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Old 07-17-2019, 09:08 AM
Potawami II Potawami II is online now
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Originally Posted by Preacherboy View Post
I've always heard that preppers from "up north" will require proof of ownership of land to get past the 45th parallel. Like seriously they will have a roadblock or defensive line there.

So you have that and the bridge. Bridge is a dealbreaker for me
It would be very hard to block the 45th. I do know that some old preppers I used to work with had talked of going down to Sagnasty and blocking I-75 at the Zilwalkie bridge back during the Y2k scare.

You'll never make it over Big Mack. I live a lot closer than you and haven't bought property up there for that reason. That bridge could be held by 6 Yoopers with a keg of beer and their deer rifles if they threw a few dozers across it. Personally I wouldn't put it past them to just blow it from their end, or blame them.

I don't think proof of ownership of land would work unless you also had people from your BOL area that would vouch for you. The main reason I haven't bought up there (as a maybe BOL, but mostly just vacation with preps just in case). I think you would need proof of residency.

Just thoughts. My family is from up there a couple generations back, and I still have some in the Munising area and vacation up there every couple years, but as nice as it would be as a BOL there are just too many problems with it. Once the kids are out of school my wife and I will move up there.
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Old 07-17-2019, 10:04 AM
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I've always heard that preppers from "up north" will require proof of ownership of land to get past the 45th parallel. Like seriously they will have a roadblock or defensive line there.

So you have that and the bridge. Bridge is a dealbreaker for me
ACTUALLY..
I have sat in on conversations where folks were"speculating" about keeping the flatlanders at bay by blowing the bridges around Standish and across the M-61 line that give access to the north country. This was many many years ago, back when the cities were burning with civil unrest. Folks were concerned about raiders coming north to try to start a war.

There are lots of places to drop in a boat by the Straits and a prepositioned beater vehicle on the other side could get you to your base.

BUT

I could see the folks from Minn/St. Paul flooding that a way also.

IF it was a short term thing to get out of the line of fire and wait out until normalcy returns several months later, What I would consider, if in that area would be to have a boat with some legs and get into Lake of the Woods area with all the islands and hundreds of miles of navigable waterways. Could really get lost in that place, and if you can navigate you can get up to Kenora which would be fairly safe from weirdness.
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Old 07-17-2019, 11:00 AM
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Seems to me that the idea is to be aware of "Bad times a'coming!" early enough to be able to beat the rush.

Granted that an unexpected EMP wouldn't make my "early bug-out" possible, necessarily, but if one's concerns have to do with economics or some societal break-down, I do believe in leaving early.
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Old 07-18-2019, 01:52 PM
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Guys, the upper peninsula isn't an Island, while it would limit traffic coming from that direction, it is connected to canada and to the west... the bridge isn't the only access point.

Seems like people are going off on delusional prepositions about the idea that the only way to access UP is via that bridge. Its not get over it.

On the contrary the manitoulin island in Ontario is only accesbile by one old bridge or ferry.
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Old 07-18-2019, 03:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Bwietzke1 View Post
So I live in the great state of Michigan and have been contemplating buying land in the Upper Penninsula. It has vast amounts of protected wilderness and 75% of it has 10< per sq mile of population density.

... ... ...

My main concern is the Mackinac Bridge. It is the only non-water route from the lower peninsula to the upper Penninsula. I would hate to spend the time and resources only to find that in a SHTF situation my only route to my bug out location is closed.

Does anyone else have a situation similar to this? Any thoughts?

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Originally Posted by WilliamAshley View Post
Guys, the upper peninsula isn't an Island, while it would limit traffic coming from that direction, it is connected to canada and to the west... the bridge isn't the only access point.

Seems like people are going off on delusional prepositions about the idea that the only way to access UP is via that bridge. Its not get over it.

On the contrary the manitoulin island in Ontario is only accesbile by one old bridge or ferry.
WilliamAshley, the OP, despite being over 7 years old, is not debating whether or not the UP is an island. It is about the practicality of locating one's BOL in the UP if you live below the bridge- a very valid query.

As to delusions - the fact that you imply ease of access to the UP when SHTF via a crossing of the international border at the Soo is pretty far-fetched (and you might want to brush up on your geography because the UP is “connected to canada” via you guessed it – a bridge!)

Maybe you should “get over” yourself and realize Manitoulin Island has nothing to do with the OP and your snarky reply didn't address the original issue, which despite its age, remains a logical concern.
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Old 07-18-2019, 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Survivor_in_PAW View Post
WilliamAshley, the OP, despite being over 7 years old, is not debating whether or not the UP is an island. It is about the practicality of locating one's BOL in the UP if you live below the bridge- a very valid query.

As to delusions - the fact that you imply ease of access to the UP when SHTF via a crossing of the international border at the Soo is pretty far-fetched (and you might want to brush up on your geography because the UP is “connected to canada” via you guessed it – a bridge!)

Maybe you should “get over” yourself and realize Manitoulin Island has nothing to do with the OP and your snarky reply didn't address the original issue, which despite its age, remains a logical concern.
That's a bit like asking anyone if having a bug out location on the other side of the bridge is doable.

Nah, it definitely has to do with the premise of the Makinaw bridge being the only point to access the UP when it isn't.

Bridge failures ain't common neither are bridge blockades.

Again while prudence would be needed in having a contingency plan, the idea of having an entire section of a state inaccessible due to a bridge blockade is a little nonsensical. Especially when the area is connected via two three other highways.

Of course it is doable. However, you are going to need to plan accordingly and be prepared to take an alternate route.

There are multiple seasonal ferry routes including the Luddington ferry.

Maybe you should stick to the topic instead of getting all trolly and doing personal attacks.

The narrative being crafted is not to go to the UP due to the non-reliability of the Makinaw bridge, when in fact there are multiple other access points there. This creates a need to consider the time it takes to get to a BOL, when in fact during a crisis requiring evacuation most roads will be clogged anyway.
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Old 07-18-2019, 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Preacherboy View Post
I've always heard that preppers from "up north" will require proof of ownership of land to get past the 45th parallel. Like seriously they will have a roadblock or defensive line there.

So you have that and the bridge. Bridge is a dealbreaker for me
I live near a wilderness area people like to go hunting and fishing in, and other wilderness recreational pursuits . And we put up with them and steward the wildlife that we live with every day, and we deal with their litter, and vehicle traffic and other things like wildfires caused by discarded cigarettes thrown from the road or campfires haphazzardly left. Almost every weekend there is emergency services of one sort or another heading to rescue someone. And we have our rural area targeted by teams of thieves , and we pretty much have little police protection so we have to deal with tresspass and worse . But SHTF, bugging in to our domain would be a no go , we are very territorial . One very wealthy landowner here has his own tank sitting positioned to take out one bridge . So just saying I read these bug out ideas and just think about organizing stronger defensives against them . You might want to invest in the area you think you might want to bug out to .
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Old 07-18-2019, 04:39 PM
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Originally Posted by WilliamAshley View Post
That's a bit like asking anyone if having a bug out location on the other side of the bridge is doable.

Nah, it definitely has to do with the premise of the Makinaw bridge being the only point to access the UP when it isn't.

Bridge failures ain't common neither are bridge blockades.

Again while prudence would be needed in having a contingency plan, the idea of having an entire section of a state inaccessible due to a bridge blockade is a little nonsensical. Especially when the area is connected via two three other highways.

Of course it is doable. However, you are going to need to plan accordingly and be prepared to take an alternate route.

There are multiple seasonal ferry routes including the Luddington ferry.

Maybe you should stick to the topic instead of getting all trolly and doing personal attacks.

The narrative being crafted is not to go to the UP due to the non-reliability of the Makinaw bridge, when in fact there are multiple other access points there. This creates a need to consider the time it takes to get to a BOL, when in fact during a crisis requiring evacuation most roads will be clogged anyway.
TRUE..
BUT,
You get there and there is a bridge issue, then the go around is around 700 miles through Chicago and Wisc to get to the UP.
It is longer if you go back through Port Huron and Canada.

AND
If it is a bad time, who is gonna have the gas accessible or needed for the Detour.. not be be confused with Detour, Michigan, on the north side of the Straits.
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Old 07-18-2019, 10:47 PM
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TRUE..
BUT,
You get there and there is a bridge issue, then the go around is around 700 miles through Chicago and Wisc to get to the UP.
It is longer if you go back through Port Huron and Canada.

AND
If it is a bad time, who is gonna have the gas accessible or needed for the Detour.. not be be confused with Detour, Michigan, on the north side of the Straits.
It is all situational.

Most preppers would be out before the general population. Again contingency planning would involve having a plan in place for gas if possible. Even an alternate detouring south of Chicago or again, there are two seasonal car ferries.

If it is a short trip, perhaps it ain't that inaccessible.

https://www.michigan.org/ferry-services

Again bugging out south in Winter is a much better option unless it is a fallout issue. In the summer again, the roads aren't the only way to travel, there are also airports.

Think outside the box

https://www.orbitz.com/lp/flights/17...t-to-marquette

This is just off the cuff a well thought out bug out plan will have tons of contingency methods to travel.

Again, lots of potential scenarios so won't speak to any one situation but to think you depend on the mackinaw bridge to get to upper Michigan is just nonsensical.

However, inaccessibility in a bol isn't a bad thing the harder it is to get there the better a location it probably is.
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Old 07-19-2019, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Hilltopper View Post
I live near a wilderness area people like to go hunting and fishing in, and other wilderness recreational pursuits . And we put up with them and steward the wildlife that we live with every day, and we deal with their litter, and vehicle traffic and other things like wildfires caused by discarded cigarettes thrown from the road or campfires haphazzardly left. Almost every weekend there is emergency services of one sort or another heading to rescue someone. And we have our rural area targeted by teams of thieves , and we pretty much have little police protection so we have to deal with tresspass and worse . But SHTF, bugging in to our domain would be a no go , we are very territorial . One very wealthy landowner here has his own tank sitting positioned to take out one bridge . So just saying I read these bug out ideas and just think about organizing stronger defensives against them . You might want to invest in the area you think you might want to bug out to .
Why are you telling me this? I agree with you! I have alternate bol's, but all in my area. I've been recruited by people from "up north"...I just think their plans are stupid.
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Old 07-19-2019, 05:18 AM
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Having been born and raised in Michigan and lived there for 45 years, I reckon I have a say so.

Back when I started prepping (around 1980) I never even considered the prospect of moving to the UP. As some have said, the bridge is a deal breaker. And you simply do not know how things will go down; sudden and catastrophic or slow and easy boil. Your only hope is the slow and easy boil...and if you were me, I simply can't take the chance that's what will happen.

Draw a line from Arenac to Mason county. Everything above that line should be alright. My plans were to get from Flint to Montmorency Co. or somewhere in or near the Huron National Forest.

Seriously folks, might as well go south. Anything above the Line mentioned above is snowed in from August to July. Mostly arid frozen tundra with lots of highly venomous Mississauga Snow Snakes. During the annual thaw, around July 4, Zika, Encephalitis, & Lyme disease skeeters are pretty bad,too. I hear Tennessee and Texas are a nice BOL locations and they have a lot of free stuff for preppers.

Last edited by McMacy; 07-19-2019 at 05:20 AM.. Reason: Florida is good,too.
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Old 07-19-2019, 07:51 AM
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So I live in the great state of Michigan and have been contemplating buying land in the Upper Penninsula.
My main concern is the Mackinac Bridge.
I have two cabins in a very remote area of the eastern UP near Paradise and Grand Marais. I have 60 acres of woods surrounded by 1000s of acres of National forest. The Mac Bridge is always a concern. Never know when they are going to close it due to wind, ice falling, etc. Not a huge concern but it does happen. I got stopped from crossing last Fall and I was driving a pickup truck with a cap on the back. Vans, cars, and pickups with open-beds were being let across. Me? I had to wait until the next day.

I get across the Mac 99% of the time. I also have land on an island in the UP and that has its own ferry. Sugar Island. That is more a worry then crossing the Mac. Last week the Ferry stopped running after a new freighter pilot got stuck and messed up traffic between Canada and Michigan for a few days.

If you want remote - the UP is a great place. I love it. I guess if my life depended on getting across from the lower to the upper - I would have some sort of back up plan. Snowmobile in the winter. Maybe a boat in the summer? My life so far does not depend on a 100% success rate on crossing the Mac so I have little concern. I will note though that I already live at the tip of the lower peninsula so only have 100 miles between my main place and my place in the UP. If I lived down in central or southern MI - I'd feel different.

I find dealing with the bugs more of a problem then dealing with the Mac Bridge or Sugar Island ferry.
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by McMacy View Post
Anything above the Line mentioned above is snowed in from August to July. Mostly arid frozen tundra with lots of highly venomous Mississauga Snow Snakes. During the annual thaw, around July 4, Zika, Encephalitis, & Lyme disease skeeters are pretty bad,too.
Massasauga rattle snakes are pretty much unheard of in the UP and pretty rate in the lower peninsula. I'd love to see one but have not yet in the past 25 years of stomping around many rural areas in Michigan (both peninsulas).

My place in the eastern UP near Trout Lake and Paradise is known for great snowmobiling and snow depth. That said, the snow is gone (more or less) by early May and first snows that stick don't often come until October or November. I was outside in a tee-shirt building a cabin late last October for many days until it finally turned cold. That was in Chippewa County.

Lots of mosquitos. In fact, this is the worst year I have experienced in 25 years but the UP is still extremely wet. Water in the swamps and the Great Lakes is extremely high. Lots of ticks this Spring but mostly gone now. But diseases from them? Maybe a rare person now and then. Everybody in my family has been bitten thousands of times and nobody got sick yet. This Spring, we were picking ticks off every day. Not just in the Upper either. Even more ticks at our place at the "Tip of the Mitt" on the lower. If I worried about bugs - likely the worry would get me sicker then the bugs themselves. I find the giant Horse flies to be more of an issue. The sound and look like tiny humming birds almost and really hurt when they bite.

I just came back from a week in the woods in Chippewa County. Still have to wear a mosquito net on my head. Bumper crop this year and still lots of water to breed in. I will post back when I die of some rare disease from one of them. Or when I die of old age.
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:14 AM
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It is all situational.

Most preppers would be out before the general population. Again contingency planning would involve having a plan in place for gas if possible. Even an alternate detouring south of Chicago or again, there are two seasonal car ferries.

If it is a short trip, perhaps it ain't that inaccessible.

https://www.michigan.org/ferry-services

Again bugging out south in Winter is a much better option unless it is a fallout issue. In the summer again, the roads aren't the only way to travel, there are also airports.

Think outside the box

https://www.orbitz.com/lp/flights/17...t-to-marquette

This is just off the cuff a well thought out bug out plan will have tons of contingency methods to travel.

Again, lots of potential scenarios so won't speak to any one situation but to think you depend on the mackinaw bridge to get to upper Michigan is just nonsensical.

However, inaccessibility in a bol isn't a bad thing the harder it is to get there the better a location it probably is.
YOUR "situations" you are considering are far less harsh than MY situations I am considering.

Yeah, if the ferry services are running and gas is available... then that is pretty normal and doesn't seem like any real reason to go anywhere except on vacation.

In a really bad time I figure the folks who run the Badger will be headed out to the middle of Lake Michigan and wait out to see what is developing.

The other thing about the Badger. It is the last coal fired commercial watercraft running the Great Lakes, it has a special permit to do so, which means it can also work off of wood but not at the same efficiency.
It would be a great vessel for the bad times.
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:16 AM
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Seriously folks, might as well go south. Anything above the Line mentioned above is snowed in from August to July. Mostly arid frozen tundra with lots of highly venomous Mississauga Snow Snakes. During the annual thaw, around July 4, Zika, Encephalitis, & Lyme disease skeeters are pretty bad,too. I hear Tennessee and Texas are a nice BOL locations and they have a lot of free stuff for preppers.
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:26 AM
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I have two cabins in a very remote area of the eastern UP near Paradise and Grand Marais. I have 60 acres of woods surrounded by 1000s of acres of National forest. .
ARE THEY still seeing that non-existent big cat that according to Mich DNR does not exist but there is a hefty fine and jail if you kill one?

About 10 years ago a buddy and I were on the road to GM from Seeny and that non-existent critter almost got motorcycle hit by my buddy on his Beemer. I was about 30yds behind and suffered from the same illusion/mirage/phantom vision.

I got the the Motel there on the Lake and asked the lady about the thing we thought we saw but doesn't officially exist and she just smiled and said "Oh, you saw our cat."

Gm is beautiful
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:29 AM
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Originally Posted by McMacy View Post
Seriously folks, might as well go south. Anything above the Line mentioned above is snowed in from August to July. Mostly arid frozen tundra with lots of highly venomous Mississauga Snow Snakes. During the annual thaw, around July 4, Zika, Encephalitis, & Lyme disease skeeters are pretty bad,too. I hear Tennessee and Texas are a nice BOL locations and they have a lot of free stuff for preppers.
Oh no you don’t, please quit trying to send people to their deaths in Tennessee. Between the rattlesnakes, water moccasins, copper heads, black widows, brown recluse spiders, Wild hogzillas, and roving deliverance gangs you’d be lucky to last longer than a few days.

Do yourself a favor and stay away.
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Old 07-19-2019, 09:30 AM
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I have two cabins in a very remote area of the eastern UP near Paradise and Grand Marais. I have 60 acres of woods surrounded by 1000s of acres of National forest. The Mac Bridge is always a concern. Never know when they are going to close it due to wind, ice falling, etc. Not a huge concern but it does happen. I got stopped from crossing last Fall and I was driving a pickup truck with a cap on the back. Vans, cars, and pickups with open-beds were being let across. Me? I had to wait until the next day.

I get across the Mac 99% of the time. I also have land on an island in the UP and that has its own ferry. Sugar Island. That is more a worry then crossing the Mac. Last week the Ferry stopped running after a new freighter pilot got stuck and messed up traffic between Canada and Michigan for a few days.

If you want remote - the UP is a great place. I love it. I guess if my life depended on getting across from the lower to the upper - I would have some sort of back up plan. Snowmobile in the winter. Maybe a boat in the summer? My life so far does not depend on a 100% success rate on crossing the Mac so I have little concern. I will note though that I already live at the tip of the lower peninsula so only have 100 miles between my main place and my place in the UP. If I lived down in central or southern MI - I'd feel different.

I find dealing with the bugs more of a problem then dealing with the Mac Bridge or Sugar Island ferry.
If I were you I would invest in a fan boat. It could make the trip during the summer (waves depending) and could also do it over the ice and not have to worry about hitting open water or thin ice. Could even run it down snow covered roads during winter I would bet.
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Old 07-19-2019, 09:19 PM
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If I were you I would invest in a fan boat. It could make the trip during the summer (waves depending) and could also do it over the ice and not have to worry about hitting open water or thin ice. Could even run it down snow covered roads during winter I would bet.
OVER the years I have seen a fair number of airboats in Michigan along the Great Lakes You have to understand, since the Great Lakes are iced over about 11 months of the year you need something that works as well on ice as open water.

Michigan has some fanatical ice fishermen and they will regularly get caught on break away floes in Spring and find they are on the way to Canada without the proper paperwork to get back into the US. The CG is kept a little busy hauling them off the ice. You are always hearing about them on the news. It is why a lot of them run ARGOs for their ATV so when the ice breaks they can swim the vehicle back to shore.

I have an ARGO 8 wheel and while it does OK on rivers and small lakes I don't know that I would want to try the Straits anytime with one.
BUT
they will swim with a 750lb load and run down the road about 25mph carrying 1000lb and with tracks they will go places you cannot even walk.
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Old 07-20-2019, 12:23 AM
William Ashley William Ashley is offline
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YOUR "situations" you are considering are far less harsh than MY situations I am considering.

Probably not. After a few years of looking at scenarios there isn't a vast new land of SHTF, mate. (also just saying join date up there is 2016 but longer history than that here or learning about prepping)


Just realistically if roads are running at all, most other transit will be too.





Quote:
Yeah, if the ferry services are running and gas is available... then that is pretty normal and doesn't seem like any real reason to go anywhere except on vacation.
We call it a bug out. Now bearing some situations arn't a few weeks but in that scenario its just your new place to live rather than a cottage.



Our situations arn't likely much different, however, how we opt to deal with those situations likely are.







Quote:
In a really bad time I figure the folks who run the Badger will be headed out to the middle of Lake Michigan and wait out to see what is developing.

The other thing about the Badger. It is the last coal fired commercial watercraft running the Great Lakes, it has a special permit to do so, which means it can also work off of wood but not at the same efficiency.
It would be a great vessel for the bad times.

First I heard of that. However it is probably also a seasonal watercraft bearing winter.
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