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Discussion Starter #1
This post was inspired by a post I read the other day on here about bartering. I took all that was said about skills and made a list of what skills would be good to have and ensure self preservation (example, the doctor is probably going to be pretty safe from harm), and a list of seeds I would to have to plant.

Skills:
First Aid/CPR and other medical skills- these are basic, easy to learn skills.
Ability to make medicines like penicillin- all drugs are derived from living organisms. Do some research on them and learn some basic chemistry.
Ability to desalinate and distill water
Ability to create fire
Ability to make weapons
Ability to mine for ore to make weapons
Ability to build shelter
Ability to build boats
Ability to harness, transfer and store solar power, and wind power.
Ability to grow food
Ability to hunt and trap animals, including fishing.


Seeds:
Tobacco
Cocoa beans
Cotton
Coffee Beans
Peanut seeds

Also, the knowledge and equipment for brewing homemade wines, beers, liquor and soda wouldn't hurt.


Feel free to add to this last.
 

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I got basic kits for beer and rootbeer from mrbeer.com, they are rather inexpensive and easy to make but I like them. I've seen the one for root beer at Walmart during the summer. I found over a dozen tiny Arabica coffee trees at Walmart in a very small pot two years ago in the tropical section around this time of the year. They are growing quite well in individual pots. To be honest you would need a lot of cotton to make anything, so maybe fabrics on sale would be the way to go. I would add sewing and raising animals for food (not as easy as it sounds) to the skills but I would subtract a few from your list because they are not practical. Learn about medicinal plants, most medications are derived from plants. Mining ores is definitely not practical, unless you are planning to move around a lot, since most mineral would not be close together, plus mining is the least of what you would need to do to be able to make anything with them. I have to add, if you don't already have some of the other skills that you list, I suggest you start now.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
The mining of ore was my husband's idea, lol. I think it was his way of convincing me that we need to be in the middle of the US instead of down in the tropics where I would rather be. Of course, where we end up is going to entirely depend on the situation that precluded our ending up there.

We're working on skills now.

I didn't know you could buy coffee plants at WalMart. Now I have to go there. Thanks.
 

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This post was inspired by a post I read the other day on here about bartering. I took all that was said about skills and made a list of what skills would be good to have and ensure self preservation (example, the doctor is probably going to be pretty safe from harm), and a list of seeds I would to have to plant.

Skills:
First Aid/CPR and other medical skills- these are basic, easy to learn skills.
Ability to make medicines like penicillin- all drugs are derived from living organisms. Do some research on them and learn some basic chemistry.Ability to desalinate and distill water
Ability to create fire
Ability to make weapons
Ability to mine for ore to make weapons
Ability to build shelter
Ability to build boats
Ability to harness, transfer and store solar power, and wind power.
Ability to grow food
Ability to hunt and trap animals, including fishing.


Seeds:
Tobacco
Cocoa beans
Cotton
Coffee Beans
Peanut seeds

Also, the knowledge and equipment for brewing homemade wines, beers, liquor and soda wouldn't hurt.


Feel free to add to this last.
That is alot easier said than done making/synthesising penicillin and many other drugs is pretty difficult while its sounds easy it isnt

and also for all your chem know how you also need a nice lab set up and to seperate out some of your more crazy chems from there natural source you need a nice and controlled heat source so your lookin at a decent mount of $$ in lab setup



a basic 24/40 organic chem set like this will run you around 300 and you dont want used esp if your making medicine least I wouldnt as i wouldnt want to risk risidual contamination from something else

then you need ring stands and other things to hold it up so add nother 100-200

and then a heat source a good heat source is between $500-$1000

just saying if you wanna make stuff right it is not easy nore cheap

and id recomend learning organic chem if your wanting to compoind medicines
 

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The mining of ore was my husband's idea, lol. I think it was his way of convincing me that we need to be in the middle of the US instead of down in the tropics where I would rather be. Of course, where we end up is going to entirely depend on the situation that precluded our ending up there.

We're working on skills now.

I didn't know you could buy coffee plants at WalMart. Now I have to go there. Thanks.
You usually can't find the coffee trees there but my brother used to grow coffee in his farm and I noticed the little plants seemed familiar. I looked at the tag and sure enough they were tiny coffee trees (about 2-3 inches tall). I heard they are not too hard to grow from seed.
 

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Ability to make moccasins and boots. Some deerskin with which to do it, leather glue, synthetic sinew, leather needles, awl, vise. Also, cowhide for soled moccasins and boots.

A setup to make wood gas, that can be used to power propane generators and converted motors. Or just the ability to make the device used to get the wood gas out of wood.

Tea, spices, hot sauce, molasses.
 

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I haven't seen candle making or gunsmithing mentioned? I wish I could learn both.
 

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Prepared Firebird
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Remember that old-time shoe repair shop that used to be in every town??? Shoes are going to be wearing out fast.....and few people are thinking about that. Nor, are they bothering to buy some extra pairs of good quality walking shoes to have in reserve, either. (And I do NOT mean flip-flops or Jimmy Choo high-heeled sandals, either. LOL)

I think anyone, who knows how to do shoe repair, would be welcomed anywhere. Shoe repair was a biggie in the 1930's Depression years. It probably will be, again.
 

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That is alot easier said than done making/synthesising penicillin and many other drugs is pretty difficult while its sounds easy it isnt

and also for all your chem know how you also need a nice lab set up and to seperate out some of your more crazy chems from there natural source you need a nice and controlled heat source so your lookin at a decent mount of $$ in lab setup



a basic 24/40 organic chem set like this will run you around 300 and you dont want used esp if your making medicine least I wouldnt as i wouldnt want to risk risidual contamination from something else

then you need ring stands and other things to hold it up so add nother 100-200

and then a heat source a good heat source is between $500-$1000

just saying if you wanna make stuff right it is not easy nore cheap

and id recomend learning organic chem if your wanting to compoind medicines
I think I agree with you that the original poster has no idea what he is talking about when it comes to "Ability to make medicines like penicillin- all drugs are derived from living organisms. Do some research on them and learn some basic chemistry."

Ability to make fire, weapons, and shelter, OK, but medicines? Why not just take up some basic rocketry so that you can build a Space Shuttle and go to Mars, the ultimate BOL?

Biosynthesis of penicillin is one of the highlights of the pharmaceutical world. You are not going to need some "basic chemistry", you are going to need some pretty advanced post-doc experience in medicinal chemistry. I am talking dozen+ years of experience. Just read what it takes to do it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penicillin#Biosynthesis . Good luck!

No, you are not going to need some Schlenck ware and ring stands. You'll need a set up that costs millions of dollars.

Of course, you can do something simpler (I've made asprin when I was an undergrad), but you'd need raw materials, appropriate instrumentation, etc. Again, lots of money, lots of experience in medicinal chemistry, just to make the active pharmaceutical ingredient (API).

Compounding, i.e., making the drug once you have the API is a seperate field of science.

I have a PhD from one of the top Chemistry University Departments in country, but I would not know where to start to make penicillin under the best of circumstances. And making it at my BOL? Forget it.

It you want to make "medicines" just concentrate on the "herbal medicines", in a vain of the Native American Indian medicinemen; trying to emulate a multibilion dollar industry after STHF is unrealistic.
 

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I think I agree with you that the original poster has no idea what he is talking about when it comes to "Ability to make medicines like penicillin- all drugs are derived from living organisms. Do some research on them and learn some basic chemistry."

Ability to make fire, weapons, and shelter, OK, but medicines? Why not just take up some basic rocketry so that you can build a Space Shuttle and go to Mars, the ultimate BOL?

Biosynthesis of penicillin is one of the highlights of the pharmaceutical world. You are not going to need some "basic chemistry", you are going to need some pretty advanced post-doc experience in medicinal chemistry. I am talking dozen+ years of experience. Just read what it takes to do it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penicillin#Biosynthesis . Good luck!

No, you are not going to need some Schlenck ware and ring stands. You'll need a set up that costs millions of dollars.

Of course, you can do something simpler (I've made asprin when I was an undergrad), but you'd need raw materials, appropriate instrumentation, etc. Again, lots of money, lots of experience in medicinal chemistry, just to make the active pharmaceutical ingredient (API).

Compounding, i.e., making the drug once you have the API is a seperate field of science.

I have a PhD from one of the top Chemistry University Departments in country, but I would not know where to start to make penicillin under the best of circumstances. And making it at my BOL? Forget it.

It you want to make "medicines" just concentrate on the "herbal medicines", in a vain of the Native American Indian medicinemen; trying to emulate a multibilion dollar industry after STHF is unrealistic.
I am fully aware the complexities in synthesising penicilin/ medicine and with a strong grasp of chemistry and a good chem set up you can creat simpler compounds while by no means is penicilin easily obtanable nor is it advisable to try
I have a real nice personal lab as I am a chem/bio major and like to do stupid things

and while I also understand the process of how penicilin is made thats the same as someone saying i understand how a cars made now ima go make one from scratch

with a good organic chem set you can feasably synthesise medicines pre
1900s ish if you have alot of know how and some real good reference matierial

But for the most part I believe we are on the same page I also do not advocate anyone without alot of know how to **** around with a lab set trying to creat something your energies are better spent elsewhere and you can seriously injure yourself if you dont know what your doing
 

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You'll probably want to add something like lentils... Every so many years you need to change the planting cycle in your gardens to replenish the nutrients (unless you stockpile fertilizer)
 

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You'll probably want to add something like lentils... Every so many years you need to change the planting cycle in your gardens to replenish the nutrients (unless you stockpile fertilizer)
I thought thats what the raiders were for?
 

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You usually can't find the coffee trees there but my brother used to grow coffee in his farm and I noticed the little plants seemed familiar. I looked at the tag and sure enough they were tiny coffee trees (about 2-3 inches tall). I heard they are not too hard to grow from seed.
How CUTE would that be??

*must get some*
*if only to make a point*
*because once you are buying bulk green beans and roasting them yourself there's only one place further to take this and that's growing your own*
 

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If we are talking about going -that- far back, we need to look at the 80/20 rule ... or in this case maybe 90/10. Back in the day when the streets were free and the air was clean (except for the soot from our wood fire) 90 percent of the population lived on a farm.

Ability to:
- Desalinate and distill water -- Collect and store first, learn to sanitize second.
- Create fire -- Start with a pile of box matches, but learn flint and steel eventually.
- Make weapons -- what you can buy now will be much better than anything you could make for a 100 years. If you are not a gunsmith now, forget about this. Maybe reloading or at least hoarding your used brass.
- Mine for ore to make weapons - no. Get steel from junk yards and collapsing bridges.
- Build shelter - with the massive die off - not for a long time. Use existing empty houses. Learn to repair. Learn to use hand tools - not power hand tools.
- Build boats - undecided. Learn all kinds of primitive transportation techniques. Ride horses much?
- Harness, transfer and store solar power, and wind power. -- get real! Windmills maybe. Learn to drill and distill petroleum. With the mass die off, our 100 year supply will last 1000 years. I don’t care what you believe -- Petroleum works! Coal Too!
- Grow food -- why so low on the list. This is what 90% of us will be doing.
- Ability to hunt and trap animals, including fishing. I would not want to count on wildlife. I believe too many other desperate people will view such as easy pickings and the wildlife population will be decimated. Learn to create - not just take. I’m thinkin chickens to start with.

Seeds:
Tobacco, Cocoa beans, Cotton, Coffee Beans - I’m thinking these are luxury items. Yes they may bring a good price from someone who knows how to grow a lot of wheat. If your land is limited, such a specialty may work out better. Cotton would take a lot of space. Maybe spices and such.

Peanut seeds - maybe. This is something you can eat.

If you are limited on space - maybe the production of seeds. All your harvest goes to making new seeds. I would add seed for staple foods.

Also, the knowledge and equipment for brewing homemade wines, beers, liquor and soda wouldn't hurt. - All Luxury items. If you can grow corn, what you don’t need to eat, you can trade for moonshine. Vice is a given. We can count on someone else providing it. You don’t want to be that guy, or gal.



I would list food as the first thing needed for long term survival. Yes, water - but that is needed for short term. 1:How can you grow and preserve food. 2:How can You grow and preserve Food. Then 3:HOW CAN YOU GROW AND PRESERVE FOOD.

I canned my first Strawberry Preserves last week. I went from owning zero mason jars to 27 dozen. Today I will can Loquat Preserves. Yup, I’m going to live the good life 60 feet underground in a shipping container eating Jams and Jellies.

... off course I plan to can other foods. I started with Strawberries because they were in season. While it was just a target of opportunity, it surely was a sweet one. I got the Loquats for free -- another opportunity. I need to learn and practice now. I’m also working on a garden and I need to be proficient at canning before all the crops come in.

I am using boxed pectin and an electric heat source in my canning - so Yes I Am Cheating. I’m trying to learn the easy way first. Will have to investigate some more primitive techniques in the future.

We can all work on learning to increase how much we reuse of what we already have. Look at all that you bring into your house today -- just to send it out on trash day. Think about how our life style will have to change. What will you need during the first three years that are simply too easy to buy now verses make then. Collect Antiques today. They may be our tools of tomorrow. (And you need to learn to use them.)

Suggestion: Learn how to make and put new sealing material on the canning jar lids. Even the reusable ones only last about 20 times.

To any SelfSustainingFamily, you are correct to think about how your family with fit into society and what barter items would be most valuable. I think that a focus on what you need most to be self sustaining is where you need to be. Barter item will be things (like food) that you have an overabundance of. This will me more chance than choice. We will get lucky where we least expect. That is what we will barter with.

Yes, we do each need to look at what special skills we already have and how such skills can be transferred back 100 years. If you are a machinist today, becoming a blacksmith tomorrow is logical. If you don’t build housed today, how are you going to start from zero and become better then one of today’s skilled carpenters.

The most valued skill may be that of a housewife. You can teach the kids how to use a washboard. Who thought we would have to watch Martha Stewart reruns to survive?
 
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