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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Have been camping plenty but mostly out of the back of a truck, where we park and hike in about 6 hours, then hike out after two or three nights. So I'm used to a heavier load. Also, had to leave a significant amount of stuff back in another country. I have some of the stuff on this list, probably 40%, still plenty to go.

My AO is sub-tropics, coastal and foothills, hot and humid summers, mild winters, very little easy small game, plenty of critters that can give you a hard time (spiders, snakes, ticks).

This bag will double as an extended trip hiking/camping system for up to weeklong bush stays, and also BOB to get to BOL which is about a week away by foot.

Give me an idea, through your experience, what should stay and what should get tossed.

Bug Out Bag

Bag: Maxpedition Vulture II, 2800ci + pouches = 3200ci

Water kit

2-3L camelbak
1L nalgene
katadyn water filter
iodine tablets
nalgene mylar bag
coffee filters

Food kit

mess tin
metal cup
spork + spatula
energy bars, gel packs
12,000 calories (MREs, etc)
pocket rocket mini stove (MSR)
mini towels
small fry pan/cooking tin (if mess tin isn't sufficient)
fishing kit - line, hooks, sinkers
snares

Shelter kit

bivy tent
sleeping bag
space blanket
sleeping pad
garbage bags, 2x heavy duty
mosquito netting?

Clothing kit

synthetic underwear
long sleeve shirt
cargo pants
gore-tex pants
gore-tex jacket
GI poncho + pack cover
emergency poncho
3 pairs liner socks, 3 pairs wool socks
gaiters
warm gloves
work gloves
knee pads
skull cap
sun hat
shemaugh
crocks
boots
mosquito head net

First Aid & Health & Hygiene kit

Basic FAK
Sun screen, large bottle
Bug repellent, large bottle
Snake bite kit
Multivitamins
EMT shears
N95 Mask
Sleeping pills
Energy pills
Sugar packs
Salt packs
Q-tips
tweezers
toilet paper
soap
toothbrush, toothpaste

Fire kit

Fire steel - BCB Striker Fire Flint + Magnesium block
lifeboat matches
zippo emergency lighter
magnifying glass
emergency candle
tea candle
vaseline soaked cotton balls
trioxane brick

Tool kit

multi-tool - Leatherman surge
Knife - 3" folding?
Knife - Ontario RTAK II
Saw?
550 Paracord - +120ft
15 zip-ties
Trowel or e-tool?
Carabineers

Repair/Maintenance kit

Batteries, AA + AAA, lithium
Gorilla tape
Epoxy resin
Sewing kit(needles, thread)
WD-40
Diamond rod
Spare buckles

Light kit

Headlamp - ?
Light - Fenix LD20
Penlight - Fenix LD05

Communications & Signaling kit

Cell phone
Emergency radio + earbuds
2-way radio
Mirror
Laser pointer
Flares (red and green)
Whistle

Defense kit

Knife - 7" Ka-Bar
Pepper spray
S&W 642 (.38), concealed, 48 rounds

Admin kit

Maps - topo, road, features. 1 primary 1 backup
Compass - primary and backup
Optics - binoculars?
Wallet - small denom money, ID, passport?
Notepad - Rite-in-Rain, Grid paper
Writing - Space pen, pencils
Books - SAS Survival Guide, Edible Plant Guide, Bushcraft Guide
Camera - ?

=====

Once I get it together, will give it a test run and see how it performs with pics and potential vid.
 

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Emperor In Exile
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Sure you got enough ammo???? you seem to have a pretty good load there and it has a few things i did not think of......
 

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Maxpedition Vulture II

The Maxpedition Vulture II is a good pack - I have one myself - but it seems a little "small" for anything over 2 days. If your in hot / warm weather then its probably going to be a good pack, because your not going to have a cold weather sleeping bag strapped to it.




For my hot/warm weather sleep system, all I carry is my poncho liner, and a Magellan inflatable sleeping pad.

If you have a bivy, why do you need mosquito netting?
 

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Discussion Starter #6
robkenpo said:
Sure you got enough ammo???? you seem to have a pretty good load there and it has a few things i did not think of......
Not really a tactical loadout. Ammo seems to weigh a lot ... Should I have more? :)

kev said:
For my hot/warm weather sleep system, all I carry is my poncho liner, and a Magellan inflatable sleeping pad.

If you have a bivy, why do you need mosquito netting?
Thanks, yes actually your review of the V2 and some other members on here were paramount in my decision on the pack. It ain't perfect though. I don't like the straps for the Y retention strap, they seem to come undone by themselves. And it's not a pack I want to be rooting through too often. Bought a bunch of pouches for it, adds 400cubic inches and makes some important stuff readily accessible.

Here's a pic of the pack itself:





Not a huge pack, and would probably switch to alice frame if I head back to the frigid climates to accommodate winter gear.

It would be for warm weather, however it can drop to 0 - 5 degrees C here at night due to desert/scrubland conditions. Mosquitoes are a concern here, along with all manner of crawly and slithery critters. Mosquito netting is for extra protection around my bivvy from mosquitos, flies, spiders and snakes. Unsure of whether it will be good weight or bad weight yet.

Will make note of comments for future use:

*ammo
*mosquito netting


cheers lads
 

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I don't think all of that will fit into a Vulture II and it will certainly be heavier than they comfortably carry (35 lbs). You need to re-think the food. 12 MRE's sealed won't fit into a Vulture II. Broken down, they are still bulky and not much room for everything else. I like tuna, oat meal and trail mix.

Put your sleeping kit into a WP River Bag and attach it to the bottom of the pack w/ the straps and bungi cord. When empty and sealed, it makes a good pillow and so does your pack. Ditch the pillow and ground sheet, unless it fits in the bag no problem.

I really like your kit. You could use some meds in FAK. Anti-biotics, pain killers.

For the Y compression straps, thread them back through the keeper again and tape over them.

You got good attachment pouches.

I have my medical kit (FIGHT Pouch) threaded through the Y strap and a large panel pouch on the front molle webbing. Also have Rolly Polly's on top near carry strap for ammo/water/food.

Put the water bottle pouch on the waist strap for quick access.

I keep my cell/GPS on the weak side shoulder strap in a CP/M pouch w/lanyard.

The admin pouch goes well across the chest strap and doesn't interfere with anything. Might try that.

Bugging out with a snubby? You need a rifle, too. At least something like a Ruger 10/22. Snubbies suck for anything over contact distances. If you want to keep it small, get a Glock 26. Same price, much better gun.
 

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I only have two suggestions: a bottle of combination sunscreen/bug repellant and using a hammock with a canvas roof and mosquito netting on it that can get you up off the ground, hopefully away from those critters that can give you a hard time (spiders, snakes, ticks).

I'm not sure of the purpose of the laser pointer-is it to temporarily blind someone?
 

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Hard Corps
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It looks like you have the basics covered but I have a few additions.

A hammock to get you off the ground and away from the creepy crawlies.

Perhaps dehydrated foods instead of MRE's. You will be able to carry more food/calories.

OTC meds like aspirin, acetameophen, ibuprofen, immodium, sambucol, and others you may deem necessary. Also anti fungal foot powder.

Do you think the crocs would mess to much with a gill net there?

Lastly, a crossbow or break down recurve bow for more food options/defence.
 

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What's the WD-40 for?
I've got a sample tube in one of my kits.

Trowel or e-tool, aye there's the rub.
Nobody can make up their minds which one to carry and it's your call anyway.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
AKpredator said:
I don't think all of that will fit into a Vulture II and it will certainly be heavier than they comfortably carry (35 lbs). You need to re-think the food. 12 MRE's sealed won't fit into a Vulture II. Broken down, they are still bulky and not much room for everything else. I like tuna, oat meal and trail mix.

Yeah, good point. Was only intending to have 1 stripped MRE in here, then make up the difference with calories from other more compact sources. So far, it looks like the main compartment will be primarily for food and some other bulky items(saw, long knife, etc).

Put your sleeping kit into a WP River Bag and attach it to the bottom of the pack w/ the straps and bungi cord. When empty and sealed, it makes a good pillow and so does your pack. Ditch the pillow and ground sheet, unless it fits in the bag no problem.

Thanks. Yeah something like this was the intention, didn't think of the river bag though. Hoping that my whole shelter kit can be on the bottom of the pack like you say.

I really like your kit. You could use some meds in FAK. Anti-biotics, pain killers.

noted.

For the Y compression straps, thread them back through the keeper again and tape over them.

Sweet, just did that now, works better than the system they gave us.

You got good attachment pouches.

I have my medical kit (FIGHT Pouch) threaded through the Y strap and a large panel pouch on the front molle webbing. Also have Rolly Polly's on top near carry strap for ammo/water/food.

nice kit ;) I was eyeing that one and got the FR-1 instead due to cost. I'm no trained medic so didn't think I needed that "pull and go" capability. How do you access the rolly pollys when theyre up at shoulder height? I was thinking of getting one to attach to a belt for foraging and plant gathering.

Put the water bottle pouch on the waist strap for quick access.

Nice, did that now. Was concerned about how high up it rode, and was not balanced by anything of equal weight on the other side of the pack.

I keep my cell/GPS on the weak side shoulder strap in a CP/M pouch w/lanyard.

The admin pouch goes well across the chest strap and doesn't interfere with anything. Might try that.

Will give it a whirl. I took the chest straps off b/c I am using the pack for everyday stuff right now and they get in the way. Figure I'll chuck the GPS in there. Will have map and compass dangling around the neck on a pc lanyard, for easy access.

Bugging out with a snubby? You need a rifle, too. At least something like a Ruger 10/22. Snubbies suck for anything over contact distances. If you want to keep it small, get a Glock 26. Same price, much better gun.

Yeah, I am thinking for only defensive use of the snubby. If I'm far enough away hopefully I can slip away quietly ;) I am also limited severely by firearms restrictions down here, much like UKs. No "high capacity mags" allowed on pistols, nothing over .38, no semi-auto rifles at all, which sadly makes the Ruger 10/22 illegal down here. Thinking of a Winchester lever action in .30-06 or .308 or a Marlin lever .22.

Still debating whether it would be useful in a BOB, as far as weight goes. Adding defensive tools can become an arms race of "just one more" or "just a few more rounds".
In bold.

maggie357 said:
I only have two suggestions: a bottle of combination sunscreen/bug repellant and using a hammock with a canvas roof and mosquito netting on it that can get you up off the ground, hopefully away from those critters that can give you a hard time (spiders, snakes, ticks).

Good call on the combo bottle, will add it to my list. We have bush flies somethin fierce down here, and mossies at night. Does a combo bottle get used up faster? Will look into a hammock, though they don't appeal to me yet.

I'm not sure of the purpose of the laser pointer-is it to temporarily blind someone?

At 500 yards a cheap laser pointer can put out a 10ftx10ft beam. Shine that one someone and they'll see where the lights comin from. Also marking terrain and landmarks for people I'm with. Maybe it's not necessary though.
In bold.

Savage1 said:
It looks like you have the basics covered but I have a few additions.

A hammock to get you off the ground and away from the creepy crawlies.

Yep will look into hammocks.

Perhaps dehydrated foods instead of MRE's. You will be able to carry more food/calories.

OTC meds like aspirin, acetameophen, ibuprofen, immodium, sambucol, and others you may deem necessary. Also anti fungal foot powder.

Good call on the fungal foot powder, will add that to the list.

Do you think the crocs would mess to much with a gill net there?

No I'd have to go a fair bit further north to get into serious croc country. Will look into it.

Lastly, a crossbow or break down recurve bow for more food options/defence.

Could always make a bow & arrows, though our tree selection down here isn't the best for bow construction... Nothin like good Yews or the like. Our aboriginals used boomerangs instead ;)

Defense once we get into the bush isn't my primary concern. The bush out here defends itself pretty nicely so any unprepared two legged vermin won't last long. Considering a light LR to accompany my revolver, but trying to keep weight down.
In bold.

bltjr1951 said:
What's the WD-40 for?
I've got a sample tube in one of my kits.

Useful for knife, tool and camp maintenance when fire/shelter building. Ive used it on my saw while cutting through some standing deadwood for fires. Saves a lot of energy :)

Trowel or e-tool, aye there's the rub.
Nobody can make up their minds which one to carry and it's your call anyway.

Yeah lol. Thinking of just a cheap/light/small trowel for basic camp chores. Leaning towards a light metal over plastic, b/c I can use it around the fire as well. Weight is primary consideration though.
In bold.

Thanks guys, got my notepad out writing stuff down.
 

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Man those laws suck.

OK...

For a handy rifle, I would look at a CZ 527 Carbine or a Savage Scout. They are both about the same price and very practical choices. The 527 is a really neat little rifle. Comes in 7.62 Russky or .223 Rem. Mag fed and fast handling. Great trigger with the single set feature. The Savage has great features as well. Whatever you get, make it a common caliber to find there if SHTF. I know the Aussies issue their own AUG rifle. CZ also makes absolutely outstanding 22's. A match grade .22 is a useful tool that can kill out of all proportion to it's size. Cheap to practice with.

For your handgun, can you at least get a standard sized revolver? Look at a K frame Smith in 38 Special (Models 10,12,14,15,64,). If I could find one, I would get the classic 6" K-38. I can send you speed loaders and speed strips for it. Might even have a nice holster around here.

I have the Rolly Polly pouches clipped to the carry strap. Either side has a little slot that will take them. I keep them there and rigged with Tac Ties so I can remove them quick and attach them to a belt if needed. Otherwise they stay there, out of the way. They will hold ammo, kindling, clothing, food, water bottles and small items that you scrounge or discard. The Mega holds two dead wabbits! I use mine for fly boxes every day right now.

The FIGHT Pouch and others are only little kits. Mine holds a GSW kit but I carry a bunch of other stuff with me nowadays in a NOLS bag. I just got the urge a few months ago and stocked two of them. Don't really know why but it's already paid off well. Robitussin, Nasal spray, allergy meds, pain meds, Anitbiotics, Bag Balm, Neosporin, EpiPen, Iodine swabs and solution, lots of band aids and bandages, Quik clot, sutures and lots of steri strips. Superglue... I carry it everywhere. Sunblock and bug dope all summer.
 

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Have been camping plenty but mostly out of the back of a truck, where we park and hike in about 6 hours, then hike out after two or three nights. So I'm used to a heavier load. Also, had to leave a significant amount of stuff back in another country. I have some of the stuff on this list, probably 40%, still plenty to go.

My AO is sub-tropics, coastal and foothills, hot and humid summers, mild winters, very little easy small game, plenty of critters that can give you a hard time (spiders, snakes, ticks).

This bag will double as an extended trip hiking/camping system for up to weeklong bush stays, and also BOB to get to BOL which is about a week away by foot.

Give me an idea, through your experience, what should stay and what should get tossed.
Great list......I'm a firm believer in the 'kit' system. Here's an example of some of mine (yes it's in need of a bit of an update :)):

http://readiness-survival.com/general/ghbs/bob-kit-system-2/
 

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I'd think about cutting weight first. Many ways to skin a cat. First, since you HAVE an AO, caches come to mind. So an e-tool is a must. The trade off is that you have supplies at any given time.

That said, your Admin category looks good, but I'd swap the SAS Survival Guide AND the Bush guide for 6 Ways IN and 12 Ways Out by George Jasper; inquire here; http://usrsog.org/ (Just sayin') Lose/cache the wild edibles book. If you don't already know it when you need it, you're out of luck. Lots of look alikes....one needs hands on experience prior.

Defense kit; I'm assuming you keep the Kabar razor sharp, never use it for anything else and keep it mid torso for ease of access if knocked down or injured.... I'd lose the pepper spray. I'd also cache more ammo....and rifles....and more ammo.....

You get cell phone signals in your AO?

Fiskars folding saw for quiet cutting, but a hammer pole type hawk for ease of construction. Cold steel's pipe hawk is a good choice. http://www.coldsteel.com/pipe-hawk.html Wrap the handle with paracord.

550 paracord; you need more, but less. Lots of tasks require hanks of 20 or 30 ft. any more gets easily tangled in the bush. Keep smaller hanks with you and use a longer piece only if necessary. Smaller hanks can be joined. Use small knots near the end of the hank to identify which one you're holding in the dark; i.e. 2 knots, 20 ft., 3 knots, 30 ft., etc.

Dump the matches, carry several lighters, ferro and a blast match or equivalent one handed device.....in case of injury.... Even empty butane lighters will produce spark acceptable for vaseline cotton balls. (Of course, empty shells of the lighters can be stuffed with said cottonballs and sealed with tape.)

I'd lose the sleeping pills. I don't want to be drugged if anything should happen.

Since you've got the Goretex clothing, I'd cache the GI poncho. Replace it with a lightweight tarp for overhead protection/shelter. (Which also means you can lose/cache the tent.)

An interesting pack that I've run across turns into a hammock. Such a system could help you lose/cache the sleeping pad at the very least;
http://www.grampsleather.com/id103.html

I hate iodine. Katadyn tabs for me. Aquamira straw filters would cut the weight of the Katadyn filter. Lots of boiling would mean I'd want to have some tea or coffee with me. Stainless steel water bottle is fire friendly and a single utility pot rather than a mess tin.

MREs, cache, cache, cache. Rice, cache, cache, cache.

Didn't see, but needed;

Heavy duty waterproof bags,

8-10 sq. ft. clear plastic for emergency vegetation still and/or debris shelter waterproofing.

sub packs for gathering, utility type use, for putting animals/fish, etc. in while away from camp.....packed in/with gear can make your day.....

Dental Floss! Your teeth and gums will appreciate the removal of the particles that wild meat and game will leave firmly lodged in them.

Pain killers. At the least, Ibuprofen.

Not just vaseline cotton balls, but a small jar of vaseline. It keeps the chafing to nill, it can keep bugs away, it's a great lubricant for a bow drill....the uses go off the chart. In swampy and/or sandy areas, your backside will appreciate the protection.

Not just vaseline, but antibacterial ointment.

Bandaging, Tape, antiseptic.....basically, first aid type equipment....to also include blister remedies/protection/prevention. Quick clot might save your life.

Firearm cleaning kit. I'd recommend Gunzilla. You can read about it all over the net. It's DA BOMB!

If you haven't replaced your boot laces with paracord, I'd recommend it. Leave the ends a foot longer on each side for a quick length for using the inner strands for trap/shelter construction....or maybe dental floss in a pinch or at the worst case, pulling yourself together.....

Also assuming that you've already got a supply of Ranger bands on or about your pack. If not, 1" bands cut from bicycle inner tubes will do fine.....also emergency fire starter.....

Overall, a good list, but the longer one intends (or prepares) to stay in the wild, the more one would do well to think mobility. Loss of weight, strength, stresses of wilderness subsistance.......well, mobility and speed of travel of out an immediate area are your allies. Count on all of the aforementioned and cache anything you can. This requires planning.

For this reason, I am a firm believer that you can't carry everything you'll ever need to eat or drink.....but you can carry the tools you'll need.

So, I think lists are OK, but lists of your caches are even better.

Another side point, it's not always what one does, but HOW one does them that makes all the difference. For example, your list may be great, but all dumped in pouches and compartments in your ruck won't work well.

Dividing them into levels according to priority and frequency of need is a better idea; Level one, on the body, pockets and basic fanny-pack type container. Level 2, daypack/harness/molly type vest. Level 3, Main Ruck, etc. This way, no matter what happens, you've always got level 1 or maybe 2 with you.

Added levels are additions, not duplications. That way, if you have to jettison the main pack, you're well on your way to a cache location for re-supply.....but your basic subsistance gear is with you.

Cach anything you'd prefer not to be without. 2 is 1....1 is none.

Just my .02
 

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Damn, how long is a nickel's worth?

On another thread a newbie told me that people could carry or wear whatever they wanted.
It's their choice. Maybe OP has a hard time sleeping.
Your book choice sounds like a PLA fan.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Damn, how long is a nickel's worth?

On another thread a newbie told me that people could carry or wear whatever they wanted.
It's their choice. Maybe OP has a hard time sleeping.
Your book choice sounds like a PLA fan.
Eh, I've rucked around plenty of weight. Don't know how fast you plan on moving but in my experience a steady walking pace can be maintained hours and hours a day, and days on end. I don't have Montana-esque terrain here so humping up steep hills isn't a problem.

--

Here's a little sample pic, of the lighting system I use:



Top - Zebralight H501: good light, I don't like the pocket clip but the beam profile is great.
Middle - Fenix LD20: great light, used for general purpose and cycling. white thing is the diffuser 'lantern' tip for LD20.
Bottom - Fenix LD05: okay penlight, it's stainless steel so a little heavy, but does the job. used for EDC now.
Extra - Little button light that came with the LD20, goes on keyring and i guess emergency light for the BOB.
Not pictured - 9xAA L91s, 4xAAA alkalines
 

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All that fits in that pack????

What does it weigh? I know you said you were accustomed to heavy loads, but I gotta think all that would weigh more than I could/would want to lug more than several miles
 

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What about the billy can???

Seriously, your list sounds great BUT this load looks like it is going to be very, very heavy. Have you actually packed this all, AND hiked? I am not being rude, but this people on this website often put together these phenomenal lists but quite honestly, they are impractically heavy.

What about lashing/rope?

Oh, and take the weight of the pack and hike with it WITH WATER. One of the heaviest buggers in your bag is going to water.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
mia said:
What about the billy can???

Seriously, your list sounds great BUT this load looks like it is going to be very, very heavy. Have you actually packed this all, AND hiked? I am not being rude, but this people on this website often put together these phenomenal lists but quite honestly, they are impractically heavy.

What about lashing/rope?

Oh, and take the weight of the pack and hike with it WITH WATER. One of the heaviest buggers in your bag is going to water.
It's been getting refined as I get more infield experience with it. Got plenty of paracord, 8-10 ft on the wrist + 50ft in the pack.

It is a little stout but not as heavy as some might think.

The list in the OP has a few things that aren't in the BOB, and probably won't be unless I switch to an alice frame.

my 'billy can' is just a 0.5L titanium cup :)
 
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