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I am trying to decide if I want to invest in a ar15 with short stoke piston in 6.8.I know ammo and mags are expensive. I am already well armed and my arsenal is scenario flexible.The 6.8 would be my new general purpose weapon.it would be my go to first gun.What do you think?Is the 6.8 that far ahead with that platform to make well worth it?
 

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If you don't care about the cost, go with the 6.8. Otherwise get the AK, it will do everything the 6.8 will do.
 

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I just head-to-head compared a new POF piston upper to a new rock river gas impingement. Guess which on failed to extract within the first 100 rounds, and which one went through 200 rounds of wolf perfectly (my version of a torture test). If you guessed the expensive one jammed, go to the head of the class.

Here's another little piston tidbit. Lots of ink has been spilled on how the piston is superior because it keeps the hot dirty gasses out of the receiver. That is true and the workings do seem to be cleaner. Apparently it is cooler as well, and that is supposed to be good for it. We'll here's the problem- it vents the gasses under the hand guard. As in where your hand is. Apparently, I'm the only person in the country who, when given the option of heating the receiver of his rifle or cooking his support hand thinks that the former is the better choice. I am not sure why other gas piston guns like an M1, AK, or m14 seem to avoid this. But I can tell you from first hand (no pun intended) experience that the piston AR did.

I also had a 6.8- the top of the line PRI Good accurate rifle. I like the round. I really, really liked it. I sold it off. Here's why:

Ammo is expensive and not readily available. I thought I would work around it by practicing with a 223 as it would be less expensive, and since the rifles are the same, it would still be good quality practice.

Then I got to thinking that somehow, someday, probably about 1 second after I needed it to work for real, I'd end up putting a 223 magazine in the 6.8 and the suck factor would be really high. The magazines ARE different, but they look pretty much the same. It was bad juju in my opinion. Maybe I'm a simpleton, but I like to make it as hard to make a mistake as I can.

The problem was that I really wanted the ballistic advantages of the 6.8. Then I realized that I never signed the Hague convention and I could use whatever ammo I wanted in a fight. I decided that the Corbons loaded with Barnes TSX bullets were way more effective than the FMJ the military is stuck with. It is kind of a have my cake and eat it too. I'm sure the 6.8 with TSX would be even better, I'm happy with my decision. If I mess up and load the wrong magazine, it will still work and I wouldn't stand in front of it even if they are 40g varmint bullets.

The AR isn't my primary go-to anyway, it is for my wife and kid, neither of them can handle a heavier rifle. I had the barrel turned down as thin as safety dictates and now, they have a really light rifle that is not bad at all. They easily mount a PVS-14/eaotech combo on the flat top without need for a railed front handguard which also helps keep the weight down.

As far as the AK goes, I like it more than I thought I would. I'm a lefty so I think the safety is great. I don't know why they made such a great left-handed rifle, but my right- handed wife isn't as enthusiastic about it. The major downside that I see is that advanced optics are not as readily mounted as on an AR.

As far as I am concerned, night vision capability is an absolute requirement and it far outweighs any advantages a change in what the rifle shoots has to offer. If you have the $$ for a good 6.8 and ammo, spend it on a PVS14/Eotech in a Larue mount and you will gain WAY more than going from 223 to 6.8. I'd go so far as to say I'd rather have a AR with a 22LR conversion kit and night vision than a M14 without night vision. Once you have used good gen3 night vision, you will likely share my enthusiasm

Sorry if this was a bit long, hope it helps.
 

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I'd go ak.


But if someone offered me a 6.8 piston I'd take it... but ONLY if it was made by Barrett.

(Look up the differneces in the pistons... I've SEEN POS... I mean POF pistons BREAK from shooting (Quality ammo)
 

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I am trying to decide if I want to invest in a ar15 with short stoke piston in 6.8.I know ammo and mags are expensive. I am already well armed and my arsenal is scenario flexible.The 6.8 would be my new general purpose weapon.it would be my go to first gun.What do you think?Is the 6.8 that far ahead with that platform to make well worth it?
If you can afford it DO IT! and while you are at it get a cheap 5.56 upper and you got it made, cheap ammo and the highest reliabilty set up you can get in an excellent caliber but you need to get two of the 6.8 piston operated uppers so you can give me one!

Also with the 5.56 upper you can get a Ceiner .22lr conversion unit and shoot real cheap too
 

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I just head-to-head compared a new POF piston upper to a new rock river gas impingement. Guess which on failed to extract within the first 100 rounds, and which one went through 200 rounds of wolf perfectly (my version of a torture test). If you guessed the expensive one jammed, go to the head of the class.

Here's another little piston tidbit. Lots of ink has been spilled on how the piston is superior because it keeps the hot dirty gasses out of the receiver. That is true and the workings do seem to be cleaner. Apparently it is cooler as well, and that is supposed to be good for it. We'll here's the problem- it vents the gasses under the hand guard. As in where your hand is. .
You mention something many people fail to think about but quality piston operated upper manufacturers do warn about, NEVER use a ventilated handgard made for a standard AR, you need to use a handguard made for the piston operated uppers. I have had the joy of shooting 7.62x39 piston op ARs and if I could afford it I would have one in a minute. They are a beast of a different color. But the gas venting is no worse than on an AK, actually it uses less, since the AK is essentally a brute force kind of design, in that it moves a much greater amount of mass than the AR. You also make a good point about the fact that the cost does not always follow the quality. How often we find this to be true... a prime example of this is battle knives... without a doubt one of, if not the best, the time proven Kabar, well under a hundred dollars yet look at all the pretenders to the throne that are five times the cost, let the buyer beware...





:zombie
 

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Yes, cost does not always follow quality. The other important lesson is TRY THINGS OUT YOURSELF!!!! Every magazine article says the POF is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I'm not saying it isn't. I am saying that none of them mentioned how hot it got on the hand (I used the handguards that POF puts on it, one would hope they were the appropriate ones). After trying things for myself and making the rifle fit my needs and abilities, I have the rifle set up the best for me and my family. It might suck for you and yours, and both viewpoints are probably correct.
Gather your information from wherever you can, then TEST TEST TEST it out. The more you practice, the better your gear will perform and the more bugs you will work out of the system. Just because the SEALs say it is better doesn't meant it is better for you! It may be better for them, or someone may just be blowing smoke. Either way, I am the only one that can decide for me because nobody else knows my circumstances as well as I do.
 

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I'm the boogey man.......
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The biggest problem w/ 6.8 is the cost of the ammo.......

I'd rather have 10,000 .223 or 7.62x39 than 2000 6.8 rounds on hand any day....
 

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Animis Opibusque Parati
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No it won’t dumbass, that’s why they made it in the 1st place! :taped:
Um, actually, he's right and you're wrong. The 6.8 and the 7.62x39 have similar ballistics when shot from an AR. They're both good for about 450 yards. No need to get nasty.

I say the hell with the 6.8 SPC. The 6.5 Grendel beats it hands down. It does everything the 6.8 does.... out to 1200 yards.
 

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Hey Bert, if you say the POF is no good, then which gas piston AR is best?

I only ask because I am looking into POFs.
 

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Hey Bert, if you say the POF is no good, then which gas piston AR is best?

I only ask because I am looking into POFs.

Barrett. Look at the designs of all of the other piston systems. They all have a weak point... where the piston enters the upper reciever.

THat's where they break.

THe Barrett uses a different piston system, similar to the M14 Vs the M1...

That's why they don't break like the others do.
 

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What I have learned is that the question isn't what is the advantage of a piston design but rather what is the advantage TO ME?. I live in a hot humid environment. I don't have the need or perceived need to run the weapon dry that the folks in the desert have. In fact, I need to keep my weapons well oiled to prevent rust. The other thing I need is light weight, the lighter the better.

So, after much trial, I have decided that a gas impingement design, 16 inch barrel, chrome lined, turned down to thinnest configuration possible, flat top, Troy folding sights, collapsible stock is what fits MY needs. I understand that all choices are compromises- this is the compromise that best suits MY needs.
 

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if you get shot by either or, are you really gonna care which one it was?
 

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Um, actually, he's right and you're wrong. The 6.8 and the 7.62x39 have similar ballistics when shot from an AR. They're both good for about 450 yards. No need to get nasty.

I say the hell with the 6.8 SPC. The 6.5 Grendel beats it hands down. It does everything the 6.8 does.... out to 1200 yards.
The 6.8 has excellent accuracy at 200m and ranges up to 1000m. It is a military bullet. The 6.5 is a hunting bullet, its only slightly better at range than the 6.8. It doesn’t have the short range accuracy. Also it has the design of the 7.62x39 so there are very few western weapons that can chamber it without some serious re-fits.

I notice you changed your post from "they both have the same ballistics", because you were wrong. Or was it someone ells that has that posted?
 
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