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operatorchan.org
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Discussion Starter #1
Disclaimer: I don't claim to be an expert on the subject, I just make observations.

The November attacks on Mormon communities in Mexico had me actively researching the influence of the Mexican drug cartels shortly after. I always thought that the cartels simply produced drugs, sold them across the border, and fought the Mexican authorities as well as each other due to their power dynamic struggle. But after learning how deep their control goes, I realized they are a much larger threat to US national security than simply a supplier of illegal drugs and their violent nature.

Cartels have been known to be using legitimate banks to hold their money, buy property as legitimate investments, and investing laundered money into Mexican and US companies. Just one example:

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/n...1-million-money-laundering-scandal-2018-02-21

Trump's administration wants to classify the cartels as terrorist groups. First lets look at a simple definition of terrorism: A non-state actor that influences politics. They meet the definition due to assassination of Mexican political candidates that they don't like. As well as using money to influence politics in Mexico. The cartels also use child soldiers, similar to conflicts in Africa. Training camps, similar to those of Al Qaeda and ISIS, are used to train cartel members in guerrilla warfare. Another trope of terrorists that many overlook is that there is a counter hearts and minds campaign. Giving money, food, material goods to the communities in their region of control is common for cartels.

However, classifying them as a terrorist organization would mean that the legitimate business that they associate with would be under the same scrutiny as any other business that is found to deal with terrorists. Those could have many unintended consequences that I personally think will be 100% overlooked rather unintentionally or not. This could disrupt businesses and potentially lead to economic turmoil in the US over time. An extreme example: having to carve up a large business conglomerate due to their (possible) unintentional dealings with cartels will cost the taxpayer money. In addition to that, people could be out of their jobs due to legal action when they as individuals didn't actually commit crimes in the first place.

I'm not saying it would happen rapidly. This scenario would be a slow burn if it would play out.

Are cartels involved in terrorist levels of activities? Absolutely. Should they be labeled with the classic terrorist classification? Really hard to say with the potential for blow back on the American economy.

Just some thoughts.
 

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The reluctant mexican authorities only fight the cartels when there is no way around it and the pressure is too much, with the exception of SEMAR. SEMAR are the Mx marines who are trained by us and seem to be incorruptible.

Every financial institution in mexico has seen itself embroiled in cartel related money laundering, additionally many of the 5 star hotels in Cancun, Acapulco and cabo are said to be derived from narco money.

I have not heard of children soldiers but the cartel definitely uses them as spotters and eyes and ears around our ports of entry. The cartels already employ former Mx special forces members who's experience they exploit to conduct urban and rural ambushes on police and army forces. many of their military grade weapons have either been stolen from their army armories and/or bought from crooked military officers in central and south america (so much for blaming the US for arms trafficking).

Many a former police comandante has left his police job and become a Narco trafficker boss.

Sinaloa is a definite Robin Hood scenario, where the cartels give back to the people and are loved in return, plus most families have cartel employed family members.

I think the Mx govt fears that if the terrorist classification got passed, then we would begin our covert action down south since we can prove the nexus between cartels and crime in the US. It would also mean the downfall of any mx administration even if they were not playing ball with us. Sadly, they're all crooks....

I see any economic blow back mainly affecting our border cities where most cartel money is invested on our side (I say MOST).

Just my 2 cents.
 

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the area the Mormons were killed in has a lot of gang fighting going on because it is the location of a recently discovered lithium deposit... the largest on record.
 

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Cartels will only follow what the US mob has done...adapt. right now Mexican Military cant even keep a high level target in custody let alone taken down the cartels.

If drugs are legalized, human trafficking, kidnapping, and other valuable economies will grow. There is a working model here in the US for the past 100 years that started with bank robberies and shootouts on the street and has evolved into high level corporate enterprises that shelter such nefarious activities.

Oh and PS..cartel money built 80% of the buildings in Miami in then1980s - they've been established here for quite some time.
 

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legalize drugs and the cartels are dead. Keep pressuring them with military and they get richer.
Not even.

California is still seeing plenty of illegal pot. They are talking tax increases on the legal drugs, which will make it even worse.
The cartels are doing just fine, and will continue to do so, no matter what laws you pass.
 

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I wasn't aware of that, interesting. Do the cartels have 100% claim to it? Or is it owned by the government?
cartels aren't fighting over the lithium find.. they are fighting over the territory for the opportunity that comes with a large industrial city popping up.

Prostitution
Drugs
Protection
Extortion
etc...
 

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The Cartels have been buying off politicians , LEO , , prosecutors and judges etc.at the city , county, state and federal level for a long time and laundering the money through Western Union , Wal-Mart etc for a long time why use banks when one can use 15-20 million illegal foreign invaders as couriers. Funny the Vegas Casino Security Guard disappeared back to Mexico , wonder how he got the Job? Just working for the Cartels like he always did. DOJ stands for nothing more than Department of Establishment Protection or Department of Criminal Protection. just to clear things up there is no REAL justice left in our system of injustice. JMHO and S/FI!
 

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The Cartels have been buying off politicians , LEO , , prosecutors and judges etc.at the city , county, state and federal level for a long time and laundering the money through Western Union , Wal-Mart etc for a long time why use banks when one can use 15-20 million illegal foreign invaders as couriers. Funny the Vegas Casino Security Guard disappeared back to Mexico , wonder how he got the Job? Just working for the Cartels like he always did. DOJ stands for nothing more than Department of Establishment Protection or Department of Criminal Protection. just to clear things up there is no REAL justice left in our system of injustice. JMHO and S/FI!
And THAT is what the War on Drugs has always been ALL about! Merging itself with the US Government and LEO. Law enforcement runs the drug trade in this country.
 

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Almost every Mexican family has someone in the drug trade. Grandson gives grandma money to take care of the shack full of babies.

This, as much as any upper-echelon reason, is why Mexico is a black-hole of corruption. The ordibnary citizens benefit too much.

I not particularly a Trump fan, but I don't see how anyone can argue that the cartels are terrorists. Bring it on.
 

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Almost every Mexican family has someone in the drug trade. Grandson gives grandma money to take care of the shack full of babies.

This, as much as any upper-echelon reason, is why Mexico is a black-hole of corruption. The ordibnary citizens benefit too much.

I not particularly a Trump fan, but I don't see how anyone can argue that the cartels are terrorists. Bring it on.
I had/have a lot of Mexican friends in Tulsa (Both legal and illegal) and they can score any drug you wish for! *The word friends beings used instead of acquaintances. All are drug connected.
 

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I berthed next to a platoon Mexican Marines back in 09.
Nice guys and decent cooks.
They actually chipped in and bought me a castnet then taught me how to use it.

Puerto Salina, I remember it well
 

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But after learning how deep their control goes, I realized they are a much larger threat to US national security than simply a supplier of illegal drugs and their violent nature.
The cartels are here and are operating as they wish. They absolutely control large swathes of the US on the border.

Phoenix is the kidnapping capital of the US. Care to guess who is behind it?

Farmers and ranchers all along the border arm themselves for protection against the cartels.

My wife went to El Paso 7 or 8 years ago on business. She had a couple of hours to spend before her meeting and thought she might do a little shopping around the hotel. The concierge gave her a list of nearby stores NOT to shop in because they were money-laundering fronts for the cartels. If you go into them, they will suspect you are a federal agent and do bad things to you. In El Paso, USA.

Welcome to the real world. See if you can spread the news to your unbelieving family, friends, and neighbors.

People who do not live in these parts just do not understand that it is happening RIGHT NOW. Every time these open borders types open their mouths, I want to puke. Perhaps we can make them shop in those stores in El Paso.
 

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I used to frequent Mexico a bunch, I’ve been in some bad places in Juarez before and after the border closed do to cartels and go to and from El Paso into Juarez. There is a region in El Paso which daily Mexican folks sell goods for the cartels on the border which is technically in the USA and it’s a day pass then they go back home. A colleague of mines wife went across the border to eat breakfast, a man walked in opened fired and killed 2 people next to their eggs Benedict. It is extremely dangerous in these areas and in Mexico City. Anyone on planet earth that thinks these folks don’t come across our border and terrorize people are being extremely naive or they have alternative motives.

The entire southern border next to El Paso is dangerous into Juarez. It isn’t safe by any means. It isn’t a select few people who are “bad apples”, there are many “bad people”.
 
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