they are cute, or eve just exagerating a little bit about some accomplishment in their history. I mean real lies, things that they KNOW, based on other statements they theyselves have mad, are untrue!

Where is the outrage? Where is the public calling for people, who are claiming to want to serve the public, to stop lying to the public? Isn't lying to the public a bad thing?

Are we so used to lying that it's not even a sin anymore? I was raised catholic and had it hammered into my head "don't tell lies/thou shalt not bear false witness". I do in fact try to adhere to this instruction, and I expect the people in my life to adhere to it as well (assuming they ever learned that lying is wrong!) If someone lies to me, i will hold it against that person, and although I might later forgive the person, I will NEVER forget being lied to by them.

Does ANYONE share my outrage?

HippieSurvivalist

They simply are not true Christians; there are many people that go to church every week that will end up in hell because to them its about image, and Jesus Christ does not reside in their heart.

"They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. By their fruit you will recognize them." Matthew 7

PointBlank

Not to say I'm a perfect example because at times I've made an ass of myself with my pride, but repenting of sin and the struggle to do Christ's will is the making of true Christians. By Christ Jesus alone my friends, by him alone.

 

[nebguy]

They do it in this forum all the time.

"they" being you?

 

[mgd_only]

neb guy i'm not a Christian nice bait though. i'm a pagan and live by my Asatru beliefs.
now how would it look if i went against my own religous beliefs? same goes for Christians the bible says don't do it. its a sin. very simple in my eyes. but to answer your question i wouldn't lie to save granny and comprimise my beliefs i find honor in not dying a straw death and so does granny so no problems here.

 

[nebguy]

neb guy i'm not a Christian nice bait though. i'm a pagan and live by my Asatru beliefs.
now how would it look if i went against my own religous beliefs? same goes for Christians the bible says don't do it. its a sin. very simple in my eyes. but to answer your question i wouldn't lie to save granny and comprimise my beliefs i find honor in not dying a straw death and so does granny so no problems here.

not intended as bait.

just wondering how far you'd go. how about if you had to tell a lie to save a child's life? not even the tiniest lie that you could ten tell the truth a moment later?

You NEVER lie... like saying " i cant right now" when you really could but its inconvenient?

I dont believe anyone here doesnt tell one of more lies every day.

What is a straw death by the way?

 

[HippieSurvivalist]

can you please identify a "lie" told by any of the candidates, and how you know it is a lie?

From "the View" interview last week:

BARBARA WALTERS: What is she going to reform, specifically?

JOHN MCCAIN: Well, first of all, earmark spending, which she vetoed half a billion dollars worth in the state of Alaska.

WALTERS: She also took some earmarks

JOY BEHAR: A lot.

MCCAIN: No, not as governor, she didn't. She vetoed - Look, well, the fact is she's a reform governor.

FACT: Palin's as governer asked for $256 million in earmarks last year and $197 million this year. That's

McCain told a blatant lie. Given that Palin was "vetted" and her earmark requests are public information, it's simply not plausible that NOBODY told McCain that Palin does, in fact, rely on earmarks, which, by the way, McCain has called illegal.

Is that a good enough example for you?

HippieSurvivalist

 

[cadethepagan]

When is it OK for a Christian to lie?

To them, when they defend their faith.

-Cade

 

[nebguy]

From "the View" interview last week:

BARBARA WALTERS: What is she going to reform, specifically?

JOHN MCCAIN: Well, first of all, earmark spending, which she vetoed half a billion dollars worth in the state of Alaska.

WALTERS: She also took some earmarks

JOY BEHAR: A lot.

MCCAIN: No, not as governor, she didn't. She vetoed - Look, well, the fact is she's a reform governor.

FACT: Palin's as governer asked for $256 million in earmarks last year and $197 million this year. That's

McCain told a blatant lie. Given that Palin was "vetted" and her earmark requests are public information, it's simply not plausible that NOBODY told McCain that Palin does, in fact, rely on earmarks, which, by the way, McCain has called illegal.

Is that a good enough example for you?

HippieSurvivalist

so was obama lying when he spoke of "my muslim faith"?

 

[Herne]

No True Scotsman

They simply are not true Christians; there are many people that go to church every week that will end up in hell because to them its about image, and Jesus Christ does not reside in their heart.

Not the 'self-sealing fallacy' again
"No true Scotsman would wear underwear"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

 

[LaserCool]

McCain told a blatant lie. Given that Palin was "vetted" and her earmark requests are public information, it's simply not plausible that NOBODY told McCain that Palin does, in fact, rely on earmarks, which, by the way, McCain has called illegal.

Is that a good enough example for you?

HippieSurvivalist

The short answer is that they all lie, even when they tell stories about their God which they know couldn't be true. Like walking on water, or multiplying loaves and fishes.

But a deeper problem is not that they lie, but that they feel lying is totally justified. I was reading Gibbon's Decline and Fall or the Roman Empire, and was struck by how Gibbon relates that among the Senate and Patricians, belief in the Gods was generally scoffed at, but publicly it was endorsed simply for appearances sake, since it was thought that the rabble was too thick not to survive well without religion to comfort them. So they publicly endorsed the State religion, but privately derided it.

I began to think to the modern relationship between Senators and faith today, and frankly I believe the cynicism is as deep. Their behavior reveals that they don't care about any Christian injunction against lying, a.k.a. bearing false witness. Palin's family is a mess, and she doesn't follow the advice in Matt 7:1-5 about removing the beam from your own eye.

No, it's simply convenient for the politicians to pay lip service to religious belief because it gets votes, just like others pay lip service to "change" to get votes. Once in office, very little change gets done, and religious belief is only brought up when there's an election or specific legislation they need backing for.

 

[ActionJackson]

I've been watching clips of some of the politicians who are running for office this fall, and it strikes me that a) they all identify as Christian, and b) they are telling bald-faced lies.

I don't mean like telling someone who is kind of homely that you think they are cute, or eve just exagerating a little bit about some accomplishment in their history. I mean real lies, things that they KNOW, based on other statements they theyselves have mad, are untrue!

Where is the outrage? Where is the public calling for people, who are claiming to want to serve the public, to stop lying to the public? Isn't lying to the public a bad thing?

Are we so used to lying that it's not even a sin anymore? I was raised catholic and had it hammered into my head "don't tell lies/thou shalt not bear false witness". I do in fact try to adhere to this instruction, and I expect the people in my life to adhere to it as well (assuming they ever learned that lying is wrong!) If someone lies to me, i will hold it against that person, and although I might later forgive the person, I will NEVER forget being lied to by them.

Does ANYONE share my outrage?

HippieSurvivalist

The first lie that they are telling is that they are Christian. Ye shall know them by their fruits. We already know what Barak Obama thinks about the Bible so we know flat out that he's lying. McCain oozes lies every time he opens his mouth. His very tone is as slithery as a snake. They're both awful candidates and neither will be good for our country. A real Christian wouldn't have a chance in a Presidential election. The closest thing we got to a good Christian was Ron Paul and we all know how he was black-balled.

 

[seven7]

To them, when they defend their faith.

-Cade

Lies as YOU see it.

 

[malcontent]

i agree with the outrage feelings. i am mostly honest, to the extent being too gullible.

 

[mgd_only]

straw death is to die in bed of old age or in the comprimize of one beliefs

however lie'n isn't a sin in my religion but it is frowned upon big time. and i've told lies manyof them in my time. and for my little girl who means everything to me i would lie quickly and without hesitation. i won't be dammed for it. and kyra is yet to young to understand these things so yes i would lie is the short answer every one has a button and kyra would be mine.