Are safes safe?

[dmas]

Most safes seem to be for fire resistance. But beyond that it seems like you're putting all your good stuff in one spot for easy collection by crooks. Even bolted down safes, at least the commonly available ones from mass retailers, seem pretty easy to defeat.

[Nomad, 2nd]

Decoy safe.

[Aerindel]

No.

As a firefighter, breaking into safes following a fire is something we commonly do for homeowners.

They are always easy to break into...and the contents always totally destroyed.

Perhaps a better kind exists, but they are not the kind people seem to have.

[IamZeke]

Have a floor safe installed in your concrete slab. Cut a piece of drywall to fit into the inset to cover the top. Throw an area rug and a coffee table over it.

[munik]

As a locksmith and safe tech, you get what you pay for.
You are not beginning to look at a real safe until you get in the $2500-3000 and up range and 800# or so and up....and that's the bottom end for a free standing gun safe.
Safes/vaults installed in or with rebar concrete floors and walls can be decent if done right.

[TomArnold]

The ones from mass market retailers are basically prettied up tin cans. The walls are super thin and are really just to limit easy access by kids and not any real security.

Take a look at Sturdy Safe. They have great safes at good prices. They aren't the prettiest - they spend the money on materials and a basic mottled gray powder coat. Very thick steel for the price and a couple of levels of fire protection along with other options.

They are very heavy. You are NOT going to move them with a hand truck from the hardware store.

Sturdysafe.com

[PalmettoTree]

A lock only keeps the honest man out.

[IamZeke]

Originally Posted by PalmettoTree

A lock only keeps the honest man out.

But a good lock resists a thug long enough for you to load a magazine.

Nothing is foolproof but good locks buy you time. Time a thug might not want to spend and just go find an easier victim.

[Justme11]

One problem is as a survivalist, we tend to have some rather capable tools in the house. if the bad guy has a few minutes he will likely find an array of angle grinders, circular saws, pry bars and sledge hammers etc.

[Pitbull_Dallas]

Most will stop the honest thief. Partly because they don't want to hang around too long, grab and run. I have a combination filing cabinet and safe. It's not the greatest, but at least the contents of safe itself are supposed to be good up to 1500 degrees.

[6.8SPC]

A circular saw or a worm-drive saw, with an abrasive "Cut-off" blade and you go in on the side if it is bolted down. If not bolted down, just lay it on its front, and go in the back. Takes about three to six minutes.

[IamZeke]

Originally Posted by Pitbull_Dallas

Most will stop the honest thief. Partly because they don't want to hang around too long, grab and run. I have a combination filing cabinet and safe. It's not the greatest, but at least the contents of safe itself are supposed to be good up to 1500 degrees.

Commercial fire files rock.

[PalmettoTree]

Originally Posted by IamZeke

But a good lock resists a thug long enough for you to load a magazine.

Nothing is foolproof but good locks buy you time. Time a thug might not want to spend and just go find an easier victim.

Oh I keep my silver, etc in a safe the adage just proves noting is safe from a determined thief. Plus thieves are mostly lazy so a safe can help.

[Justme11]

I picked up a little Honeywell fire resistant document safe on a whim about 8 years ago.
It seems to be pretty stout steel , came with bolt down snap bolts and requires both a dimple key and a combination to open.
It was only around $100 at Harmless Freight. I think they stopped selling them, so maybe I got a clearance deal or something.



Some safes using an electronic keypad/solenoid apparently can be opened with a strong rare earth magnet to operate the unlocking solenoid which uses a magnetic field to open normally. Wow, they really didn't think that one through.

At least this one, I can't find anyone posting an opening hack for it.

It has a no-mildew guarantee (apparently the fire proofing material most safes use can make the interior damp and mildew prone).
1700 deg F 1 hour fire rating. Surround it with some concrete blocks to extend that.

But yeah, a few minutes with a big angle grinder will get into just about anything.

Looks like First Alert sells it now.
http://www.acedepot.com/2084f.html?g...hoCANcQAvD_BwE

[Jack Swilling]

Most everyone gets an ANSI rated Home Security Container, not a safe. A real ANSI rated safe like AmSec or Brown costs a bundle and is way heavy. As the ANSI rating implies, they are safe, and used mainly in commercial settings, but homeowners with the $$$ and common sense get them. For a Home Security Container, I agree Sturdy is a top choice.

[Snyper708]

Originally Posted by 6.8SPC

A circular saw or a worm-drive saw, with an abrasive "Cut-off" blade and you go in on the side if it is bolted down. If not bolted down, just lay it on its front, and go in the back. Takes about three to six minutes.

I can tell you've never done it.

[Just Jeff]

It’s good to know the limitations of your equipment, but don’t let perfect be the enemy of good enough. Sometimes threads like this turn into “it only covers 98% of the times I’ll need it, so I’ll look for something better.” And something better is 4x the price so it never happens.

A $1000 gun safe (or PSC) will keep your stuff safe from kids, most thieves, and offer some protection from fires that aren’t fully involved.

If a thief is in a situation to spend ten minutes with power tools or a 48” pry bar, sure...it’s not impregnable. But what percentage of home invasions does that describe?

Don’t let perfect be the enemy of good enough.

[Jack Swilling]

I ordered a Zanotti Armor "gun safe"
Not really a safe by ANSI standards, but it is modular and can be disassembled and moved.
I don't have to involve anyone in moving it.
I agree with the notion stated above, don't let perfect stop you.
Construction site "Job Boxes" are less expensive and effective alternatives or overflow options.
You can get serious safes used for a fraction of the cost of a new AmSec or Brown, but the weight of a real safe means you need a crew to get it in place. Crew means potential OPSEC compromise.

[TomArnold]

Originally Posted by Jack Swilling

You can get serious safes used for a fraction of the cost of a new AmSec or Brown, but the weight of a real safe means you need a crew to get it in place. Crew means potential OPSEC compromise.

It doesn't necessarily have to be a comprise of security. We got a couple of family members that are already in the know. The company delivered it to a parking lot since the truck couldn't navigate the driveway. They used a forklift to put it on our truck on its back. At the house all we had to do was tip it off the truck onto some pipes to use as rollers to move it. Roll it into position, push it off the pipes, drill holes and bolt it down and Bob's your uncle

PS if you are going to drill the holes yourself make sure you have the right tools. A hammer drill and a vacuum to clear the dust as you go. It will take a while to get the holes deep enough. The whole process is doable with three people.

Edit: our safe was over 1,000 pounds but again 3 people can do it if patient. Be patient and careful - you REALLY don't want to get fingers or toes under the thing

[Neut Anderson]

Originally Posted by IamZeke

Have a floor safe installed in your concrete slab. Cut a piece of drywall to fit into the inset to cover the top. Throw an area rug and a coffee table over it.

Yep, floor safes (buried in concrete with recessed no-pry doors) are the only safes I never saw broken into as a cop. Problem is they are relatively small and won't hold much more than gold, papers, and a couple of pistols.