[ryan112ryan]

So trying to plan out a bunker, one thing I am having trouble getting info on is ventilation.

Specifically:

• how to construct blast valves for tops of vents
• how big of vent
• how to filter out bio/chemical
• when changing filter, what stops toxins on filter coming in?

 

[Mtnman Mike]

Others will probably give more complex and more expensive ways but here is the least expensive ventilation for a fallout shelter/bunker >

The above image is from the free book > www.ki4u.com/free_book

The appendix on blast shelters is the chapter with that image and chapter 6 has more info on ventilation.

 

[Brother Buck]

That is an excellent reference book. I highly recommend getting the hardcopy. The illustrations are much more clear in the book.

 

[Mtnman Mike]

There are probably other sites which maybe someone else will tell about or people can google for much more also.
Here is what I found quickly if people want to spend more than $600 > http://americanbombshelter.com/ASR-50-AB-automatic-bunker-ventilation-blower.htm

And as I said it can be expensive to get the factory built systems such as the filtration system that goes with the blower as shown in the link above > http://americanbombshelter.com/NBC-overpressure-air-filters.htm Around $2,000 is way too much for myself but some might wish to spend that much. But depends on your area and if there will be much fallout or other contaminants. On my remote mtn place there should not be too much fallout and if so I can seal it and make and use expedient air filters and pumps such as the KAP - Kearny Air Pump. IF any have not seen the pics of my bunker etc. then look here > http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=42447 as well as 2 other pic threads. Many have seen these but few have read or even looked at All the pics, which is ok if they are not interested in seeing how someone built a bunker/shelter for little money.

I used the small pole shelter plans from the NWSSkills book as shown in the free book below.

I once saw a drawing of a barrel that was filled with fiberglass insulation, I believe, for filtering and air was drawn thru that. People could maybe also use other filters, such as HEPA filters then could use the KAP = Kearny Air Pump as shown in this book also although this KAP is not supposed to draw in fallout particles > http://www.ki4u.com/free_book/s73p917.htm

 

[james223]

Close blast valve before changing fitler. You will to valves (intake / exhaust). In come cases a small fan (computer) is used to pull in air. A hand crank can be used as well .Get a copy of Plill Hoags book . No such thing as dooms day, Montana.

 

[Preacherboy]

I had an older gentleman tell me (has built severa expensive bunkers for VIPs) that ventilation is easy. Get several hundred feet of 4" coregated drain tip and snake it around buried underground. The bottom of the trench it sits in has to be lined with clay, and supposely your shelter will get oxygen from the "earth".

I still am not sure how that would work, as I have tried researching it and finding examples or verification and have found none. I do however, trust my friend, just not sure how this would work. Maybe someone on here could explain. This system eliminates all filters and any new for blast valves.

 

[ImbriD]

I had an older gentleman tell me (has built severa expensive bunkers for VIPs) that ventilation is easy. Get several hundred feet of 4" coregated drain tip and snake it around buried underground. The bottom of the trench it sits in has to be lined with clay, and supposely your shelter will get oxygen from the "earth".

I still am not sure how that would work, as I have tried researching it and finding examples or verification and have found none. I do however, trust my friend, just not sure how this would work. Maybe someone on here could explain. This system eliminates all filters and any new for blast valves.

I'd love to hear more about this. One of the things we plan on building once we finally find some decent land is a shelter.

 

[joes]

I had an older gentleman tell me (has built severa expensive bunkers for VIPs) that ventilation is easy. Get several hundred feet of 4" coregated drain tip and snake it around buried underground. The bottom of the trench it sits in has to be lined with clay, and supposely your shelter will get oxygen from the "earth".

I still am not sure how that would work, as I have tried researching it and finding examples or verification and have found none. I do however, trust my friend, just not sure how this would work. Maybe someone on here could explain. This system eliminates all filters and any new for blast valves.

Don't trust anyone that tells you that.. There is oxygen in the earth but not enough to breathe..Look at the mines when they dig them they lay pipe and blow in fresh air for oxygen..I have worked underground for about 10 years now and can tell you poor air is one of the things that can kill a person..Putting in clay (bentonite) like he is suggesting and it plugs it even more...Clay is used for ponds to keep from draining out.......Also RADON GAS is produced from the earth..Please do a Google search for RADON GAS....There is no way he is building underground bunkers like that....That method is a description for a coffin .........

 

[robangela]

Thanks for the links above, The Kearny air pump is what I want in my shelter. I am starting the digging next month. Have finally acquired 90% of what I need to complete it. My last hurdle was the air pump. Thanks again.

 

[james223]

You will need aprox 30 cfm of air per person . Also go to oism.org and nukepills.com for down loadable book.

 

[Preacherboy]

so the pipe laid to get air, this pipe is sucking air from the surface?

I believe what this man is telling me, I just am not understanding what he is meaning or how it would work. From the description I was told, it sounded like a coffin. When he gets back around I will have to make sure I get the full description.

 

[Singular1ty]

So trying to plan out a bunker, one thing I am having trouble getting info on is ventilation.

Specifically:

• how to construct blast valves for tops of vents
• how big of vent
• how to filter out bio/chemical
• when changing filter, what stops toxins on filter coming in?

Well to be honest, I would not use the vents until the last minute before you run out of O2, with the idea being the radiation will die down in the air over time.

So I would buy lots of CO2 scrubbers. And probably a few O2 tanks and even some of the old respirators used in mines.

 

[UrbanHermit]

Would it not be possible to just use plants for converting the CO2 to oxygen in an enclosed bunker? Of course, the number/size of plants and number of people inside the shelter would be some factors. Another factor would include sunlight for the plants, though I feel it is do able after seeing some underground greenhouses around the net. Thoughts?

 

[techo]

American Safe Room, Inc. is a good source of information and NBC air filtration products.
http://www.americansaferoom.com

 

[Rabble]

Would it not be possible to just use plants for converting the CO2 to oxygen in an enclosed bunker? Of course, the number/size of plants and number of people inside the shelter would be some factors. Another factor would include sunlight for the plants, though I feel it is do able after seeing some underground greenhouses around the net. Thoughts?

Sounds reasonable. You would have a load on your power system supplying the grow lights. It might even be a way to kill two birds with one stone, growing food plants. Building shelters with huge area and unused space sounds kind of counter intuitive, but would actually help the air situation.

 

[TMcArthur]

Unless you are sitting right next to ground zero or in a high value terrorist target, that sounds like an awful lot of money for a backyard bomb shelter.

If I were building a shelter from scratch it would be integrated into the basement of my house. I'd build the house itself to survive strong winds and be fire resistant. The shelter would be the deepest corner of that basement, modified to enhance radiation protection. It would pass as a game room or perhaps a spare bedroom or a den. All the supplies and resources of your home right there and immediately available without having to expose yourself to the world. Enough room not to feel claustrophobic. The comfort of familiarity and the ease of expanding into larger areas as the fallout risk lessens.

It is a lot easier to defend a home than it is a buried bunker. Think about how easy it would be to toss something nasty down your air intake/exhaust, like maybe a quart of gasoline and a match. Heck, even a local grass fire could do you in. OTOH a house with good landscaping and fire resistant design will stand up to all but the most intense wildfires.

You need ventilation and lots of it. Not so difficult in a basement, more than a bit of engineering in a separate shelter. Keep a bank of deep discharge batteries outside the home and keep them fully charged for low voltage needs during the shelter stay, lighting, fans and radios. Maybe use a solar panel or wind turbine for longer term needs.

You don't need blast valves or CBW gear unless you think you are NORAD and you don't need HEPA filters or a positive pressure ventilation system unless you plan on running a high risk infectious care unit.

 

[OttovonList]

I haven't had much time to check this out, but I hear it talks about securing in place for fall out ect, and includes ventilation. I have checked out the home made geiger counter tho and thought it was cool. So for what it's worth check it out. http://www.oism.org/

 

[Pampoen]

Would it not be possible to just use plants for converting the CO2 to oxygen in an enclosed bunker? Of course, the number/size of plants and number of people inside the shelter would be some factors. Another factor would include sunlight for the plants, though I feel it is do able after seeing some underground greenhouses around the net. Thoughts?

8m2 of Chorrella algae in a tank will balance the CO2 /O2 for 1 person.

http://www.sciencefocus.com/qa/how-many-plants-would-i-need-airtight-room-be-able-breathe

 

[bunkclimber]

the round computer fans come in 6"diameter as well..plenty of airflow for a small installation if installed right...available in 12v, 24v, 48volt DC, as well as 120Vac.These are all cast aluminum,specification built fans,not disposable junk.
Some I'd recommend:
Rotron Patriot 6" Model PQ12C8 12v,1.8A
Rotron Falcon 6" Model FD24B3
Rotron Caravel 10"
The DC fans operate well on DC speed controls,making for super quiet operation.A easy model number search on eBay comes up with several for sale.Some are available new in box for a small fraction of what they go for new($100) FWIW

 

[CONELRAD]

Since someone necro'ed a 7 y/o thread, a couple of things here...

In my opinion...

First of all, the algae tanks are a colossal waste of space. 24 sq ft per person is A LOT of space in any bunker/shelter. Unless you're expecting to be repeatedly hit with chemical weapons over a long period of time, it's not necessary to maintain a sealed shelter atmosphere over the long term. You certainly don't need that for fallout. 24 hours is generally all you'd need. Even that is a bit overkill because the majority of weapon fallout does not "float" through the air at ground level, doesn't flow into structures, etc. All of that is Hollywood nonsense.

In the most basic sense, changing filters requires shutdown of the air exchange system, sealing the inlet, carefully changing out and disposing of the used filter. Again, that would only be required if your location were being hit multiple times over the course of days with chemical agents like Sarin, Anthrax, VX, etc. Other than agents which are spread via a medium like Anthrax spores, biologicals (even airborne agents) travel from person to person. They don't float through the air long range like a gas. On the nuke side, it would only be required longer than 24 hours if you lived next to a stricken nuclear power plant or spent fuel pool fire and the winds NEVER shifted. Even if you lived due east of one, the winds don't blow out of the west 24/7/365.