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Hi Y'all,

I 'require' an assault/tactical rifle to fill out my firearms collection. I am trying to decide what rifle is right for me, and more importantly what manufacturer or importer has the best product. I'd also like to know what features I should look for on these weapons.
Here are the weapons I have in mind:

I love the Ak's. The AK-74 appeals to me, but I'm worried about accuracy. I'd like a MINIMUM 4 MOA. Do you all know a weapon that fits the bill? In buying an AK-74, what features should I look for. I should say I do not want to scope it or any other bells & whistles. Just a well functioning rifle.

I am not a big fan of the AR's. I am, however, open-minded. I'd like the rifle to be full length, no rails, no collapsable stocks etc etc. Just a plain jane AR-15. Who makes such a weapon? What features should I look for?

These are the 2 I have in mind, but am open to suggestions. Price is an issue (isn't it always?) and I'd like to keep the price around 1,000 U.S.

I appreciate your taking the time to read my post and thank you in advance for your help. Please only speak to what you know, so as not to send me off on wild goose chases or leave here misinformed (the worst outcome).
 

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What kind of experience do you have with carbines? Have you shot a standard AK? Have you shot a 74? AR15? What is your primary use? What else do you own?

You can get almost anything for your budget.
 

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I have always been a big fan of the AR15. I own 3 of them. I do have a Colt SP1 that has the full stock. This is the A1 version that we used in Viet Nam. The M4 that I built is by far my favorite. I would like to change your mind on a full stock. With the adjustable stocks you can make the rifle fit no matter if you are wearing ie. a tac vest, body armor or even a heavy coat. Plus you can collapse the stock so it takes up less room in a safe or vehicle. Having said all this, for under $1000, I would recommend the Smith & Wesson M&P AR15. It has an adjustable stock, and flat rail, ready for optics and sights. If you are set on a plain jane AR, spend between $900-$1300 and find a used Colt SP1.

Dave
 

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Get a quality mil-spec AR carbine.At a minimum,a sling and light.An RDS if you can would be great too.Mags/ammo and some spare's ect..These newer AR's are deadly acurate and very reliable,just keep them wet!The ergo's suck on an AK,and they're harder to work on.That's my 2 cents ;).
 

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Knife Maker
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Get a quality mil-spec AR carbine.At a minimum,a sling and light.An RDS if you can would be great too.Mags/ammo and some spare's ect..These newer AR's are deadly acurate and very reliable,just keep them wet!The ergo's suck on an AK,and they're harder to work on.That's my 2 cents ;).


The last three comments always concern me with AR's Keep em wet (also means they will attract dirt); ergo's suck ( they may not be as ergonomic as an AR but with training and practice they can be run just as easily) harder to work on!!! Really ??? They are just about the easiest weapon to work on that I know of. Especially if you are just talking what your average Joe gun owner would expect to do to a weapon. I have no problem with AR's except caliber which I don't like ( unless they are .308) and yes I am a fan of AK's because they are built to run all day every day. It really comes down to what you feel fits you as a shooter best. If you have friends that are running both platforms try to get them together where you can shoot both and compare for yourself. There are pluses and minuses to every system you just have to figure out what works for you...for me presently it is the AK platform.
 

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The last three comments always concern me with AR's Keep em wet (also means they will attract dirt); ergo's suck ( they may not be as ergonomic as an AR but with training and practice they can be run just as easily) harder to work on!!! Really ??? They are just about the easiest weapon to work on that I know of. Especially if you are just talking what your average Joe gun owner would expect to do to a weapon. I have no problem with AR's except caliber which I don't like ( unless they are .308) and yes I am a fan of AK's because they are built to run all day every day. It really comes down to what you feel fits you as a shooter best. If you have friends that are running both platforms try to get them together where you can shoot both and compare for yourself. There are pluses and minuses to every system you just have to figure out what works for you...for me presently it is the AK platform.
The gunk won't stop the AR,a quick squirt of lube every few hundred rounds isn't too hard to do.I have a nickel boron bolt carrier,it can run DRY if need be.
 

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4 MOA ... AK-74 ... Why you're describing a Saiga in 5.45x39!!
And for $1000 you can have one, plus 1080 rounds and $4-500 leftover to do a full restoration. Or buy an Arsenal SGL (built on a Saiga), 1080 rds and a bunch of mags.

Personally I'd do that with the Saiga 223 though, AK 74 but in 5.56 so you can replenish your ammo off the AR users, and not have to carry an AR tool or keep it wet.
 

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American fearmaker
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I'd do an Arsenal AK type rifle in .223 caliber. Take a look at their SLR 106 rifles and see what you think about them. Reliable rifles. Decent MOAs. You can scope them without a hassle. Bette than Saigas in my opinion.
 

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Not an AR fan either but with a basic no thrills AK without a scope you are going to be hard pressed to get under 5 MOA, just the nature of the beast- short sight radius with irons, thinner barrels that heat up quick, etc etc BUT they will go bang every time in just about all conditions.
I agree go with Arsenal or do a Saiga conversion yourself (if you have the mechanical skills). HOWEVER I do NOT agree with going 223 in an AK rifle. 5.49 is cheap to shoot and very comparable to 5.56. Personally I say get the real deal and go AK-47 style 7.62x39- still cheaper to shoot then 5.56 and has more punch.
 

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AK in 5.56 is really hard to beat, especially since you dont want all the bells and whistles.
Arsenal are the best. you could get a lot of ammo with whats left over- ARs in my op are really about the same, unless you spend serious $$$$, your buying a name brand a lot of times. But thats always been the case really. century SAR3 is Romanian made, not a bad gun for the monies at about 1/2 the price of a Arsenal. Spare parts kit is a lot less for a AK than a AR. AK74 mags are a little more then a AR but they will run 5.56 with little or no mods. Again Arsenal makes the best ones in 5.56
cleaning a AK is a lot simpler than a AR. An AK is really hard to break, the bolt wont fall out of a AK like an AR, either one is a good choice thou.
But a 7.62x39 AK47 is the one I would get first.........you know you wont stop with just one black gun!
 

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I'd do an Arsenal AK type rifle in .223 caliber. Take a look at their SLR 106 rifles and see what you think about them. Reliable rifles. Decent MOAs. You can scope them without a hassle. Bette than Saigas in my opinion.
You're right on the Arsenals, although I'd still go with an SGL than an SLR. The key differences between the Saiga and the Arsenals that are built from them, are the piston and the trigger. Both of those are simple upgrade items available from most places that sell Saigas. If the OP wants it off the shelf, Arsenal is the way to go. However, if the OP is as handy with tools as a Rwandan 8 year old, then they'll probably be able to convert a Saiga to a semi-auto 74 ... toughest part is tapping for a 74 FSB, and you can have that done by a smith cheap.
 

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I've built a few AR15s in the last few years...they are very hard to beat in terms of accuracy and modular design. AR platforms are easy to mount optics onto. I have sold all of my ARs and currently have one AK74.

I really like the AK74 for it's lighter weight in terms of ammo and overall weight compared to it's older sibling the AK47. The 5.45 is a little nasty bullet and I like how light it recoils in my AK74. Surplus 7N6 ammo is still inexpensive compared to .223 and 7.62x39.

In the end, only you can decide which platform works for you. With your budget, you could get a good AK74 with plenty of mags and ammo to start your SHTF arsenal.
 

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I have a converted Saiga 7.62x39 wearing a Kobra sight. It shoots 1 1/2 MOA with cheap ammo.

One of the range I shoot at has steel plates at 100, 150,200, 230 yards. I hit them consistently with the Saiga.

That being said, who do you plan on engaging at more than 25 yards?
 

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It's your call, but I think the main advantage of the AK over the AR is the larger caliber. If you remove that advantage by choosing the 74, I would opt for the AR. It has better sights, ergonomic, telescoping stocks are great, and equally reliable.

Either one will do the job.
 

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I have a wsr3 in 223 and i love it. Open sites about 2.5-3 moa. I have a quick detach scope mount and a burris 1x3 scope and with the scope mounted its about 1.5 moa. But i didnt like how loose the steel mags fit so i went out and bought abunch of bulgarian arsenal mags for it. 25 bucks a mag but their soppose to be the best you can get. Good thing about the 223 is if you hand load you can get better acc and enstead of a few differnt rounds to shoot you can make your own load. Owe also them groups was fired with wolf ammo. I hadnt had time to work up loads for it. Been messing with hunting loads for my AR.
 

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Troublesome.
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I'm going to buck the trend.

I'd recommend finding a used M1A.

No reason for you to have to settle for any of those girly guns - any of them. :thumb:
 

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Demon of the Midwest
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The AK74 is a great choice. I rather like the Hornady Vmax rounds in mine, I avoid corrosive surplus stuff. Unlike what most internet commandos say the 5.45 round is quite accurate from the 74, under 4 MOA easily.

Get yourself a converted Saiga, or an Arsenal and you'll be pleased. Don't buy a Century gun, they don't have chrome lined barrels. There are a couple other brands out there but just make sure they have the chrome lining, especially if you want to shoot the cheaper corrosive stuff.
 

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I'm going to buck the trend.

I'd recommend finding a used M1A.

No reason for you to have to settle for any of those girly guns - any of them. :thumb:
Based on what reasoning would you recommend anything of that size?

Not only has it been shown since WWI that the cartridge, and size of the weapon is a waste, but in reality the effective range of one far exceeds any visibility you are going to get on a armed target sneaking up on you. IE wast not want not.

Generally 400 yards is the max engagement range of nearly all combatants, and much of it in reality is far less. So whats the point?

Also some, not all mind you, 308 and 3006 rounds do less damage then assault rifles because they expend the energy outside of the body. Just depends on the round and range.
 
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