Most phones now have a small back-up battery hidden in them. For locating you when you riot........ So maybe just leave it at home.

 

Maybe some tin foil in there too,huh?
Possibly newer smartphones may have a small button battery in there, but that's where our dumb phones still shine.
I've already had mine open, nothing in there that shouldn't be.

 

Or better yet, don't go to a riot.

 

People should fight for what they believe in rather than being quiet, submissive, and unquestioning of authority. .:thumb:

 

lol...yeah if I ever actually go to a riot..it won't be my cell phone they'll need to worry about.

but i can see where this tech use could get to be a problem.. we have literally been located in the midst of 2 riots so far in our city...both during music concert festival events...one was a full on fight, the other was a flash mob riot...in both cases we were working the event as vendors so while our phones would have shown up on the proximity detector we'd have to file paperwork later I guess that proved we were hired to be there legitimately.

 

To many people have there phones shoved you know where.

 

Just for poops & giggles -- My old crap-berry and the Wifeys LG - have been sitting in the dry sink since 2005 - the batteries seem pretty dead -- I plugged them in --- memory still intact --- its a Festiveivus Miracle --

 

That is stored on non-volatile memory, like a flash drive or a hard disk drive. It does not require power to retain the data. Usually it is stored on the SIM card, which again does not need power to save the data. It is like a memory card.

 

I know -- I was making a point ---

And my $5 bill under the battery is gone !

 

http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20...5923907/even-powering-down-cell-phone-cant-keep-nsa-tracking-its-location.shtml

You don't need to have your phone turned on in order to be tracked.

 

Most modern phones do not actually turn off when the button is pressed, but go into a form of sleep mode (iPhones are notorious for this). Pulling the batter will work on most, but if you're really paranoid there are a few companies that sell RFID shells for the newer phones that block all signals. I just use a throwaway phone when I want to be anonymous. :

 

Well, if you pull the battery and wrap the phone in al foil, you are safe.

 

I must disagree- if you simply wrap a cell phone with foil all you've done is provided the wee beastie a much larger antenna that will send out a much stronger signal in some cases. So, to correctly ground it, its foil, insulator (it MUST cover 100%) then another layer of foil it'll stop better than 99% of all radio signals. That last 1% would be far less than 1 bar,,,,in theory, trackable. Realistically? Meh, wouldn't take money on that bet. If you're REALLY paranoid it'd be foil, insulator, foil, insulator, foil- provided nothing shorted out, it would talk divine intervention to get a signal through that.

 

Supposedly this tech was used at Occupy Wall Street, to round up the social media reporters. That was not a riot just a protest.

 

Possession of a phone is granting permission to be tracked in every detail, and not just by the government, but by anyone and everyone. Stores do it now.

 

So you leave your phone at home and present the location records as proof you weren't there? Besides riot damage is not covered under the blackberry warranty.

 

I guess I'm left wondering how well governments in general trust telephone service providers. Soldiers, government employees themselves, law enforcement, etc. all have cellphones. If that data is so easy to get, what sort of arrangements do governments have with cell providers to ensure that they, the governments themselves, aren't exposed by rogue employees at these companies, competiing political factions, terrorists, etc?

Or perhaps the manufacturers of the phones? Presumably China is making most of them these days -- so in order for such a pervasive lookup technology to be trustable for a government that wants to crack down on its citizens, you'd need some sort of mechanism to make sure the government, cell providers, and China/manufacturers all keep the details secret and lock-tight.

I obvioisly don't know, but something doesn't seem quite right in the assumptions here.

 

"The Find"
http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20...5923907/even-powering-down-cell-phone-cant-keep-nsa-tracking-its-location.shtml

http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_t...013/07/22/nsa_can_reportedly_track_cellphones_even_when_they_re_turned_off.html

"Co-Traveller"
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2013/12/meet-co-traveler-nsas-cell-phone-location-tracking-program

"Trigger-Fish"
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/11/14/104215/56/181/660871

 

Once again, powering down, is not the same as removing the battery. If you really really don't want to be tracked, take out the battery.

Then stay off any toll roads.

And don't drive by any license plate readers (common with major police departments)

And don't buy anything with a credit card, like gas, or food.

And don't forget about the drones.

 

Cameras at every gas station, bank, ATM, store etc.

 

you don't want to go to a riot. A couple years ago the G20 was in Pittsburgh and I was working at a level I hospital in the area. There were protestors everywhere so they shut down wings and had some of us ICU nurses stay over in case any of the dignitaries got hurt there would be extra nurses on hand. My friend lived local and decided to drive home, the riot police were out and routed her down a "safe" route a road or two over from the protestors. As she was driving down the road the group of protestors ran onto her road and the riot police popped tear gas, it came in through her vents and she was brought by ambulance back to the hospital, they treated her in the ER and she came back upstairs and spent the night with us. Point is get away from anywhere this is a riot as quickly as possible or stay in a place with armed guards.

 

Many people seem to confuse "off" with "standby". Just because the screen and LEDs are not glowing does not mean the phone is "off". STANDBY is the state where the phone is still making periodic GPS fix and cell tower communication. A phone can stay on standby for several days, "dumb" phones (but with GPS) could be on standby for a week plus (my Samsung back in 2006 could easily go 10 days on standby).

When a modern phone is powered OFF it is still somewhat active--this is because it there is no hard disconnect for the power. When you are turning on the power you're pushing a button on the phone--there is some chip in there waiting for that contact to happen. However, in the OFF state phones are using very, very, very little power... there is no radio or GPS activity, etc... they can last in this state for weeks, possibly months.

Many smart phones today you cannot remove the battery... but once it's dead it is dead. These are not magical devices and there is no secret backup battery.

Anyone saying that a phone without a battery, or a phone with a very dead battery, can be tracked is doing nothing but spreading FUD.

The FBI, the NSA, whatever, cannot track a cell phone with no battery or a dead battery--it's just an inert pile of plastics and metals at that point. They can track a phone that is standby.

However, I would not put it outside the realm of possibility that even when the device is in the "OFF" state it does not wake up every few days to check GPS or cell position--It is highly, highly unlikely and this would be something added either as a hack or a backdoor or something... not what a manufacturer would build in on purpose.

BTW, the coin cell batteries found in old PCs and electronics were usually to run the RTC--Real Time Clock--and would provide small current for configuration (BIOS) memory that was volatile. They are rated at 3V (cell phone battery will be 3.7V) and cannot supply anywhere near the kind of power needed to run the GPS or cellular radios in the phone for any length of time, I'm talking seconds or a minute at the very best. Virtually all phones you would have today do not have one of these batteries in them anyway because the phones do not use an RTC or volatile memory.

I've been an electrical engineer working for semiconductor manufacturers making chips for these devices for over 10 years.

 

I have a background in engineering and this is what I thought as well when reading the first page of this thread. However, I don't believe devices are truly "off." I think that "off" is actually "sleep" now adays--a very deep sleep that the device is in. I believe that in this deep sleep mode, communication can be made to the device and the device can be turned on remotely.

And I wouldn't doubt that the manufacturer is putting a subprogram is put in the phone to be in compliance with some classified FBI/NSA "anti-terrorism" measure, which provides a backdoor for the FBI/NSA to remotely turn on the phone, or semi-awake the phone to the point that location data can be transmitted without the user knowing. For example, the screen and buttons would not turn on and the phone would appear to be off.

I do not trust any company anymore and I believe that they have built in backdoors for our government to spy on us, either because they are too friendly with the government, or because they are mandated to by the government.

Now, of course, if the phone/device is unable to receive power, the device will not be able to function at all. So the question is, is the manufacturer installing backup power sources? You mentioned one type of backup power source--how do we know there aren't others that have been developed since then? And how do we know that it still takes a significant amount of power to transmit location data? I have doubt about all these things.

 

Not connected to the internet they find you. http://m.digitaltrends.com/computing/nsa-can-spy-computers-arent-connected-internet-nyt-reports/

No battery they can still power up your device or will be able to soon enough. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/18/business/18novel.html?_r=0

 

Does this apply to looting as well? I really want that flat screen TV.

 

I think that works when wrapped around one's head.

 

Ukraine Riots

http://hsrd.yahoo.com/_ylt=A2KLtjqC...W5lLWZlYXJzLWdyb3dpbmctMTIyNTI1NjIxLmh0bWw-/RS=^ADA.0Ykn1eN0fwyYL6bRebT8omu9o0-

 

In Ukraine, Riot police troll you:

 

Loudly starting a riot is less effective than quietly starting a fire. If you want to fight tyranny, be smart about it.

If you do want to go to a riot, leave the battery in your phone and leave the phone at home (or church). If there is someone you really dislike, quietly borrow his phone and take it to the riot with you, then slip it back into his pocket when you get back.

 

My blackberry is not off when it's off. I can get online and turn it on, gps locate it and wipe the phone. If I can get get on blackberry protect and do it I am sure the gov can too. Of course it is off and none of this works when the battery is pulled. If I am somewhere I don't want known to be my phone would be on my dresser. Of course my jeep has gps nav on it so I am sure that can be tracked to- would hafta to go straight ghost n drive the jimmy lol

 

Good info. The amount of privacy that has vanished in recent years is scary stuff.

 

A square foot of aluminum foil, wrapped around your cell keeps it from receiving or transmitting = problem solved.

Then unwrap AWAY from places you shouldn't be in.

 

Remove the battery first or turn it fully off. Otherwise it goes to hi power mode and drains the battery. Might overheat also.