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Just curious what folks would do in a serious SHTF situation- that consisted of civil unrest or martial law, etc. And you knew you didn't want to deal with that,

This is our situation:
If you had access to land that had a water supply but no shelter on it, and winter was coming on, would you stay put in the city and hunker down or try to get to the BOL instead, knowing you had no shelter other than a tent? What would you do?
 

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I'd stay put. But I'm in a fairly rural area with wooded areas and a large piece of property. I truly think most unprepared folks would head towards the cities and that's ok by me.

So I'll stay put initially.
 

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Spirit of the Wolf
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Bug out , you can build a decent temp shelter
Agreed. Shelters can be made, but but you can't make water appear out of thin air. If the locale is safe, then natural materials would suffice for a sturdy, decently insulated shelter, built around the tent. It might be a bit rough going, but humans are remarkable at adaptation, when circumstances warrant.
 

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Depends on how bad the winters are at your BOL. Does your camping gear meet or exceed the weather you will face? Will it stand up to continual use? Do you have the skills and tools to build not just a temp. shelter but a long term one? Can you build a working fireplace or are you bringing a wood stove? Do you have a clue on how much wood you will need to gather for cooking and warmth? Not to mention how much of your time this will take. What about food? As long as the utilities are still on, and your're not in extreme danger, stay where you are and work on gathering the things you will need to move to your BOL. Don't let your ego be your family's headstone.
 

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Depends on how bad the winters are at your BOL. Does your camping gear meet or exceed the weather you will face? Will it stand up to continual use? Do you have the skills and tools to build not just a temp. shelter but a long term one? Can you build a working fireplace or are you bringing a wood stove? Do you have a clue on how much wood you will need to gather for cooking and warmth? Not to mention how much of your time this will take. What about food? As long as the utilities are still on, and your're not in extreme danger, stay where you are and work on gathering the things you will need to move to your BOL. Don't let your ego be your family's headstone.
It's all here, dude...
 

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Super Gassy Moderator
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If you're properly prepared, you can live out of your tent while you build a more permanent shelter. Build the shelter with whatever resources you have the most of. Remember, the early settlers lived in homes made from sod, some of them for many years, until they could build a home with wood. A home made from stone is about as solid as they get too. Then there's adobe. Figure out what resources are most available at the location, then begin studying how to build with it.
 

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veldskoen no socks
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Agreed, water is harder than a shelter.
Plans for a shelter can be found easily, for water however............
 

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Beginner's Mind
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I also agree. Pine needles and branches around a tent can add lots of insulation but you won't be early risers. I've hauled water and it is a huge pain in the ***. I'd rather take my chances in a tent than with a bunch of crazed city people.

I've lived where the winter got to -25 degrees every winter and all I had for plumbing was an outhouse. I lived in continual fear that my butt would someday freeze to the seat and I'd die before it thawed.
 

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Saw the video. Most of the work was done over a couple of summers Ie.cutting the wood/locating and moving the wood. Plus he was very experience and resupplied by air. If supplies were prepositioned the person with the post would still have problems hauling the timbers for the walls ect. Not to mention all the other chores involved with winter camping. Don't forget this is taking place during the winter. If you have no choice you have no choice. If you have a large enough group with atvs you could maybe get it done. If the weather stayed good. But if its just you and your family,I'd do all I could to hold out till spring. Then head out. Trying to live reality like a fantasy will get you killed.
 

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Just curious what folks would do in a serious SHTF situation- that consisted of civil unrest or martial law, etc. And you knew you didn't want to deal with that,

This is our situation:
If you had access to land that had a water supply but no shelter on it, and winter was coming on, would you stay put in the city and hunker down or try to get to the BOL instead, knowing you had no shelter other than a tent? What would you do?
I'd get the shelter up NOW and get out when it was time. A city is not the place to be in a SHTF scenario.
Earth shelters would be the warmest in the winter time, and some are quite nice. At least through the winter, that might be the best thing.
Yurts are also very comfortable even in cold climates and can be set up quickly.
Although I love log cabins, they are not the warmest possible structures, and they should not be built without seasoning the wood first, which takes some time. But they, and most everything else, sure does beat your average tent in wintertime! There are expedition quality tents that have been to the coldest lands in winter time, but they don't sell them at Walmart.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Thanks for the interesting answers, everyone.

Our problem at this time is, my spouse is unemployed and has been since July, no unemployment checks yet. I am working part time as a substitute. We can't pay our bills let alone build any kind of a shelter.
We suddenly became one check away from the streets.

Where the land is, its all narly pinyon pine and cedar. Not building material. Good firewood, but not for building anything. We have enough trees for fair cover and huge rocks around. Digging in that ground is insane because of the rocks.

We have some pretty sturdy camping stuff, and a small portable antique kerosene heater that would suffice until we got situated. An earthen, below ground shelter would be ideal, but access to roofing materials like beams would be tricky. I've thought about this for a long long time. We've got LOTS of tools and a full size 2 wheel drive truck with a shell on it. That's better than a tent in the winter. Wind is fierce down there and its about 8500 ft elevation. Can get pretty cold.

Looks like we'll be needing this place sooner rather than later, by the look of things.
 

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AAAH GET TO ZE CHOPPA!
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The two times I visited Colorado during the winter it was beautiful but COLD... yes water is very important to survival, but exposure to the elements can kill you more quickly than thirst. As others have suggested, I would plot out the materials and prepare the area for a temporary shelter before snow falls, just in case... but with my (lack of) experience in winter camping, I would have better luck staying close to a city near the BOL and sleeping in a truck with lots of blankets and camping gear, using other forms of shelter when available. It would have to be pretty darned apocalyptic for you to stand better odds of survival alone in the winter wilderness, with only a truck as shelter. You don't want to be this guy:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_McCandless

For living out of your car... I would recommend getting a small power inverter so that you have a means of powering a laptop, charging a cell phone, inflating an air mattress, etc. I still stand by my statement of being around some kind of civil infrastructure for as long as possible when living out of a vehicle, for three reasons:

1. Civil infrastructure is designed to accommodate people and vehicles; mother nature is not.
2. More potential shelter, aid, materials etc. available
3. Its the environment you have the most experience living in. If you don't already have experience living in the winter wilds, a crisis is not the time to start learning.

I don't mean to sound too opinionated; I'm not a survivalist veteran or anything. I just try to keep realistic expectations of what I am really capable of in a crisis. I have received a lot of inspiration on this forum, but some of my measures that looked good on paper were revised heavily when I actually tested them in the field.

Good luck in your endeavors!
 
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Discussion Starter #16
The two times I visited Colorado during the winter it was beautiful but COLD...
I don't mean to sound too opinionated; I'm not a survivalist veteran or anything. I just try to keep realistic expectations of what I am really capable of in a crisis. I have received a lot of inspiration on this forum, but some of my measures that looked good on paper were revised heavily when I actually tested them in the field.

Good luck in your endeavors!
You are correct about urban areas being more inducive to survival materials. I just can't stand the thought of being under martial law and the consequences of that. I can't wrap my mind around being enslaved by jackbooted thugs. I would still tend to consider taking my chances in a camoflaged truck and relative freedom over enslavement.

We aren't some sort of survival experts ourselves, but the biggest issue at the place where our BOL is, is the wind. There are unbelievable winds and powerful gusts down there. No tent would last very long no matter how well you tie them down. We've proven that.
 

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thepostmandelivers
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And i'm guessing that's before the chinooks come rolling in. How about old mines near your bol?if ther are any of those nearby that could solve your shelter probs. You don't have to go in to far to be sheltered.
 

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Beg to differ about water appearing out of thin air. Water can appear out of thin air and here is how you do it:

Get a piece of plastic sheeting or canvas. String between a couple of limbs or anything else you can support with at an angle. Place a container under the sheet over night. Next morning after the dew falls you will have a good amount of water depending on the humidity at the time.

Another method:

Dig a hole in the ground. Place a container in the bottom. Place a sheet of plastic over the hole with it sagging in the middle. Moisture from the ground will condense on the underside of the plastic and drip into the container. How much you get will depend on the moisture content of the ground and also the temperature of the air on top of the plastic.

Just some advice from some prior military training.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
And i'm guessing that's before the chinooks come rolling in. How about old mines near your bol?if ther are any of those nearby that could solve your shelter probs. You don't have to go in to far to be sheltered.
Actually, there are a bunch of them. They are pretty far back away from us, tho. We went looking for them this summer but couldn't find them yet. We were on ATVs and remote trails. Bear and cougar country. Pretty tough area.
 

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That All depends.... A tent seems like a viable answer for the short term....How long are you talking?
Water is a priority. With water you also have food such as game, fish and a variety or edible plants. I would stay and if you plan on being there forever build a shelter such as adobby or a dug out. Keep in mind the Native Americans lived in Teepees all winter long since the dawn of time. But that is my 2 cents worth.
 
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