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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
We have a ford escape that is under mfg warranty including maintenance. Finally got an appointment to take it on Saturday for an oil change etc. The salesman we had dealt with was there. Now he's really a nice guy to talk to, very friendly. But he is still a salesman. Talked to us 3 times about possibly trading in our escape for a new one. Said he could match what we were paying. Well he couldn't, would have been over a $100.00 more per month. But he would keep us in mind. The '21 he got us test drive was the loaded version with almost all the bells and whistles on it. He had no of the less loaded models.

Anyway the lot had about 10 trucks on it. All 4wd packages. One f150 was over 76,000. The cheapest ranger was 40,000. Only high-end models left. The used car side was almost empty.

We talked to the woman in the service department after things were done. Now it took me 2 weeks to get a Saturday quick lane appointment. She was telling us that that was about normal now. Quick lane usually wasn't too bad. However the service department was now scheduling for 2 months out. So if you have a break down or something serious, I guess you're s.o.l.

I asked her when the 2022's were coming out. Her response was that she really wasn't sure, that they were still getting 2021's coming in. But she thought that a 2022 had come through for service but was not sure. Going to be interesting when the 22's are supposed to roll out but the 21'are still the only thing coming in.

The sales board in the show room, list's goals and current for the month. Say the sales goal was 70 for the month. Current was like 5. Pretty much the same for the other categories listed.
 

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Paleoconservative
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Most of the public doesn't know how a new car dealership operates. It is divided into two parts, fixed ops and variable ops. Fixed ops is service, parts departments, and bodyshop/collision center if the dealership has one, bigger ones do, smaller ones don't. The fixed ops revenue pays the dealership's bills and largely covers payroll.

The variable ops is new and used sales, wholesale, oh and also fleet sales if the dealership has one, again, bigger ones do, smaller ones may not. Variable ops revenue is the dealership's profit. Or loss, depending on how grim the prevailing economic/market conditions in the area or even nationwide may be at times.

The vehicles purchased from the manufacturer are most often on a financed auto floorplan. To ensure they dont get into trouble with cashflow or kill their profit per unit the dealership has to keep a damn close eye on its turn time and size of inventory. Turn time is how long the vehicle sits on the lot before it gets sold. Preferably 30 days or less, sometimes a bit longer for high end units, but every week is eating into profit potential. Inventory size needs to be large enough to attract wide range of customers, but not so large that dealership kills itself by inducing longer turn time because it overestimated its market.
 

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The core however is this.
The dealership in my area are also widely out of stock, although some uptick in stock has taken place. Most of it is used stuff and drastically over priced.

I had to go to Carvana for the Jeep because the 'deals" they had at the dealerships were anything but.


Alot of this is the dependency on foreign markets 9spicifically computer chips0 that are not made in the US because of the idiotic outsourcing.

Yes folks, were just starting this game.
 

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They're just getting the 2021 models in because Ford and Chevy have to do something with the strip mine and stadium parking lot full of vehicles they have. All of which have been waiting for these magical chips. We have made these vehicles more and more complicated for the sake of "innovation" and to keep someone in a job. They keep charging more and more money for these vehicles for stuff you don't need. How do people afford these things. I'm convinced people are not this rich. They are in debt well above their means with credit cards and payment plans. Like our government and national debt their personal debt is not sustainable.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Couple points
That 76,000 plus f150 is about 20,000 more than our little starter home we bought in 1990.

The same service woman told us that ford was trying to move in the direction of direct order. Go to the website and build up from the base model, get what you want, pick and choose. And per her should come out cheaper due to eliminating extras you don't want.
 

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The prices on new vehicle is outrageous. 40k for a Ranger? 76k For an f150? There is no way people can afford an 800 dollar payment for 6 years straight especially on a depreciating object that costs you money to operate it. This seems like a 2008 situation all over again just a different commodity.
 

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My car was built in 2006
Has done 269,000 miles.
Paid $18,000 second hand in 2009.
Air con, cruise, leather.
VW diesel.
Do my own servicing as I won't go to a stealership .

Wont get sucked in to buying a new car and lose a third of the asking price in the first year.

My car is worth less than $500 now, so losing $130 a year is a hit I can take!
 

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My car was built in 2006
Has done 269,000 miles.
Paid $18,000 second hand in 2009.
Air con, cruise, leather.
VW diesel.
Do my own servicing as I won't go to a stealership .

Wont get sucked in to buying a new car and lose a third of the asking price in the first year.

My car is worth less than $500 now, so losing $130 a year is a hit I can take!
Did you mean losing $130 a month?

I don't have a crystal ball but here are two thoughts that come to mind concerning buying a new car. Interest rates I think are about to go up because of inflation. This could make new cars much more expensive unless you have the cash. The second thing that concerns me is that my understanding that a large percentage of car computer chips come from Taiwan. I am concerned about China's aggressive stance towards the Island Nation which has never been ruled by the CCP. If a large number of chips are made there and China over runs them then it will be many years until the car market goes back to anything close to normal. Those hard to make chips can't be quickly made in another factory. It would take years to make the factory and equipment to make those chips.
 

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I believe moving foreward, dealers will have a couple of floor models of the different vehicles, and you will have to order what you want.
Bought my last 2 trucks that way- far better deals, no dealer installed crap, and no options I didn’t want. Dealers gets sale within a week of vehicle showing up, both dealers wanted deposit, but they just held check.
 

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My wife’s 02 Ford excursion Died is old and she wanted some thing new .
She bought a Nissan Rogue 🤷‍♂️ They where the only cars on a lot that you could buy .
I thing they are junk but what ever things are crazy now .
 

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My wife’s 02 Ford excursion Died is old and she wanted some thing new .
She bought a Nissan Rogue 🤷‍♂️ They where the only cars on a lot that you could buy .
I thing they are junk but what ever things are crazy now .
I'm wondering if the Excursion had the V-10 engine. I heard they weren't the best.

Nissan was great before Renault acquired part ownership.
 

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I'm wondering if the Excursion had the V-10 engine. I heard they weren't the best.

Nissan was great before Renault acquired part ownership.
No I had a 6.0 diesel nightmare instead , I had a Geico repair policy I pay 200 bucks and they fix it .
The policycost 7 bucks a month .
I have a bunch of rusty lines that Ford wanted 7k to fix , the insurance dosent cover rust ☹ so I’m going to fix them and sell it , it’s a good truck . I think KBB is 7k on it ? .
Wifey is just to crumbly to clim in to the 6” lifted truck with 35” tires .
 

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No I had a 6.0 diesel nightmare instead , I had a Geico repair policy I pay 200 bucks and they fix it .
The policycost 7 bucks a month .
I have a bunch of rusty lines that Ford wanted 7k to fix , the insurance dosent cover rust ☹ so I’m going to fix them and sell it , it’s a good truck . I think KBB is 7k on it ? .
Wifey is just to crumbly to clim in to the 6” lifted truck with 35” tires .
I thought the Ford Diesels were good but maybe I was recalling one of their other diesel engines.

Perhaps take out the lifts and put stock tires on it. If you sell it, it may be worth more than you think with the crazy used vehicle prices these days.
 

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The Wife was a Nissan Maxima fan. The ones she has had that were built in Japan were her favorites. The one built in the USA was a cheap POS. No more Nissan.
A relative had a couple of Nissan Maximas he loved. He bought a Titan some time after Renault took part control. $3K for a new or rebuilt rear axle. Less than 100K miles and never saw anything near hard use.
 

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Dirty Mind
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They're just getting the 2021 models in because Ford and Chevy have to do something with the strip mine and stadium parking lot full of vehicles they have. All of which have been waiting for these magical chips. We have made these vehicles more and more complicated for the sake of "innovation" and to keep someone in a job. They keep charging more and more money for these vehicles for stuff you don't need. How do people afford these things. I'm convinced people are not this rich. They are in debt well above their means with credit cards and payment plans. Like our government and national debt their personal debt is not sustainable.
Please do not forget all the epa regs manufacturers are forced to meet.
 

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I like the idea of direct order, I get exactly what I want and I don't get exactly what I don't want.

That said, nobody is making new trucks that I have any interest in. Four doors, 4wd, solid front axle, mechanical engagement of 4wd (no electrical or vacuum, I want to move metal by pulling levers).

Power windows, power locks, radio, air conditioning, heater. That's it. A backup camera would be nice IF it's situated to help with hooking up a trailer but it's nowhere near a necessity. Bluetooth for the radio would be nice, but I don't care if it doesn't have it. No seat heaters. No obnoxious TV screen in the dash. No remote start. If it's too cold to run out and start it ahead of time, man up and do it anyway.

I want a gauge for temperature and oil pressure. Why they don't all have that is bizarre.
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I wonder what the auto makers are going to do when they can't make a vehicle they can legally sell cheap enough for people to buy. Between the environmental genuflecting, the (IMO completely valid) safety measures, and the entirely unnecessary complexity that's entailed by such things, vehicles are becoming almost like aircraft.
 

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I picked up a very low mile 2020 Mustang this year. I was looking on Carvana , but figured I'd see what the local Ford dealers have. They had 2 used Mustangs, $30k each. I chose the one with the Ecoboost and the 6-speed.

Inside the showroom, nice used trucks and a 2019 Mach 1 convertible, for $66k. No new cars or trucks, the salesman said it was the chip shortage. And no haggling. I knew the prices before I walked in, wrapped up the deal in 45 minutes.

I see other remote lots where dealers store new cars until lot space opens up. One is on a local landfill. I see only a couple of rows of cars now where it seemed to go on forever only a year ago.
 
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