[Nafix]

Long ago I made the decision to purchase a pistol when I was of age. That age is finally near.

I've been around guns for a while; I use (most obviously) shotguns and rifles, given my age. However, I'm now in the market for my first pistol. When my birthday comes here in the next few weeks, I want to be ready to make an informed buy I won't regret.

Here's where you guys come in: I need some advice/direction.

I've considered the different calibers and ultimately decide I wanted to go - at minimum - with 9mm. I've also tossed around the idea of a .45 (given that several of the officers I work with carry it), but decided that I'd go with the happy medium: .40 S&W.

Ah, but so many guns to pick from! Where do I start? The selection of handguns I have shot is somewhat limited (.357, .38 [revolvers], 9mm Beretta 92fs and Glock 22).

At first I was leaning towards the Beretta: I loved the feel of it, the recoil was extremely light and I was pretty accurate with it for not shooting pistols on a regular basis.

But then I took my mom's boyfriends Glock 22 out to the range. Obviously recoil abounded comparatively, but man was it a manageable gun. Moreover, it was sleek as hell. I loved the feel and especally the action and (although the range is not a practical application for it) the increased power of the gun. Granted I was not as accurate with the Glock as with the 92fs, but I think that was more of a practice deficiency that could (and would) be corrected.

So what do you guys think? Is the Glock 22 a solid choice?

A summary for the too long/didn't read crowd:
*I'm leaning toward the Glock 22 as my first pistol.
*I want to use the pistol for the purposes of:
1)target shooting, 2)side arm when I go out to my friends land in south Texas, and (probably) as a 3)concealed carry weapon.
*I desire something that will last forever, be reliable and effective.
*Price point: I have about 600 bux allocated for this "investment."

Questions I have:
*Is .40 cal the most pragmatic? (I would assume it's a good middle ground in terms of power and capacity between 9mm and .45)
*Are their other .40 cal pistols I should seriously give a look to? (Springfield I hear has some good ones, as well as H&K)
*Is there any reason (given misfires etc) that I would want to get a double-action gun? (or is training for the re-seating of the clip and re-jacking the slide enough, if you're prepared)
*Advice me away!

So, my friends, educate me! As always I love this board and the friendly honest advice and opinions therein. Thank you all! :thumb:

 

[Brother Buck]

I like both the Glock and the Beretta. If the Glock is comfortable to you and you like it it's a good way to go but never ever and I mean ever shoot lead bullets through it.
Only jacketed or plated bullets unless you install and aftermarket barrel.
The polygonal rifling in the Glock clogs up and that's causes pressures to skyrocket hence the much fabled rarely actually seen kaboom.
HKs are the same.
The Beretta does not have this issue but may not have the lifespan of the Glock.
Springfield imports the XD wit=ch would also be an outstanding choice.
Mybe look into them.
I like the second strike on a misfire capability of the Beretta.
Whatever you get buy the mags NOW.
Lots of them.

BTW .40 is a fine choice.

 

[Nafix]

never ever and I mean ever shoot bullets through it [the glock].

Can you elaborate a little more? I've heard people here (as well as other places) discuss the "exploding glock" issue. I've read a little on it, but don't really understand it. Is it a function of build up getting in the barrel and the higher pressure causing the barrel to bust? Other than keeping it clean, what are ones options to reduce this?

Is there only a specific type of ammo one should use?

I'll look into the XD more. I was also just reading a thread here about the Kimber Pro Carry II in .45 ACP. HOT. But I don't think a 7 round capacity is practical for my applications. (?)

 

[boronsbote]

Polygonal profile and (self-made) bullets made of lead don´t comply.

It isn´t a glock thing, more a polygonal profile- thing.

If you use jacketed/ plated ammo - everything should be fine.

 

[Apocalypse Now]

As long as you like the feel of a Glock in your hand (many people don't) then you will be happy with other aspects of the gun. Glocks are the lightest pistols on the market, good reputation for reliability, fairly accurate, holster friendly,and easy to disassemble (as are almost any polymer pistol on the market.) .40 IS the happy medium for power and mag capacity. I would also check out the Glock 23 ,which has slightly smaller dimensions than the G22. There are a lot of solid pistols in $450-$700 range , so spend the time to peruse them all.

 

[danpauselius]

I say 9mm, here's why ...

You say you are just now coming of age to be allowed to purchase a pistol, so I'm assuming you don't roll around in money. Practice is your best friend when it comes to any firearm. 9mm is about as cheap as you're gonna get and still have a healthy number of choices with regards to makes and models.

While I agree that .40 S&W is a good all-around cartridge, it may become cost prohibitive and the greater recoil may make it harder for you to learn proper technique.

Just my 2 cents ... 1 and a half cents .... 3/4 of a cent ... damn, this inflation stuff sucks!

 

[Brother Buck]

Can you elaborate a little more? I've heard people here (as well as other places) discuss the "exploding glock" issue. I've read a little on it, but don't really understand it. Is it a function of build up getting in the barrel and the higher pressure causing the barrel to bust? Other than keeping it clean, what are ones options to reduce this?

Sorry, I went back and edited the stupidity out of my post. Yeah, lead bullets are like butter in a polygonal barrel.
The lead builds up and constricts the bore resulting in higher pressures until BOOM.
There are those who will tell you the lack of support on the rear of the case in the Glock causes this.
It very remotely may be possible but I have bust thousands of round through one G23 and a G29 from weak range loads to real heaters....never an issue.
Speaking of range pistols.
Our local range rents a G22 and 23. They never ever clean them. It is child abuse I'm tellin' you. If a Glock was going to KB over the lack of case support it would happen to a range pistol.
The reason it does not is they use plated bullets.
You could avoid the issue altogether by getting a cut rifled barrel from Lone Wolf or Barsto and shoot anything you want.
They are about $100 to $150 unless you go nuts.

Is there only a specific type of ammo one should use?

No lead, I don't care if some numbnuts tells you it's really hard high tin/antimony lead....No LEAD.

I'll look into the XD more. I was also just reading a thread here about the Kimber Pro Carry II in .45 ACP. HOT. But I don't think a 7 round capacity is practical for my applications. (?)

Kimber...eehh.... overpriced IMO. It's like buying a Cadillac Escalade with all the unnecessary bling for 50k rather than a Chevy that just works for 35k.

 

[DocYoung]

9mm glock 17/19.

I have the 17 and 23 among others.

I feel ,IMHO, that the glock in 40 seems to have more bite to it then the glock in 45. There have been a few others say the same so I know I'm not completely off in this statement.

My first choice with CCW, SHTF, combat whatever is the glock 17. Its combat proven and hands down the most reliable handgun on the market.

I like the sig but its pricey. The xd, kimber, or beretta are not reliable enough for my tastes but then again I've been called a "gun snob".

 

[Nafix]

I say 9mm, here's why ...

I've given these points some consideration. Your recap makes me consider them again; they are extremely valid. Last I remember, the disparity between a box (of equal count) 9mm vs .40 S&W wasn't that different. Obviously the .40 was more expensive, but not by a lot.

Glancing at some of the bulk buys (which I might use for target shooting, but never for conceal carry purposes) it seems that the .40 is about .28 cents a round whereas the same type of bulk ammo is .23 and a half in 9mm.

Again, I defer to you; I'm lacking in experience. Just curious as to prices.

As to stopping power for CW purposes, I'm sure a 9mm would do the job: would a .40 do it better?

A question for those of you with the 22 and/or 23 Glock:
If I'm going to conceal carry, is the 23 worth the diminished magazine capacity? I'd like a larger frame beacuse of my handsize and feel, so if I can get away with the larger frame and still conceal it, I'd like to.

Thanks again guys; you're awesome!

 

[Nafix]

Bump for glock 22 vs 23 carry questions.

 

[Apocalypse Now]

I don't see a big difference in 13rds G23 or 15rds in the G22 , you say the G22 fits your hand the best ,then that should be your main priority. Blackhawk makes tactical holsters for both guns and both guns are light weight. The G23 would be best for my smaller hands , but it appears that the G22 suits you more, with the right holster you can conceal either one.

 

[Nafix]

....with the right holster you can conceal either one.

I suppose that's what I lack knowledge about: how to conceal a gun.

I realize there are a lot of factors at play (the size of the gun, your build, what clothes you wear etc). What's the best way to figure out how to conceal it well? I've tried to do some cursory searches here and haven't found anything that definitive.

I'll check out the black hawk stuff... is there a specific model/style you'd recommend? Anyone else?

And thanks a lot Apocalypse!

 

[birdman]

I prefer the .45acp over the .40S&W because the .45 has a "softer" percieved recoil given a similar shooting platform. This happens because the .40S&W is a high pressure round with a fast impulse spike (the pressure rises faster) than the .45acp giving the recoil a sharp "slap" vs a softer "push" in your hand.

.45 ammo tends to be less expensive and more available than .40S&W. They have a softer recoil and better terminal ballistics. The only downsides of the .45 over the .40 is round capacity and concealability.

Allan

 

[Nafix]

Allan: that's extremely interesting. I never drew the connection between pressure buildup rate and recoil directly like that.

If I had my druthers I'd go for a .45 BUT I really do want that concealability (I'm already worried about the Glock 22's full size being to cumbersome). To go with a subcompact .45, I'd miss out on the ammo capacity I really want.

 

[tnrick55]

get a ruger mark seares 22lr

 

[birdman]

Allan: that's extremely interesting. I never drew the connection between pressure buildup rate and recoil directly like that.

If I had my druthers I'd go for a .45 BUT I really do want that concealability (I'm already worried about the Glock 22's full size being to cumbersome). To go with a subcompact .45, I'd miss out on the ammo capacity I really want.

FWIW I carry a Kimber Ultra CDP II 3" .45acp with a 7+1 (total 8 rounds) capacity every single day. Weighs about 24 oz. Shoots well and is very comfortable to carry (sometimes I have to touch it just to make sure it's still there.)

If you're looking for a double action, you might consider a Para-Ordinance LDA sub-compact pistol OR, if you want to stay with a Glock, then look at the G30 or G36. The G36 is about the same size as my Kimber but holds 1 less round (IIRC). The G30 has a 10 round doublestack magazine plus 1 up the pipe. Both are nice guns (I've had a G30, but not shot the G36 yet.)

Allan

 

[Nafix]

Allen: I'm going to check that out. I don't have to have something double action; I believe with enough training, any problems I could have with a single action will be eliminated.

Let me ask you this though: What is the "target number" (excuse the pun) of ammo that one wants to carry in a concealed gun, ready to go?

8 or 10 .45 rounds vs 15-17 .40 rounds. I guess it goes to the individual situation and the proficiency of your shooting. (Granted, it should only take two or three center mass).

 

[bearpoop]

Here's a vote for the Springfield XD. I've owned one in .40 cal for about a year now and have never had a problem with it. I still want to add a Glock to the collection someday, but right now i couldn't be happier with my XD40.

BTW I had the same goal as you when I was your age, and I bought my first handgun of my own on my 21st birthday. You clearly have your priorities straight young man!:thumb:

 

[Paulycracker]

You sound like you are convinced on a Glock, so sway you I won't. But get a 19. Less costly and takes the bigger and shorter mags. Best pistol for the money out there. 40 is middle, yes, but it's about as costly as 45. I wouldn't want to pay for either 40 or 45 if it was my only pistol to practice with because I'd practice a lot if you are going to carry.

 

[DocYoung]

Allen: I'm going to check that out. I don't have to have something double action; I believe with enough training, any problems I could have with a single action will be eliminated.

Let me ask you this though: What is the "target number" (excuse the pun) of ammo that one wants to carry in a concealed gun, ready to go?

8 or 10 .45 rounds vs 15-17 .40 rounds. I guess it goes to the individual situation and the proficiency of your shooting. (Granted, it should only take two or three center mass).

I have 20 rounds in my g17, thats with the +2 mag base. This is my everyday carry. People seem to disbelieve that you can CCW a g17 with a teeshirt and boxer shorts. If the 1911 is your cup of tea (bleck) then it is the same size as the g17. As for the "grip size", with a glock there is no noticeable difference between the 19/17/23/22/34/35. Though a touch bit smaller length they are all the sameish width. The grip on the 17 and 23, to me seems smaller then my friends para 13 or 14 (or whatever the hell it is).

As for the 9 vs 40 vs 45. Its all hear say. All will work fine, for me I like more rounds. I've been on the two way range more then once. I've known many people who still frequent the two way also, not one has ever said "damn I brought to many rounds". I have heard a couple of "oh **** I'm out". Me, I'd rather come home with too many then come home with not enough as one of those choices means you lose.

I'm not down playing the 45 round. It is a more powerful bullet. I can tell you that the guy getting shot wont be able to say "hey this was a 9mm" or "hey that was a 45". They both hurt like hell (more so burn like hell) as I have a scar from small arms fire. Though I didnt stop to ask what he was shooting, a 45 would have done no more damage then was done. With this in mind I would rather have a great 9mm shot placement then a poor 45 shot placement. My point in all this is use what is comfortable to you. Not what john q thinks is best.