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awake and aware
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm posting my story for the benefit of others to evaluate and comment and to take from this post what we all learn.

Just recently I got into a fight and then I got jumped afterward.

It started when a guy was standing in the middle of a 1 way street and wouldn't get out of the way of the car I was riding in.
I didn't have my gun on me because I wasn't in a state where I could carry with the license where I'm from.
So he's trying to get into the car and all 3 of us got out and I ended up in a fight with the idiot. I train up to 5 days a week in mma and weight training and it helped 100%. I made short work of this idiot and he was at least 100 pounds heavier than me. (I'm 150 currently and the guy was at least 250+.)
Well I get dropped off where I was meeting a friend. I didn't know exactly where the house was because this friend was at one of their friends house. Well don't you know it, they were out looking for me and found me. Seven of them and they were mad.
They were trying to put my head through a house window when I took the fight to the ground to stop them from doing it. Then they stomped me for a while. The didn't hit my face but were kicking my ribs and back pretty good. I couldn't get back to my feet to try to keep fleeing.
They stopped and I was off to the hospital for 5 days.
$17,000 later I'm out and have a punctured lung to heal before I can get back into training.

The mma training helped me greatly. I am in great shape which helped me keep up the good fight when there was many of them but I was only trying to defend myself, not strike back. My logic is if I break one of their noses, I get a broken nose and worse back. I will heal fast because of the shape I'm in. The mma has a weakness though because really nothing helps you fight 7 people at once and come out unscathed.

Can anybody tell me if I had my gun (legally) would I have been able to defend myself with it if I thought I was going to be killed?
What if I had it with me when I was unable to carry it and this happened and I used it? Would I face murder charges trying to defend my life?
 

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Wild Edibles Expert
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Wouldn't it be easier, less costly and less painful to grow up?

So a guy's in the road and if you had a gun you would have hauled it out. Maybe you shouldn't have a gun either. One guy in the road, three guys in a car..... clearly he's quite a threat to you all.... as for being attacked by seven... gosh they found you easily.....maybe it was the testosterone trail .... you do have a right to defend yourself particularly if your life is in danger... but it all sounds like a pissing contest between children and you got wet. Next time back up. Cars do have a reverse. If not, let him argue with the guy behind you honking his horn. And when he's arguing with the guy behind you, he's out of your way.
 

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Here's my safety Sir
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Nope you would have been wrong to use your weapon. You put your self in the wrong when you got out of the vehicle. Then put your self in a bad area with out a good plan.
Remember prior planing prevents **** poor performance. A brain and a smooth mouth are usually a better weapon that a fist in anger.
 

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NRA Instructor-Ohio CCW
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I think you would not have been justified in the first instance. I think you may have been in the second. If you said you feared for you life, and with seven guys coming at you I think it would be a reasonable fear.
 

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Well, MMA and 'going to the ground' are absolutely dependant on one-on-one situations. In any multi attacker situation, you want to be on your feet, staying out on the edge of the group so they can't all hit you at once.

I also train MMA, but having done years of standup before that, I am well aware of this weakness inherent in getting to the floor.

Anyway, using your gun in this situation would depend on the state you live in. If its a state where legal carry is allowed, then its use in self-defense is also allowed.

Here in NJ, it would be NO, Go Directly To Jail. But in more sensible places then they would say 7 on 1, reasonable fear for your life.
 

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You should have never gotten out of the car. If you are only 150 and the guy was 250 plus you were nothing but LUCKY. That was a stupid move. Tell your buddy driving next time to back the care up and find a different rout. If he won't, tell him to get out of the car and fight. Second mistake was getting in a fight with someone then sticking around the neighborhood. That is just about as retarded as it gets.


This is what having pride and being a tough guy gets you.
 

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awake and aware
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Wouldn't it be easier, less costly and less painful to grow up?

So a guy's in the road and if you had a gun you would have hauled it out. Maybe you shouldn't have a gun either. One guy in the road, three guys in a car..... clearly he's quite a threat to you all.... as for being attacked by seven... gosh they found you easily.....maybe it was the testosterone trail .... you do have a right to defend yourself particularly if your life is in danger... but it all sounds like a pissing contest between children and you got wet. Next time back up. Cars do have a reverse. If not, let him argue with the guy behind you honking his horn. And when he's arguing with the guy behind you, he's out of your way.

I wasn't talking about pulling a gun on the first guy and I wouldn't have pulled it on him even if I had it.
I was talking about when several were trying to end my life.
I can see how you would see how it was less mature to end up in a fight over someone standing in the road and it was not my intention for it to end that way but it did, and it was him who pushed it there.

The other questions...
I did try to flee. I did not succeed. I didn't make it to the friend's house they got to me first.
To say I'm lucky because I'm 150 and beat someone heavier than me is ridiculous. I routinely practice with people around that weight and hold my own.
Getting out of my car to tell someone to move makes me the bad guy?
I disagree. It is letting that person know to move or there could be trouble.
Well there was and I understand that. The focus of this was the second part and use of a weapon in the circumstances.
 

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It started when a guy was standing in the middle of a 1 way street and wouldn't get out of the way of the car I was riding in.
I didn't have my gun on me because I wasn't in a state where I could carry with the license where I'm from.
So he's trying to get into the car and all 3 of us got out and I ended up in a fight with the idiot.
Did the car have a gas pedal ?? If he was in front , did the car have reverse ???

The vehicle was a 4000 pound weapon . You had a way out and did not use it . You guys should have bailed , dont be a tuff guy , cause theres always some one tuffer , you learn that when you get to old to heal fast .

Can anybody tell me if I had my gun (legally) would I have been able to defend myself with it if I thought I was going to be killed?
What if I had it with me when I was unable to carry it and this happened and I used it? Would I face murder charges trying to defend my life?
From what you have stated , it would not have been a good shoot ( in the first incident . Which brings us to you being jumped , .......................7 on 1 , 75% sure it would have been a good self defense shoot .
 

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Can anybody tell me if I had my gun (legally) would I have been able to defend myself with it if I thought I was going to be killed?
What if I had it with me when I was unable to carry it and this happened and I used it? Would I face murder charges trying to defend my life?
I don't think you would be in a very tenable legal position in the 7 on 1 scenario. If you take out all 7 with your gun, a jury is apt to look at you more as a spree killer than someone in legitimate fear of his life.
 

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Squawker
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I think that everyone is being a little hard on the OP. He was trying to convinve the first guy to move. Now, he didn't give the details on the start of that fight, but it isn't important. The 7 guys trying to stomp him into the pavement most definitely is a valid situation where a firearm could be used for self defense. The first incident has nothing to do with the second. IF he was wrong, then the other person involved could file charges. It doesn't give his friends the right to track him down and beat him up. He got out of the car the 2nd time because he was dropped off. He didn't get out to fight some more. The comments that the car is a weapon- really? You would condemn the OP for using a gun to defend himself against a group of 7 people out to hurt him, but avocate running over the guy standing in the middle of the road who won't move? Yeah, right. If it had been me that was attacked, there would most definitely have been more than 1 person suffering from a case of acute lead poisoning. Hell, if you can't use a gun to protect yourself against a mob looking to hurt you, why bother even carrying it, because there will not be any case where the gun can be used.
 

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I Love Guns
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just because u practice with ppl that are 2x your size does not mean in a real fight u will win all the time that means crap to me and anyone thats evern practiced the arts MMA,Boxing,KickBoxing Exc. that don't mean crap...2nd anyone who trains in the arts should know that the arts are for self defence u had a way and the means to back out ...u didn't....thats the choice u have to live with...the price u paided was a 17G doctor bill and 5 days in the Hospital....i think u got off lucky...maybe next time u will be the wiser maybe u will not....as for using a gun in a 7 to 1 fight...depends....if it was because they attacted u out of the blue...maybe...because u jumped there buddy and they were pissed and wanted to kick your rear...and u shot one...i think u would be sitting in Fed Prison right now...always think 4 steps ahead ..

and next time...think befor u act...or it may be your last act..

think of it this way...what if that guy in front of the car had a gun...u and your friends got out...and he shot u all.....than what...
 

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awake and aware
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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
just because u practice with ppl that are 2x your size does not mean in a real fight u will win all the time that means crap to me and anyone thats evern practiced the arts MMA,Boxing,KickBoxing Exc. that don't mean crap...2nd anyone who trains in the arts should know that the arts are for self defence u had a way and the means to back out ...u didn't....thats the choice u have to live with...the price u paided was a 17G doctor bill and 5 days in the Hospital....i think u got off lucky...maybe next time u will be the wiser maybe u will not....as for using a gun in a 7 to 1 fight...depends....if it was because they attacted u out of the blue...maybe...because u jumped there buddy and they were pissed and wanted to kick your rear...and u shot one...i think u would be sitting in Fed Prison right now...always think 4 steps ahead ..

and next time...think befor u act...or it may be your last act..

think of it this way...what if that guy in front of the car had a gun...u and your friends got out...and he shot u all.....than what...
Look I didn't jump anybody. It was 1 on 1 in the first scenario.
I understand that just because I practice with people that size I would not win all the time. My point was that I'm not going to let someone beat the heck out of me just because they're bigger. To say I am lucky shows that the poster doesn't understand how grappling really works.
I defended myself when that guy came right at me and I did well.

The reason I put this thread together was to share my experience with people and to step through what happened and what may have been able to have been done if I had a weapon on me for the second scenario. To help other people if something along these lines happen to one of you. To turn what was a bad experience into something others can be helped with.
It seems like some of you revel in what happened to me and that I somehow deserved it or that because I didn't stay in the car that I was acting like a tough guy.
I do understand I could've been shot when he first came at me in the first scenario. Heck, he could've shot right through the car windows too.
The street was a 1-way and we were more than half way down it. Backing up wasn't really an option just because someone was standing in the middle of it just ahead. Telling someone to get out of the street and them running up to you to fight you is a scenario I couldn't change at that point. Running them over is crazy too.

The people saying I shouldn't even own a gun are out of line too. Just because I got out of a car to tell somebody to move I shouldn't own a gun?
That I deserved what I got because I got out of a car? I wasn't about to pull a gun on somebody standing in the street. I am asking people on here to give info on what they would do in the same situation with the 7 people. If anybody knows the legality or could share a similar experience or article that they know of. No I'm not asking if I can legally shoot all 7 people either. I doubt they would've kept continuing their actions if a gun came out in the first place.
 

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"...I am asking people on here to give info on what they would do in the same situation with the 7 people..."

In my opinion unless that has actually happened to a person - it's all speculation.
"I would have..." What? Probably kicked all their asses with my flying round house kick from some hidden chuck norris fist?
yeah...but that's just me.

Being jumped by 7 people hasn't happened to me (yet, thankfully)...I would like to _think_ I know how I would respond.

Wasn't there. Don't know all the details so I'm in no place to pass judgement - however, this is my commentary on the situation:

I would say next time, don't engage the first person unless absolutely necessary. Although the guy in the road was probably in the wrong, let him be, be the better person, have the patience to let him figure his stuff out and eventually move out of the way. You stepped out of the car, and found yourself in an entanglement. You got the upper hand. He got mad and came looking for you. Cause and effect.

However, even without the backstory - being jumped by 7 people is not a small deal. You could have ended up dead. LEAVING would have been the best option, but as you said, you tried that. So you did whatever you had to do to survive that situation.


A friend of mine that has trained for over 20 years in a variety of martial arts once told me that he doesn't like to "win" fights because then the loser will usually want revenge. He likes to "survive" fights instead. Don't get me wrong, the man can open a can of hurt on people in a ridiculous way. However, his philosophy is to do "just enough." In fact, escaping the situation in a way that the aggressor thinks he won the fight is his ultimate survival technique.

This line of thought obviously takes a great deal of personal confidence and no impetus to prove anything to anybody.

That really stuck a cord with me, it really got me to think about how surviving and "winning" are 2 fundamentally different concepts.
"Winners" draw the good & bad spotlight.
"Survivalists" simply get to go about their business of living.
 

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I'm the boogey man.......
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I give anyone bent on confrontation a way out, then I try to back out, and try to back out again and try to back out again, but if backed into a corner I stick to quick, effective and "dirty" as hell to end it. Even if you're not armed and you know they're not, a good bluff like reaching into you coat like you have your hand on your piece, sometimes can go a long way......

Then again, when I can't carry a gun, which is rare, I carry an ASP ("Excuse me while I whip this out....") under my jacket in a pouch that I had a local alterations seamstress sew inside of it so I can hide the ASP. An ASP is an excellent tool for administering and proper attitude adjustment without even striking someone. I'm not a believer in pepper spray, I've been sprayed and found out I can still function and be dangerous, and I know if I can others can too. Then again if I'm talking to you while I'm at work it's not becasue you've been behaving so I'll have something on me..

7 on one and I'm cornered, dial 911 scream "FIRE", fight like my like depends on it and hope my phone can get a GPS signal to relay to the 911 center.
 
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I agree- poor planning and unjustified use of a firearm. However- when 7 guys jump you- that would be justified but it would also likely get the gun removed from you and then turned on you.
 

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I'm the boogey man.......
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Yes, ASP....A.K.A. portable blunt force attitude adjusting and compliance device.
 
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