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that's like, your opinion
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Until someone takes a DI and a piston to the range, fires the same number of rounds through both at the same pace and measures the temperature of the bolts immediately after they lock back after the last round I am skeptical that the temperature difference will be that great.



I have a 22 liter ultrasonic tank. A 16" upper will fit diagonally in the tank. Not a problem to get it clean with it. Just gotta use the right tools for the job.
concur on using right tools for the job, but that 22 liter ultrasonic tank probably isnt ideal for field cleaning.... :upsidedown:

in any event i have both pistons and DI, id be comfortable using both...
 

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Si vis pacem, para bellum
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concur on using right tools for the job, but that 22 liter ultrasonic tank probably isnt ideal for field cleaning.... :upsidedown:

in any event i have both pistons and DI, id be comfortable using both...
Our range has electric outlets. :D:
 

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that's like, your opinion
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How often do you people with gas pistons clean the piston?
i clean my pistons and the gas block after every session... rob arms xcr-l, arsenal 104/107 slr, IWI gallil, saiga-12, FAL, mini14, FN49, M1, m1a, rfb, su-16, sig 556r....

then again i also clean all my DI gas tubes after each session as well...
 

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Exactly my point, both systems get cleaned so it doesn't really make much difference.
I agree, basic maintenance is going to prevent a lot of problems. If you are someone who shoots all day long and competes on the weekends there may be some merit behind some of these ideas but if your equipment goes down you have sponsors. Those guys don't have to pay for anything that wears or breaks. The rest of us that purchase good quality firearms and maintain them shouldn't have issues. Let's face it none of us are going to get into some fantasy sustained gun battle where you burn through thousands of rounds at an invading horde. It's just not going to happen. Should by some stretch of the fantasy you do find yourself in that environment you will be out flanked and wiped out in minutes without doing anything but blowing off rounds and giving yourself away entering into a bottle.

Daddymaxusmus made a great post on page #1 of this thread when he said:

And who the hell takes out their BCG, and holds it in their hand right after a protracted gunfight? Been in a lot of firefights in my 3 combat deployments... Never decided to play with my hot BCG immediately following... Always too hyped up, worried that it's not really over yet... or crashing from the adrenaline dump.
 

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Originalist
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Back in the early 2000s I did some beta testing of the H&K 416 10.5" 5.56 MG with a SF guy that was doing the testing for a gov't facility. A small group of us went to a local farm for a shoot and he had the H&K 416, lots of ammo and a chrono.


"I did some beta testing..." not the same as "I watched a dude shoot a gun."

Testing, by definition is to gather data. But hey, you watch boxes fall out of the sky.

I can’t speak for him, so I don’t know what his participation is. All I can speak for is my own. I never claimed to be doing anything spectacular, all I said is, I’m around the testing process all the time and haven’t even signed an NDA. I could frankly care less what you think of the value I contribute to the process, but I will say, I’m proud to help many business bring their ideas to life and to be a part of the process of developing new technology to help us keep our technological edge.


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Having only taken part in one testing session, it was pretty boring and time-consuming:D:

I will say, the only piston system I own is a POF Revolution in .308 and it's honestly far more accurate than I am and easily rivals my bolt guns. I have enough surplus ball ammo, but I personally can't afford to experiment with how hot the bolt gets (or doesn't) with match ammo. At least with the "boring" test, ammo was free:D:

ROCK6
 

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Paratrooper X
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Exactly my point, both systems get cleaned so it doesn't really make much difference.
Cleaning a DI AR takes a lot longer than cleaning a piston AR

Granted, half my life was in the Army so my definition of a clean AR might be more stringent than others
 

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Cleaning a DI AR takes a lot longer than cleaning a piston AR

Granted, half my life was in the Army so my definition of a clean AR might be more stringent than others
Cleaning any AR should involve cleaning the bolt carrier whether it is DI or piston, so I don't see how cleaning less parts could take longer.

And yes, my little brother was in Desert Storm and likes to inspect my AR's.:D:
 

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Paratrooper X
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Cleaning any AR should involve cleaning the bolt carrier whether it is DI or piston, so I don't see how cleaning less parts could take longer.

And yes, my little brother was in Desert Storm and likes to inspect my AR's.:D:
Cleaning a piston carrier take about 10 seconds, even if you havnt cleaned it in a few years.

A DI carrier is just lil bit more involved
 

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Cleaning a piston carrier take about 10 seconds, even if you havnt cleaned it in a few years.

A DI carrier is just lil bit more involved
My son built his first pistol AR using Noveske parts. It's DI, and he's run about 5000 rounds through it and never cleans it, and never has had a malfunction...just a quick bore swab...

ROCK6
 

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Paratrooper X
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My son built his first pistol AR using Noveske parts. It's DI, and he's run about 5000 rounds through it and never cleans it, and never has had a malfunction...just a quick bore swab...

ROCK6
I didnt mention anything about reliability, only cleaning.
 

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Paratrooper X
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But if you are cleaning the rifle you should be cleaning the BCG anyway.
I do clean the entire rifle when I clean.

That being said, when I clean my DI rifles, the BCG is the least of my worries. I have never seen a BCG fail or heard of one failing, save maybe the gas key coming undone. How often does that happen when the screws are properly staked.

Point is, the piston driven one takes far less time to clean. carbon just wipes off. There is no scraping the rear of the bolt or inside of the carrier
 

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I do clean the entire rifle when I clean.

That being said, when I clean my DI rifles, the BCG is the least of my worries. I have never seen a BCG fail or heard of one failing, save maybe the gas key coming undone. How often does that happen when the screws are properly staked.

Point is, the piston driven one takes far less time to clean. carbon just wipes off. There is no scraping the rear of the bolt or inside of the carrier
I have never had to scrape any part when I clean my AR's. Then again I clean them every time I shoot them.
 

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Threepin'
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KISS.

If you’re concerned about DI vs piston reliability over thousands of rounds (where you tend to possibly start getting some heat-induced or gunk-related failures), in a firefight situation, you probably have much bigger problems.

IMO piston ARs are an answer in search of a problem. If you don’t buy crap tier ARs, their DI systems are going to treat you just fine. There really isn’t a ton of added function or benefit to piston unless you’re a) lazy and just don’t like maintaining your rifle, or b) shooting a short barrel suppressed, where things actually get real dirty.

YMMV.


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