Survivalist Forum banner

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,772 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
A friend of mine wants to build an underground sHipping crate shelter. He's seen several designs here and on other websites and he is trying to get a fix of what it will really cost him to do it.

If he just looks at the base cost of buying two 30 foot shipping containers lining them with rebar, concrete, etc... What's the best way for him to get an estimate of primary costs!

He knows he will have to add vents, blast door, etc... But right now he is just trying to get a fix on what his biggest costs will be.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
6,236 Posts
A friend of mine wants to build an underground sHipping crate shelter. He's seen several designs here and on other websites and he is trying to get a fix of what it will really cost him to do it.

If he just looks at the base cost of buying two 30 foot shipping containers lining them with rebar, concrete, etc... What's the best way for him to get an estimate of primary costs!

He knows he will have to add vents, blast door, etc... But right now he is just trying to get a fix on what his biggest costs will be.
I couldn't find one with a fair price range due to scrap metal prices they base the lower quality units on, so I went with a Heavy duty Refrigerated Trailer. It has six inch insulated walls and a aluminum grid floor that I ran my radiant heat pipe thru the slots and installed 1/2 inch plywood over. The walls have the good spray foam with the fire retardant coating on it and washable fiberglass wallboard.The wall framing is a heavy "z" type aluminum stud as is the re-enforced roof. I took the rotted swinging doors off the back and put a trimmed down roll up garage door on it and we buried it all but 1 foot under ground on the side of a hill with a rented backhoe. That way no one knew what we were doing with the backhoe in the woods. We use it as a Root cellar now on one end and a remote storage room with heat and water on the other end. Without the heat it stays about 45-50 in the coldest part of winter here in Maine. The trailer delivered to my farm cost me $550.00. I had the driver bring it to me on his way home at Night to cut down on over active eyeballs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21,890 Posts
I couldn't find one with a fair price range due to scrap metal prices they base the lower quality units on, so I went with a Heavy duty Refrigerated Trailer. It has six inch insulated walls and a aluminum grid floor that I ran my radiant heat pipe thru the slots and installed 1/2 inch plywood over. The walls have the good spray foam with the fire retardant coating on it and washable fiberglass wallboard.The wall framing is a heavy "z" type aluminum stud as is the re-enforced roof. I took the rotted swinging doors off the back and put a trimmed down roll up garage door on it and we buried it all but 1 foot under ground on the side of a hill with a rented backhoe. That way no one knew what we were doing with the backhoe in the woods. We use it as a Root cellar now on one end and a remote storage room with heat and water on the other end. Without the heat it stays about 45-50 in the coldest part of winter here in Maine. The trailer delivered to my farm cost me $550.00. I had the driver bring it to me on his way home at Night to cut down on over active eyeballs.
Not bad. Now since you don't have dirt on top you obviously don't have to worry about buckling from the top, but over time does the side dirt cause pressure?
 
  • Like
Reactions: A-Team

·
Registered
Joined
·
163 Posts
I bought 3 40' conex boxes at $1300 a piece a couple years ago, not sure what prices are now. I also had free delivery, but I got lucky on my deal. I cant help with cost to bury as mine aren't, but I know you can get a deal on multiplies if you aren't in a hurry and know the guy, prices are usually subjective to the sales guy more than other things out there. Do you have a quarry near by or a ready mix type concrete plant? Those guys are also more open on pricing than the "by the yard" type places or construction/ fleet guys who go there/ you cut out the middle man and go to the source. If you're not doing a solid pour you can pay less for leftovers in the cement trucks- when they finish a run and have some left in the truck they can give to you instead of dumping, which is great for certain fill type applications. Hope this helps get you there.
 

·
Indefatigable
Joined
·
20,548 Posts
Shipping containers make great homes - above ground. There have been MANY threads here on burying them. The cost of the container itself, is a small part of what would be needed to successfully bury it. Containers are designed to be stacked, but not buried. The ENTIRE weight being supported by the corners. The cost of steel and concrete to reinforce it, the cost of insulation, barriers to prevent rust and condensation, not to mention an air supply system, add to the cost quickly. In most cases a conventional underground shelter can be built for less.
I originally found this site, researching to build our own container cabin. We will be using 3 - 20ft containers placed in a "dog trot" configuration. 1-20ft container containing the kitchen pantry and bath will be placed 12 ft away from 2 other 20ft containers welded together for living and sleeping space. The "dog trot" opening will be closed with garage doors, allowing for a 12x20 indoor-outdoor living space between the 2 containers.
We were quoted $1700 for all 3 containers. You can see the inspiration for our home here:
http://earthsci.org/education/fieldsk/container/container.html
 
  • Like
Reactions: A-Team

·
Geronimo!
Joined
·
4,053 Posts
Shipping containers make great homes - above ground. There have been MANY threads here on burying them. The cost of the container itself, is a small part of what would be needed to successfully bury it .....
Not sure I agree with that completely. Some of it (your complete post above) is true, but it really all depends upon your geographical location and the resources at your disposal.

For instance, here in SC, especially if you live near the coast and the Port of Charleston, containers are plentiful and cheap and not much to transport.

Secondly, the soil here, below the fall line, is sandy/loamy and easily excavated - plus it drains well.

Thirdly, because of all the sand, concrete plants are plentiful and reasonably priced.

Forthly ... you don't want to bury one in an area that has a high water table. You don't want one buried where it will be even slightly submerged in water. It will either float or rust to pieces in no time.

Coating a container (whether below ground or above) with an elastomeric of some kind is common - but the key is to prep and prime it well first. If you coat it before you prep and prime it then it is going to rust no matter how well you cover it underground. For the average layperson, I would recommend a good coating of Rust Bullet of POR-15 followed by a thick coating of Rhino Liner or something along those lines. Anything to keep the moisture and the concrete directly off of the steel.

Only the outside walls are in danger of collapse if you are burying multiple containers ... the inner walls are protected by lack of volume between containers ... but those spaces have to be waterproofed, or well-drained, and then filled or sealed. Yes, you could do a concrete pour in-between the containers to protect the sides or stack containers underground, or another option, as I recently witnessed a friend do it .... he used 8x8 square treated pylons in-between his containers and then beam & raftered over the tops and poured a slab on corrugated tin to cover his two containers ... and I see absolutely no reason why that is not going to last a long long time underground.

The beauty of containers is that, if done correctly, you can save a lot of money on base slabs, side walls and labor and prep work. But they are not just something you can dig a hole for and then drop in the ground without a plan.

If it is rocky, hilly, hard packed soil, the excavation hole is much tighter and, in most cases, it is best to cut into the side of a hill or ridge.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
6,236 Posts
Not bad. Now since you don't have dirt on top you obviously don't have to worry about buckling from the top, but over time does the side dirt cause pressure?
not really, I placed it on the side of a hill where there is a old Mine and had the face of the rock carved out flat. we just drug it with cables up tight against the wall. Then back filled with dirt froma pond I dug with the bulldozer i borrowed. We just left one end open for the door and the roof uncovered for solar radiant heat effect of the sun. I can easily camoflage the whole thing in about a hour. and it would blend right into the side of the mountain. The water drains down the hill, and under the whole trailer and on down the mountain. solid Rock above, dirt below, no landslide risk. so far it is working out nicely.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
6,236 Posts
Not sure I agree with that completely. Some of it (your complete post above) is true, but it really all depends upon your geographical location and the resources at your disposal.

For instance, here in SC, especially if you live near the coast and the Port of Charleston, containers are plentiful and cheap and not much to transport.

Secondly, the soil here, below the fall line, is sandy/loamy and easily excavated - plus it drains well.

Thirdly, because of all the sand, concrete plants are plentiful and reasonably priced.

Forthly ... you don't want to bury one in an area that has a high water table. You don't want one buried where it will be even slightly submerged in water. It will either float or rust to pieces in no time.

Coating a container (whether below ground or above) with an elastomeric of some kind is common - but the key is to prep and prime it well first. If you coat it before you prep and prime it then it is going to rust no matter how well you cover it underground. For the average layperson, I would recommend a good coating of Rust Bullet of POR-15 followed by a thick coating of Rhino Liner or something along those lines. Anything to keep the moisture and the concrete directly off of the steel.

Only the outside walls are in danger of collapse if you are burying multiple containers ... the inner walls are protected by lack of volume between containers ... but those spaces have to be waterproofed, or well-drained, and then filled or sealed. Yes, you could do a concrete pour in-between the containers to protect the sides or stack containers underground, or another option, as I recently witnessed a friend do it .... he used 8x8 square treated pylons in-between his containers and then beam & raftered over the tops and poured a slab on corrugated tin to cover his two containers ... and I see absolutely no reason why that is not going to last a long long time underground.

The beauty of containers is that, if done correctly, you can save a lot of money on base slabs, side walls and labor and prep work. But they are not just something you can dig a hole for and then drop in the ground without a plan.

If it is rocky, hilly, hard packed soil, the excavation hole is much tighter and, in most cases, it is best to cut into the side of a hill or ridge.
272 Static Jumps Troop, whats your score? Fun stuff, I sure miss it.
 

·
Hardcore survival
Joined
·
635 Posts
I've built several 20' and 40' out of conexes, but never for in-ground burial. I'm working on another 20'er now, the whole package will be about $12 K, the owner will finish the interior to suit himself on this one. Otherwise finished out it would run about $22 K (Cedar interior, 110v/12v power system, filtered ventillation, waste system).

I'm a retired engineer with nuclear and shelter experience, years ago we did a structural study on them and how to properly reinforce them to use as earth-covered shelter structures. (see pictures below)

Conexes are NOT safe for in-ground burial per se !! Our structural calculations determined that without a doubt. There is one video on youtube that shows the owner quarrying out ledge rock to lower a conex into, but that is a totally different circumstance -- he did not backfill soil against the conex, and his groundwater level was below his floor!!.


I wanted something bigger for myself, so I built my shelter out of a 10 x 56 insulated refrigerator railroad car seen here:





The rr car cost me $1200 delivered, and I bought steel beams and columns for reinforcement cheap from a scrap yard. Armor steel plate for the entrance and turret was bought at a government auction.

I did all the welding myself, then coated it with 2 layers of foundation tar and covered it with heavy poly before renting a backhoe and covering it. The hole that was dug out for covering the bunker, became a "moat" around it.

All in all, the project cost me right around $5000 out-of-pocket back in 2005.

Since the picture (below) was taken, tamper proof hoods for the air vents were fabricated, and a tough razorwire concertina fence put up around the base. An armored turret accessible from the interior sits on top with a 360° view of the whole forest clearing way back here in the woods.

 

·
Indefatigable
Joined
·
20,548 Posts
basecampUSA - that is sweet! I am not familiar with the refrigerated rail cars, if you wanted to use one above ground - can you put in doors and windows - just like a container? The extra 2ft of width sounds tempting!
 

·
Geronimo!
Joined
·
4,053 Posts
272 Static Jumps Troop, whats your score? Fun stuff, I sure miss it.
I got ya beat Airborne ... but then I was a Master Blaster, Jumpmaster Qualified in 1981 and I did a whole bunch of hollywood jumps back in the day. Plus, I was a member of the Sport Parachute team in Italy, so we jumped 20 - 30 times a weekend and a lot of those were hop and pops in the soccer stadium in Vicenza if we could not hitch a ride up to Aviano.

So, to answer your question, static line alone, I've got over 1,000 logged, missing some that never got logged. Another that many and more freefall over time and all of those were logged.

When were you in? We probably know a lot of the same people.

2nd Brigade all under Mad Jack Hamilton. 1/509th under Nukem Needham. Any of that ring a bell? General Robinson, General Lindsay?

Geronimo came from the Nickle O' Nasty ... played football for them as well.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
6,236 Posts
I got ya beat Airborne ... but then I was a Master Blaster, Jumpmaster Qualified in 1981 and I did a whole bunch of hollywood jumps back in the day. Plus, I was a member of the Sport Parachute team in Italy, so we jumped 20 - 30 times a weekend and a lot of those were hop and pops in the soccer stadium in Vicenza if we could not hitch a ride up to Aviano.

So, to answer your question, static line alone, I've got over 1,000 logged, missing some that never got logged. Another that many and more freefall over time and all of those were logged.

When were you in? We probably know a lot of the same people.

2nd Brigade all under Mad Jack Hamilton. 1/509th under Nukem Needham. Any of that ring a bell? General Robinson, General Lindsay?

Geronimo came from the Nickle O' Nasty ... played football for them as well.
I was With the 3/7th SF at Bragg for a little while in 80, they had me in damn near every MOS school they had for 2 1/2 years, I left smoke bomb hill and went to Sam Houston for a Medic Course, then Ft. Gordon to signal school, just when I was finishing Radio-Teletype and was about to pack up for Ft. Lost in the woods Mo. They had me stay for training on the new Portable Satellite radio uplink rigs, then I had equipment Repair and operation Training at Leonard wood, then Linquistics Training, then they sent me for Classes at Emory University, then Demolition training. and next thing I knew I was on an All expenses paid vacation to Grenada. Where I got the supreme privelige of being the only Person shot by The only Cuban Sniper on the Island. If it wasn't for his scope not being Zeroed right, I wouldn't be here now. Sumbitch hit the carrying handle on my AR and deflected a round down thru my right wrist. I Drilled him with a full 30 clip and sat down and laughed for a good 10 minutes, then got up and slung his Draganov 7.54 over my back and continued on about my business. Two days later I was Gut shot by stray shots from someone firing an AK. Then the last thing I remember was getting stoned off my azz on a medics shot and helo lifted to a navy ship for surgery by a Navy woman sawbones. My last thought before going under was: Aw Geeze, I'm Fu ..............zzzzzzzzzzz. After convilescence in the hospital at Ft. Gordon Eisenhower Hospital, I went home for a while. then when I was ready they sent me to Central America for "B" Team Field work, teaching peeps to dig wells and plant weeds etc. etc. Then by 1990 i got caught up in Qualitative Management and they dropped into the Reserves, then after a year and a half to inactive reserves. After 9 years I tried for disability and fought with em till last August and they finally gave it to me. Now I'm all set...Retired at 53. I'd go back in a minute if they would let me. Oh yeah, almost forgot, I was working for Johnny Johnson, Ralph Burrows, Lemeul smiley, and a old OSS guy (Forget his name) from WWII, cool as hell guy, knows everything about whats really going on in the background. He taught me Code In Signal School. Great people them old WWII folks.
 

·
Hardcore survival
Joined
·
635 Posts
Checking the new posts today I came across an old thread that got a bump OP you might want to check this out:
http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=148884
Thanks!

I've been preaching this here till I got blue in the face... at least a dozen posts about the subject...

It does little good, a lot of people won't read an entire thread and follow sound advice.

Reminds me of a good vid: :D: :D: :D:

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
324 Posts
You can buy used containers here in central Texas (40') for $2400.00 each. They charge a nominal fee to deliver if it is not too far.
 

·
Geronimo!
Joined
·
4,053 Posts
I was With the 3/7th SF at Bragg for a little while in 80, they had me in damn near every MOS school they had for 2 1/2 years, I left smoke bomb hill and went to Sam Houston for a Medic Course, then Ft. Gordon to signal school, just when I was finishing Radio-Teletype and was about to pack up for Ft. Lost in the woods Mo. They had me stay for training on the new Portable Satellite radio uplink rigs, then I had equipment Repair and operation Training at Leonard wood, then Linquistics Training, then they sent me for Classes at Emory University, then Demolition training. and next thing I knew I was on an All expenses paid vacation to Grenada. Where I got the supreme privelige of being the only Person shot by The only Cuban Sniper on the Island. If it wasn't for his scope not being Zeroed right, I wouldn't be here now. Sumbitch hit the carrying handle on my AR and deflected a round down thru my right wrist. I Drilled him with a full 30 clip and sat down and laughed for a good 10 minutes, then got up and slung his Draganov 7.54 over my back and continued on about my business. Two days later I was Gut shot by stray shots from someone firing an AK. Then the last thing I remember was getting stoned off my azz on a medics shot and helo lifted to a navy ship for surgery by a Navy woman sawbones. My last thought before going under was: Aw Geeze, I'm Fu ..............zzzzzzzzzzz. After convilescence in the hospital at Ft. Gordon Eisenhower Hospital, I went home for a while. then when I was ready they sent me to Central America for "B" Team Field work, teaching peeps to dig wells and plant weeds etc. etc. Then by 1990 i got caught up in Qualitative Management and they dropped into the Reserves, then after a year and a half to inactive reserves. After 9 years I tried for disability and fought with em till last August and they finally gave it to me. Now I'm all set...Retired at 53. I'd go back in a minute if they would let me. Oh yeah, almost forgot, I was working for Johnny Johnson, Ralph Burrows, Lemeul smiley, and a old OSS guy (Forget his name) from WWII, cool as hell guy, knows everything about whats really going on in the background. He taught me Code In Signal School. Great people them old WWII folks.
Jeeezzze - I dunno. We were there at the same time - we're the same age. Seems like we would know some of the same people. You don't mean Jesse Johnson rather than Johnny Johnson, do you by chance? And yeah, I was smack in the middle of Urgent Fury with 2/325th, was on Mad Jack's Hamilton's 141 as a matter of fact. I never knew that about someone being sniped when we were down there - but there are probably a lot of things I've never heard of in that regard. I was just a Buck Sergeant in those days and I stayed fairly focused on my squad and what was going on around me.

I thought only 5th Group was at Bragg in '80? I may be wrong though. I dunno - I just seemed to remember 7th SFG being down in Panama when we went down there for JOTC every year, I do remember it being the 3rd of the 7th though ... seems like they had transitioned from the 8th to the 7th a few years earlier maybe. I can't be sure. It's been a long time ago. I do remember when 5th left Bragg though, I wanna say that was '87 or '88, and relocated to Campbell. Owell .... nice meeting you. :)
 

·
Ephemerally here
Joined
·
6,875 Posts
Back to main topic - (I love seeing/"Hearing" the Military Stories, THough - If any youse are up here in the Glorious NorthBest, I would Like ta buy ya a Muffin and maybe some suds!) Up here in the NorthBest, I have run into a fellow who gets his Containers for Free! Just has to "Dispose of them"! Some are High-Cubes (The 9'6" High Ones!) and some are Made of Cor-Ten Steel (The Stuff that doesn't need any Rust prevention/painting/Maintenance). I am trying to glom onto his excess containers - If I land one or two, I will then have a connection for others. Just have to transport on your Dime.

The world Economy continues to wind Down, and there are a LOT of Containers coming Off-Hire, and the costs of transporting them back to China or Japan exceeds their Cost to Manufacture!!! Ain't that a kick in the Patootie!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
266 Posts
Price here in West Texas for a 40` container is $ 3000+.
Still cheap construction for the way they are made (heavy metal) . You want a door... get the cutting torch. Good luck.
 
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top