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Live Secret, Live Happy
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Discussion Starter #1
I have posted some rather negative comments about currently available electric vehicles, and I really dont hate the basic concept, just how they are designed and marketed. So I decided to propose a few changes.

Starting with industry standards on car battery sizing, connections, and interface dimensions to support battery leasing. The intent is allow car manufacturers to focus on cars, and battery manufacturers to supply batteries.

The car battery would be composed of removable 80 lb battery modules mounted in a lockable rear compartment, issolated from the passenger compartment by an air tight metal firewall.

Under battery leasing, the car owner would buy a new electric car with a full set of battery modules, and have the option to:
1) Charge them at home or at public charging stations,
2) Swap them out for charged modules at public charging stations,
3) Lease additional sets of modules to meet vehicle range requirements,
4) Replace old technology batteries with new,

Further, since electrochemical performance is strongly degraded by sub zero temps common in much of the country, some vehicles would include an auxilary power unit fueled by compressed natural gas or liquid propane.

Finnally, since the power density of current batteries prohibit any rational attempt to power ag equipment, construction equipment, pickups, trucks, and busses with batteries, these vehicles would be offered with CNG/LP motors.

Many of these vehicles are already using diesel motors converted to run on CNG/LP, and a modest infastructure of CNG refiling stations already exists accross much of the country.
 

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For the way some people live, EVs much a tremendous amount of sense. They should buy them. Until battery technology allows for long distance day/night travel without stopping to recharge, I am just going to wait.
 

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For the way some people live, EVs much a tremendous amount of sense. They should buy them.
And then they should STFU about it, and quit trying to legislate their use by everyone.(y)

Right now, the closest thing to a practical EV for me would be a hybrid. They're FINALLY getting around to doing hybrid pickups. Sadly, they are so wrapped up in making sure they make MORE HORSEPOWER, that they barely do better in mileage.

Idiots.
 

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Plenty of high lift and jlg snorkle lifts have been in use for a long time using lead acid batteries. As well as fork lifts.
 

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You do know that electric vehicles run on coal. That said, because of the weight, batteries have to be low in the vehicle not in the trunk which would make driving on a slick surface impossible.
The most practical vehicle is a diesel electric. The diesel can do the highway driving and the electric the stop and go. Never have to wait for it to charge.
 

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Retired Army
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I honestly don't see how anyone not a brain-dead lib could even think of using the term "practical" to describe "green" vehicles.

I concur, until you can swap out batteries, electric cars not a viable form of long distance transportation.
I do agree that if you had the option of pulling into a "gas" station, and driving away with a fully charged battery pack in 5 minutes, that would change the game, but how expensive would it bee to have "extra gas" (battery packs) at home in the garage like we can with liquid fuel?

Run out on the highway? Grab your gas can and hump to the next exit.
Going off road, or on a long distance trip? Have extra fuel cans mounted on the vehicle.
Siphon gas out of a vehicle in SHTF.
Not gonna do any of that with batteries.

They will never ben "practical" for anything other than the daily commuter, unless someone invents an "instant charge" capability as quick and easy as filling a gas tank..
 

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One guy I know from the gym bought a Leaf, maybe a Nissan EV? He charges it for free at a local outlet mall. Drops it off and comes back later for it. He said the rebate on it was worth it and has other incentives, but it is a little too much of a pisspot for me to like. The thing is dead quiet, I only hear the tire noise when it goes by. He has a couple of normal cars as well as an old Thunderbird.
 

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And then they should STFU about it, and quit trying to legislate their use by everyone.(y)

Right now, the closest thing to a practical EV for me would be a hybrid. They're FINALLY getting around to doing hybrid pickups. Sadly, they are so wrapped up in making sure they make MORE HORSEPOWER, that they barely do better in mileage.

Idiots.
Which make as much economic sense as a windmill powered electric grid. Buy/install very expensive windmill generators. Taking valuable land out of production (at least in Iowa). Then a install a new "collection" and transmission infrastructure (taking more land out of productio). For a 20yr life POS. THEN build REAL generation capacity to cover the terrible performance of the pinwheels. The SMART guy just installs the REAL Gensets?

Why buy a car with limited life expensive batteries AND the engine that actually makes it useful? moronic.
 

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Let them compete on a fair and even market.

I think we still need to make an order of magnitude improvement in battery tech still to make it viable vs cost.
 

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Live Secret, Live Happy
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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
My idea of a practical green vehicle is to overhaul my Wrangler, and replace my Subaru WRZ with a newer gasoline powered vehicle, before the damn fools pass stupid laws.

I could always paint them both green if that will make Captian Planet happy.
 

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Tryin' every day
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Hybrids are a but a farce.
The Prius runs about 25 miles on battery then the gas engine takes over.
TV ads for the Chrysler hybrid mini van promote how great they are for the environment and boldly proclaim it has a 500 mile range but they hide the small print saying it only goes 32 miles on battery.

The company I work for has a bunch of electric and hybrid vehicles as both "shop use" and the boss & family cars so I am familiar with them . We also have a lot of solar panels ( 200 or so) and the main office has geo-thermal heat/cooling.
The owners are environmentally conscious but the tax credits are also an incentive.
 

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Wile E Coyote, Genius.
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America doesn't have nearly the power grid capacity to handle electric vehicles. Hell, we couldn't even survive the recent cold snap in Texas without the grid going down.
I magine being stuck at home, freezing to death in the dark, and your vehicle can't even be used to escape or warm you up a little, because the batts are dead.

Also, there is no practical way to store the power that is randomly produced by wind and solar, and matching it to grid demand, which might not need that power for 8-24 hours.
Massive battery farms? Compressing air into caverns and re-expanding it later? Pumping water from a low lake to a high lake, then running it down hill to generate power later?

All of these are horribly wasteful and or require vast amounts of real estate, located near cities.

Perhaps if a low cost superconducting grid could connect the entire world, then when the sun is shining in Australia, it would power the people needing power at night in the US, or Vice Versa.

Let me know when that super conducting global grid is built. Until then, fossil fuels for me.
 

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Combat marxism Now!
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Of note, today's best hybrids use less fuel per mile than EV's.

61% of our electrical power comes from fossil fuel. Another 20% comes from nuclear plants. Any way you look at that, on a national average, 81% of an EV's motive force comes from a form of fuel.

A Tesla Model S will go 19 miles (in the winter) and up to 29 miles (in the summer with no AC used) on 10 pounds of coal. 10 pounds of coal being equivalent to a gallon of gas in energy.

A hybrid that can go 40, 50 or even 55 miles per gallon of gas uses far less energy than an EV. Period, end of story.
 

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Wile E Coyote, Genius.
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Hybrids can make sense, especially in stop and go city driving.

But there should be no subsidy. Let the free market decide.

But bear in mind those batteries come from rare earth minerals likely mined in China.
 

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Why buy a car with limited life expensive batteries AND the engine that actually makes it useful? moronic.
Only moronic if the hybrid truck is a stupid high price like the liquid fuel trucks are, and fuel doesn't keep costing more and more. Which we all know is what is going to happen.

Not so moronic if they can get the trucks to do the 40-50+ MPG that is claimed on the cars, and make them last the typical lifetime cycle to maximize ROI. Which one would think would be easy on the fleet type vehicles that get turned over every 100K or so.

IF they would settle down into a 300-350 HP system, they might be able to get that. I'm not talking about 3/4 and 1 ton trucks. I'm talking about the F150 and Dakota/Canyon size vehicles.
 
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