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Discussion Starter #1
Which one is more useful for close range, i.e. less than 100 yards engagement? I already have an ar15.
 

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Start up the rotors
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Useful for what?
People? The AK is the right answer, but you have an AR so that is covered.
A 12ga is really effective as an anti personnel weapon at close range, and I can hit fairly reliably at 100 with slugs.
They're still limited in capacity, slower follow up shots, much slower reload.

The real answer is get both!

ETA: Saiga style 12? No.
 
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Benelli, $1500 but there's a reason its in the movies... I have a Mossberg 930 SPX. No choke so @ 100 yards 00buck is peppering around the target (target is the safest place). I consider it a 50 yard weapon. 930 JM Pro would have a choke and extend that a bit. I don't care for the box fed shotguns. Slugs for 100 yards or an actual ak in 7.62x39 but you have an AR so it would be a dup.
 

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I have the Saiga S12.

It’s a bit of fun, mag dumps are exciting, but loading the mags into the gun quickly can be tricky. It’s reliable, and mine handles light target load crap up to slugs. But....

Realistically, the AK might be better.
Or an upper for your AR in .300 BO.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thanks for your opinions. I guess like the idea of pumping out slugs at people that want to hurt me...maybe obsessed with the idea? It seems to me to be the most intimidating weapon to use if people are trying to hurt you. It may not be more effective than an AR or AK...still, a slug is about...71 caliber? That is why I have been kicking this decision back and forth. They do make up to 25 round drums for them.
 

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Knowledge is Power
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Pretty much any kind of incoming round is intimidating. SUSTAINED, ACCURATE incoming fire is intimidating. I personally have next to zero use for a Saiga. A regular pump or Semi shotgun has its uses, however, aimed rifle fire typically is superior across the board except in some limited close range situations.
 

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Id skip mag feed shotguns all together, to bulky, very slow to load and no real world capacity over a pump or semi shotgun with a tubular magazine.
 

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What hell, pay attention
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If youre going to pick between the two, the get the AK. Then go ahead and get the shotgun version. By then hopefully, youll be fully AK acclimated. :)

I have one of the Lynx 12 AK shotguns, and I like it a lot. A lot like a rifle caliber AK, with a tad more recoil. Its easy handling, shoulders and shoots easily, and mine has been very reliable. I keep most of my mags loaded with #1 buck.

I dont understand the slow to load comments, as they arent. I can load a 10 round mag about as quick as I can load a 30 round AK mag.

There is a little trick with them, or at least with the Lynx, but if you hold the charging handle back with the knife hand of your palm, like you were going to release the bolt on an M1 Garand but with your thumb wrapped over the top of the cover, the mags go right into the gun with no fiddling, and the gun is loaded when you remove your hand and let the bolt go. Once you get that down, it makes for a fast and easy mag change.

Other than that, its a 12ga AK.
 

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Still not sure I understand the point there.

Unless maybe you only have one mag, but that doesnt seem to make much sense either. Who buys a mag fed gun and then doesnt have spare mags to feed it?

One spare 10 round mag in my back pocket, is a lot easier to deal with than 8 -10 loose rounds in my pockets for a tube-fed.
 

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Pengyou,how much would a 25 rd drum loaded with slugs weigh?5-6 pounds?
Probabley help with recoil.

If your shooting for 100 yards,would your aim change as it gets lighter after shooting 10-15 rounds?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Pengyou,how much would a 25 rd drum loaded with slugs weigh?5-6 pounds?
Probabley help with recoil.

If your shooting for 100 yards,would your aim change as it gets lighter after shooting 10-15 rounds?
That is a good question. That is why I post this kind of question here :thumb:
 

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You're best bet is a VEPR 12 if you want a mag fed semi auto 12 gauge. Mag changes are much easier than a Saiga 12 and have self regulating gas valve. That means you can feed it low or high brass 12 gauge ammo and it will cycle. The Saigas often need lots of tuning out of the box to get it where you want it. Its no coincidence that the VEPR 12 is used by a fair amount of 3 gunners. Out of the box its far superior to the Saiga. I have both and much prefer the VEPR.
 

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Unfortunately It's hard to find a place to shoot a saiga 12 or semiauto box fed shotgun. Most ranges don't allow them.

If you have a place to shoot that isnt a paid gun range they are fun. But they can have function issues. I personally wouldn't make it a gtg gun. But a fun range toy or hunting shotgun yes.

An AK47/74/AKM Is made for putting people in the ground. 7.62x39 is a nasty cartridge and so is 5.45. That being said. Spend the money on a decent AK. Steer clear of gimmicks. Remember your life is depending on it.
 

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Thanks for your opinions. I guess like the idea of pumping out slugs at people that want to hurt me...maybe obsessed with the idea? It seems to me to be the most intimidating weapon to use if people are trying to hurt you. It may not be more effective than an AR or AK...still, a slug is about...71 caliber? That is why I have been kicking this decision back and forth. They do make up to 25 round drums for them.
I doubt that it would matter all that much if you were blasting away using slugs or bullets towards other folks. The vast majority will be just as " intimidated" with either flying towards them.

I had the Saiga 12 and sold it off. ( Could not wait to get rid of it.)

Unreliable, ( especially those drum mags) , ,slow to reload, and it didnt meet my accuracy requirements with slugs at 50 yards...let alone 100.
In short.....a classic example of a gimmick gun.

I use an AK pistol in the HD/ PDW role now, and for the following reasons instead of a shotgun .

1. Less felt recoil via multiple shots.
2. 100% reliablitity with good mags including 75rd drum mags.
3. 7.62x39mm will zip right thru level 3a soft body armor where slugs won't
4. The AK pistol is much more forgiving when using it in very tight quarters such as inside buildings, and much easier to use effectively with one hand.
5. Much more suppressor friendly than any shotgun.
6. Much higher " on board" ammunition capacity. ( Standard cap 30rd mags, and 75rd drum mags. )
7. First hand experience concerning terminal effects via 7.62x39mm. ( people, hogs, and deer)
8. A more reliable weapon to mount lights/ optics .
9. AK pistol weighs less, and ammo weighs considerably less.

Note: Have no use for an AR15 either, as the AK is my personal preference via a weapon meant for fighting.

Note: Pics below show this AK with a Shockwave brace and standard cap 30rd mag.
11B
 

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Pengyou,how much would a 25 rd drum loaded with slugs weigh?5-6 pounds?
Probabley help with recoil.

If your shooting for 100 yards,would your aim change as it gets lighter after shooting 10-15 rounds?
25 slugs ( 2.75 inch) weigh 2.4 lbs.

Now add your empty drum mag weight to the above to get your total weight.

On another note pertaining directly to this thread......

50 rds of 762x39mm weighs 1.87 lbs

11B
 

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25 slugs ( 2.75 inch) weigh 2.4 lbs.

Now add your empty drum mag weight to the above to get your total weight.

On another note pertaining directly to this thread......

50 rds of 762x39mm weighs 1.87 lbs

11B
Excellent point. That's a lot of weight to hump for limited range and accuracy. Stationary defense much better.
 

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Id skip mag feed shotguns all together, to bulky, very slow to load and no real world capacity over a pump or semi shotgun with a tubular magazine.
Agreed. Shot shells don't like to hold their shape well in a box magazine. And the Saiga 12 style guns aren't particularly easy to load the magazines in without a LOT of practice.

You have an AR15, I'd find an AK to be redundant. Your sporting goods store Remington 870 or Mossberg 500 would be a better choice for a shotgun. It still gives you that thump you want at close range, but you can diversify your shot-shell stockpile to the point that it can become your main hunting gun. If you must have a semi auto, the Rem 1100 and Mossy 930 cycle buckshot rather well. I'd err towards Mossbergs QC over freedom group owned Remington these days, personally.

From slugz to 1 1/8oz #8 bird shot, you can hunt anything in North America with one gun. Get the shotgun because it'll be the best tool for the most jobs. Your AR covers all your AK territory beyond situations that devolve to splitting hairs.
 

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Unfortunately It's hard to find a place to shoot a saiga 12 or semiauto box fed shotgun. Most ranges don't allow them.

If you have a place to shoot that isnt a paid gun range they are fun. But they can have function issues. I personally wouldn't make it a gtg gun. But a fun range toy or hunting shotgun yes.

An AK47/74/AKM Is made for putting people in the ground. 7.62x39 is a nasty cartridge and so is 5.45. That being said. Spend the money on a decent AK. Steer clear of gimmicks. Remember your life is depending on it.
Come on over to my pit, you can blast away all day long. Hell I even have a stash of woods porn you may read at your leisure. Good articles.
 
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