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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I want to package some food in Mylar bags, with oxygen absorbers and then seal the bag with hot iron. Would like to know if the following products are safe to put in the mylar bags and how long will they last in the bags. Lets say they will generally expire in 1 year, how much longer will they last in mylar bags?

Mashed Potatoes Betty Crocker Roasted Garlic 100% Real Mashed Potatoes 6.6 oz: Amazon.com: Grocery & Gourmet Food
Whole Wheat Spaghetti Barilla Whole Grain Spaghetti, 13.25 Ounce Boxes (Pack of 10): Amazon.com: Grocery & Gourmet Food
Honey Bunches of Oats Cereal Post Honey Bunches of Oats with Almonds Cereal, 2 24 oz Bags inside the 48-Ounce Box: Amazon.com: Grocery & Gourmet Food
Quaker Oatmeal Quaker Instant Oatmeal Maple Brown Sugar, 10-Count Boxes (Pack of 4): Amazon.com: Grocery & Gourmet Food
Wheat Flour
 

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Frozen Patriot
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I have potato pearls from LDS cannery in mylars/O2 absorbers no problems should be good for many years. I would think everything else on your list except the cereal should be good for a bunch of years also.
 

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Most of it would still be good for at least 10 years.

BYU has done several tests on such products.
 

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We have a lot of instant potatoes and whole wheat spaghetti stored in Mylar with 02. Along with instant gravy and spaghetti sauce!!!

We only keep enough cereal and powdered milk for about 90 days in original packaging.

Flour is not for Long Term Storage. It will not last no matter how packaged. Stock wheat and get a grinder. :)
 

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Trump=WhiteObama=BlkBush
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I haven't tried instant mashed potatoes in Mylar but regular spaghetti lasts a very long time. We eat 5 to 10 year old spaghetti routinely. Same with rice. No noticeable change in quality except that it takes a little longer to cook.

We store plain but instant oatmeal just fine. No reason to expect the flavored stuff to behave differently except that you'd have to take it out of the packaging. What good is an oxygen absorber if you put a sealed pack in that the oxygen can't be pulled from?

Boxed cereal generally has a 6 month or longer shelf life anyway. Just keep buying it fresh.
 

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Flour is not for Long Term Storage. It will not last no matter how packaged. Stock wheat and get a grinder. :)
LDS says it will last ten years, and I tend to view them as the experts in LTS. I guess I'll find out :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Thanks guys, so far I have this:

Spaghetti: 10 years, good to go in Mylar

Honey Bunches of Oats Cereal: Don't out in Maylar bags, rotate in their original packing. Good for only until the date listed on the product.

Mashed Potatoes: Does the Mashed Potatoes with Roasted Garlic flavor make any difference? I checked and it does not have any butter, cheese or milk product. I am going to take them out of their packaging and put them directly in mylar bags with O2 absorber. How long will it be good for?

Oatmeal: It is flavor with Maple and Brown Sugar, does this reduce it's life span in the mylar bag? If so, how long will it be good for?

Wheat Flour: Some say good in Mylar bags for 10 years, Some say, not good, use wheat and grinder, any more info if it is good in Mylar bags for atleast 5 years?
 

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Didn't have time earlier to post the links, so here ya go;

On oats;
http://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/cdm/singleitem/collection/IR/id/85/rec/3

Flour;
http://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/cdm/singleitem/collection/IR/id/91/rec/6

Dehydrated mashed potatoes;
http://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/cdm/singleitem/collection/IR/id/81/rec/13


For almost all my research it's through the department at BYU. Here's two different link with lots of good research on most types of food that's being stored for long term.
http://ndfs.byu.edu/Research/LongTermFoodStorageResearch/ResearchOnFoodStorage.aspx
http://contentdm.lib.byu.edu/cdm/se.../searchterm/LongTermFoodStorage/field/schola/

Here's a short Q&A;
http://magazine.byu.edu/?act=view&a=2197
 

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LDS says it will last ten years, and I tend to view them as the experts in LTS. I guess I'll find out :)
Do you have the capabilities they have for preparing it for storage i.e. a cannery?
 

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#10 can and mylar are equal for LTS according to LDS.
Can you provide a reference for that statement?

I ask because, if that's what they say, they would be absolutely wrong.

Metal cans have zero air infiltration. Not so for Mylar. And there are definitely different qualities within Mylar. 3.5 mil Mylar allows air infiltration many hundreds of times faster than 7 mil Mylar. Additionally, all Mylar is more fragile in handling and, again, 3.5 mil Mylar is hugely more fragile than 7 mil Mylar - especially when packaging items with sharp ends, like spaghetti. Read the specs on various Mylar products at Sorbent Systems: http://www.sorbentsystems.com/

See my posts starting at post #10 in this thread on vacuum sealing: http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=29124

stephpd, the BYU studies are interesting reading but the food they have tested for long-term storage is not tested for flavor or for nutrition value. It's tested for acceptability for emergency use.

All flour maintained >90% acceptance for use in emergency situations (Figure 1), indicating that people would use the flour for baking in emergency situations. For everyday use, one flour sample (7 years) fell below 50% acceptance (Figure 2).
This same "acceptance for use in emergency situations" is the criteria for all of the BYU studies I have read. Just because you'd eat it doesn't mean it will sustain you - or that it won't. I'm just saying that the answers aren't that clear.

What is clear, is that whole grain wheat will not only taste great - a much higher standard than "acceptance for use in emergency situations" - but it is healthy and nutritious as well. Rather than storing flour, my recommendation is to store wheat and grind flour as needed. That said, I do keep small amounts of flour, 20 pounds or so, packed in heavy Mylar for my short term storage - that storage intended to carry my family through disasters from which our markets eventually recover. For long-term, multi-year or forever disasters, I keep whole grain.
 

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Speaking of the whole grains and a grinder ...

I looked on Amazon and they have grain grinders from $10.00 (or less) to well into the hundreds of dollars.
I know there are big differences in the ones shown there and the prices would naturally reflect that but will the $15 to $25.00, hand cranked, small capacity mill work good enough to grind out some flour for bread etc ?
 

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Look at many of those studies. Metal cans leak air too. They often give the ranges of O2 found in them before opening. I've read many of them an even in metal cans they find O2 almost as high as what's in the air, although they may not see a bad seal.

They also use a hedonic system of rating tastes.
Like this portion of one report;
"Mean hedonic scores for aroma and appearance of flour are shown in Table 1. Aroma scores ranged from 5.08 to 6.87, and appearance scores ranged from 6.83-7.35."

They also often look at other things too, like bread rise, color, free fatty acids and hexanal values.

Even the one on potato flakes, though all the sample were very fresh showed that brands differ quite a bit in flavor;
"Hedonic Scores for aroma ranged from 4.9 to 6.8 (Fig. 3).
Flavor varied greatly from brand to brand and ranged from 3.6
to 6.5. Texture showed the least amount of variation among
brands, ranging from 5.1 to 6.4. Overall acceptability ranged
from 4.0 to 6.5. Flavor scores mirrored overall acceptability
scores, indicating the importance of flavor in judging overall
acceptability.'




In a perfect world metal cans should beat out Mylar bags hands down. But from reading many of these studies it would appear that lots of them weren't done correctly. Either all the O2 wasn't removed or they leaked over time.

Mistakes, storage and a bunch of other things can change what's been stored into something less desirable.

One of my favorite is Lowdown3's look at LTS of rice over a couple decades in just a plastic bucket.

For bulk storage Mylar in plastic buckets/ with O2 absorbers is an easy and acceptable way of putting up dried goods. Metal cans would be better but even the LDS have adopted the use of Mylar and O2 absorbers as almost as good as metal cans.
 

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Mylar bags are quite expnsive. Your better off using food grade buckets that seal. Will need a bung to open. Again going to repeat. Put all grains you are storing in freezer for min of 5 hrs to kill larvae before storing. Nothing worse than opening container and finding bugs have hatched from eggs. ALL grains bought have larvae in them just can;t see them. I have 5 gal buckets filled with oatmeal, noodkles , dry onion etc.
 

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Had some wheat and a grinder. Found out I would rather store flour than grind as it looks like a lot of wheat but you get very little flour out of it. Just sharing my experience.
 

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Flour is not for Long Term Storage. It will not last no matter how packaged. Stock wheat and get a grinder. :)
I had NO IDEA! Thanks for teaching me something new today! Ive got to investigate my options now.

Stupid as hell question... where do you obtain wheat?? Bread is a great food for energy, would be very important for cooking!

Andrew
 

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Do you have the capabilities they have for preparing it for storage i.e. a cannery?
Yes. I buy stuff from the cannery all the time. Also, they use Mylar with oxygen absorbers as well as cans.
 

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Mylar bags are quite expnsive. Your better off using food grade buckets that seal. Will need a bung to open. Again going to repeat. Put all grains you are storing in freezer for min of 5 hrs to kill larvae before storing. Nothing worse than opening container and finding bugs have hatched from eggs. ALL grains bought have larvae in them just can;t see them. I have 5 gal buckets filled with oatmeal, noodkles , dry onion etc.
Buckets are not an O2 barrier. The O2 can infiltrate the bucket right through the plastic itself. That's the purpose of the mylar, to keep the O2 out. And if you use an O2 absorber, you don't have any insect issue, nor any oxidation due to O2.

Just putting food in buckets is not a long term storage solution.

It's always best to package foods like the long term storage companies are doing it. They have lab tests to prove that they're doing it right. It's real easy to make mistakes and a lot of things that "seem like they should work" don't.
 

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Can you provide a reference for that statement?

I ask because, if that's what they say, they would be absolutely wrong.

Metal cans have zero air infiltration. Not so for Mylar. And there are definitely different qualities within Mylar. 3.5 mil Mylar allows air infiltration many hundreds of times faster than 7 mil Mylar. Additionally, all Mylar is more fragile in handling and, again, 3.5 mil Mylar is hugely more fragile than 7 mil Mylar - especially when packaging items with sharp ends, like spaghetti. Read the specs on various Mylar products at Sorbent Systems: http://www.sorbentsystems.com/
LDS only sells 7 mil mylar and it's all I use.

They list the storage life the same for cans and mylar and I still believe them:

http://www.providentliving.org/pfw/multimedia/files/pfw/pdf/123141_HSC_OrderFormUS_EngNov2011_pdf.pdf

It amazes me that people use and promote inferior mylar when they could get a better product that's usually cheaper. I have 300+ lbs of pasta stored and never had a failure.
 

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GrowingFromScratch.com
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It would be very helpful to have a sticked master thread on this subject with a compilation of threads discussing "how long does _____ last" in mylar and 02's.
 
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