Survivalist Forum banner

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Under extreme stress human beings can experience what is known as task fixation. Task fixation means that they are 100% focused on the threat at hand and will likely continue use of the same tactic, movement or tool even although it is not proving effective.

Very often during force on force with firearms we see someone being charge with a knife or bludgeon at a distance, they are shooting as fast as they can but remain flatfooted. They keep shooting and the bad guy just will not go down. After being cut/stabbed a few times they learn to move off line. Just because you have a tool in your hand does not mean you can ignore everything else.

Another example is during a stabbing when an attacker is on top of the victim and keeps stabbing him with ice pick type stabs. Responding to an attack with these gross motor responses that utilize a cyclic type motion decrease the chance of the officer transitioning to another tactic or tool when doing so should be obvious.

Task fixation is even more dangerous during open hand edged weapons when the person being attacked grabs the weapon or the weapon wielding hand without moving off the centerline. Even when this does not prevent them from getting stabbed for some reason they fail to let go in order to do something else.

My default defense against task fixation during bad breath range confrontations is to habitually move in at a hard 45-degree angle to my attackers right. Since 93%+ or the population this puts you to their non-reaction. This accomplishes several things whether the confrontation involves open hand, impact weapons, edged weapons or a pistol.

Suppresses their weapon hand.
Moves you off the center line.
Puts you to their outside.
Allows you to off balance them with a push.

I have found that once you are on the outside you kinda get reset and realize that you have more options that bridge to other options instead of getting stuck.
 

·
I'm the boogey man.......
Joined
·
6,686 Posts
If it wasn't for "task fixation" masturbation would be futile....lol
 

·
Deo VIndice
Joined
·
6,108 Posts
If it wasn't for "task fixation" masturbation would be futile....lol
Do tell... :D:
-------------------
Anyways, it's almost like folks in shock...it is tough to get em to snap out of it.
 

·
awake and aware
Joined
·
591 Posts
I agree that task fixation happens.
This is why I practice mma 6 times a week.

I am confused to the last part of what you typed. I tried reading it a bunch of times and don't have the slightest idea of what you mean.
From what I do gather is that you step towards an attackers right hand when they are coming at you? To get on the outside of the right hand?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
My default defense against task fixation during bad breath range confrontations is to habitually move in at a hard 45-degree angle to my attackers right.
Wait a sec, the attacker's right or my right?


______Atk.__
___/\_______
____\_______
______You___

Doesn't that put you on their strong side? Or is that better? (pardon my ignorance)
 

·
Improvise Adapt Overcome!
Joined
·
12,005 Posts
Under extreme stress human beings can experience what is known as task fixation. Task fixation means that they are 100% focused on the threat at hand and will likely continue use of the same tactic, movement or tool even although it is not proving effective.

Very often during force on force with firearms we see someone being charge with a knife or bludgeon at a distance, they are shooting as fast as they can but remain flatfooted. They keep shooting and the bad guy just will not go down. After being cut/stabbed a few times they learn to move off line. Just because you have a tool in your hand does not mean you can ignore everything else.

Another example is during a stabbing when an attacker is on top of the victim and keeps stabbing him with ice pick type stabs. Responding to an attack with these gross motor responses that utilize a cyclic type motion decrease the chance of the officer transitioning to another tactic or tool when doing so should be obvious.

Task fixation is even more dangerous during open hand edged weapons when the person being attacked grabs the weapon or the weapon wielding hand without moving off the centerline. Even when this does not prevent them from getting stabbed for some reason they fail to let go in order to do something else.

My default defense against task fixation during bad breath range confrontations is to habitually move in at a hard 45-degree angle to my attackers right. Since 93%+ or the population this puts you to their non-reaction. This accomplishes several things whether the confrontation involves open hand, impact weapons, edged weapons or a pistol.

Suppresses their weapon hand.
Moves you off the center line.
Puts you to their outside.
Allows you to off balance them with a push.

I have found that once you are on the outside you kinda get reset and realize that you have more options that bridge to other options instead of getting stuck.
Reply]
Do you do some sort of Kuntao, or Silat?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
No, I am not familiar with those two arts beyond that I know of them.

You want to rush his strong side because it is harder for him to react to. It is easier for him to spin right than left. I make a habit of trying to pass people in crowds on their right. It is not ignorance. I understand it is taught in some MA but little in police defensive tactics. I did a briefing yesterday at a prison on edged weapons survival. One of the things I spoke about was constant tactical positioning. If don't provide a target their is no shot. Picture yourself walking past someone on their right, as you brush by in that direction you are off the center line to the outside and in a position to smother an attack.
 

·
Improvise Adapt Overcome!
Joined
·
12,005 Posts
What you are describing is Kuntao fundamentals. We take the next step though, and turn the positional advantage into a take down opportunity. The finish is generally pretty brutal, and results in broken elbows, ribs and dislocated shoulders. Although I was making some points recently, that with minor mods, we could use them to position a suspect for cuffing with little effort.

Against a knife, this stuff is very effective because it takes the ability to use the knife away from them very quickly, often suddenly, and brutally. It's even more effective in emptyhand vs emptyhand.

My friend that I am learning from is actually considering trying to get into the prison system to teach the guards since we are close to 4 prisons. Since you just did that very thing, do you have any suggestions on how we might approach them and make some inroads?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
My core Art is Yoshin Ryu Ju Jitsu but when I do public demos people always come up and ask me if I have done this art or that art. More or less just Ju Jitsu mixed with putting my hands on lots of people and seeing what works.

See if you can find out who the training officers are at prisons and then put together a brochure about what you do.

Breaking into law enforcement training can be hard if you are not on or retired from the job. I went in about just doing edged weapons training but it looks like I will be doing weapons retention and some other things. My background includes every thing from open hand to the sniper rifle but my base of expertise is open hand, stick, knife and guns within seven yards. That is what I prefer to concentrate on.

Using the technique I described on the street overwhelmed and put people off balance mentally and physically. My basic gross motor skill finish is to grab them over the traps and pull them down backwards hard at a 45 degree angle. Is they come up them are met with kicks and strikes. It allows for a very measured response.
 

·
Improvise Adapt Overcome!
Joined
·
12,005 Posts
The Kuntao is old school Shaolin, from before the cultural revolution. Rather than getting demilitarized like many of the Chinese lineages, is was preserved due to being in Indonesia at the time.

One thing we don't do, is allow them to get up once thrown. We follow them down and either finish them, or control them using positioning that keeps us close to being on our feet, but keeps the down (lots of one knee on, vertical arm bar stuff). We have baffled several BJJ guys with the way we do things because it is so out of thier paradime.

Thanks for the tip about the trainers!! I will talk to my freind tomorrow!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,270 Posts
Task Fixation is a real problem that I see over and over. Thank you Mercop for your very clear and accurate explanation on the subject.

I see this a lot where an officer is stuck in one mode and can not put together that what he is doing is not working, and will not work. But he keeps trying anyways.

For instance an Officer who is attempting to put a subject's arm behind his back when the subject keeps turning into the officer and pulling away. Yet the officer keeps trying several more times instead of using a different force option, such as; pepper spray, throwing the guy, or whatever. This time delay, where the officer is unwilling to do what needs to be done, often gives the subject time to formulate a plan, take advantage of the officers mental weakness and launch a real attack on the officer.

I think that part of this can be explained by the dynamics of the situation and sensory overload. However the problem is not limited to extreme situations. The example I have above is an example.

I think that a lot of is is purely mental and by that I mean false optimism. The Officer thinks, "I don't want to use any more force, so maybe if I just try this again he will comply." It is really a type of denial and a lack of mental preparedness.

I think this problem would definitely show it self in situations that civilians face. An example might be when a female is getting rapped. Her first instinct might be to try and talk her way out of it. If that didn't work then she needs to come up with a plan B, but I could see her being stuck on play A, because she doesn't want to move to plan B.

Although Mercop, to and extent I THINK we are talking about two different things. I'm guessing that you are talking about what happens to you in a real dynamic, pucker factor situation, and I'm referring to Task Fixation in a more relaxed setting. :D:

No matter how it happens it is a real problem and thanks for bringing it up. :thumb:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
187 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
It really all comes down to insane thinking-doing the same thing over and over but expecting a different result. The problem is that the stakes are high during and interpersonal conflict and not very forgiving.
 
1 - 15 of 15 Posts
Top