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Old 07-19-2019, 12:56 AM
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Default Why Don't Eastern Catholics Celebrate the Immaculate Conception



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I don’t know about you, but when I was growing up, the “one”-ness of the Catholic Church was often explained as such:

“The Church is one because every Catholic Church all over the world believes the exact same things. If you go to another Catholic church, anywhere in the world, it will have the same readings, the same liturgical prayers, and the same beliefs as every other Catholic church.”

Anybody who’s ever been to an Eastern rite liturgy knows how this definition of “one” becomes shattered at the first “Lord, have Mercy.” And if you’re lucky enough to attend Divine Liturgy today, on the Feast of the Maternity of Anna (her conception of Mary), everything you thought about what makes a Catholic Catholic and what we’re allowed and not allowed to believe might just go up in flames because you probably won’t hear anything about an “Immaculate Conception” or Mary being conceived without the guilt of original sin.

One of the most common questions Eastern Catholics get from Roman Catholics is “Why don’t you celebrate the Immaculate Conception?”, presumably because they see a different name for the feast day on our calendar or heard the rumors. The answer to this is important, because it illustrates how incredibly diverse our church can be while remaining in union with one another...

THE REST OF THE ARTICLE MAY BE VIEWED HERE:
https://catholicmom.com/2014/12/08/w...te-conception/
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:19 AM
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It's a simple answer really if you look at this time line of church history.



The western Roman Catholic church is the only Christian body - aside from the all but extinct Anglican/Episcopal communion - that holds to the doctrine of the immaculate conception of Mary.

The papal bull formalizing this doctrine wasn't issued until 1854, making it a relatively late heresy in Christendom.

Even great western Roman Catholic luminaries such as St. Bonaventure and St. Thomas Aquinas rejected the doctrine, saying "... if the Virgin Mary had been sanctified before her conception, she would not have needed the redemption of Christ concluding that "Blessed Virgin was sanctified after animation."

These sorts of things are one of the reasons why when I went looking for the historic church of the apostles, Roman Catholicism wasn't an option and I ended up Orthodox.
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:19 AM
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The Uniate Church, aka "Eastern Rite Catholics," is an artificially created entity that was used to confuse Orthodox Christians, especially in Western Ukraine when the Pope sent in the Poles to convert Russia by the sword.

The truth of the matter is that it is a bastardized Church that is considered heterodox by Orthodoxy and tacitly scorned by the RCC itself.

They came up with the Uniate Church, because they couldn't convert the Ukrainians like this:



G-D BLESS THE DEFENDERS OF THE HOLY ORTHODOX CHURCH - THE ZAPOROZHTSY COSSACKS!
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Old 07-19-2019, 08:59 AM
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Observing is not worshiping. There are many events throughout Judaeo/Christian history worth observing as part of a worship service. God is the only being to be worshiped. That can be in the form of God the Father and creator of all that is, was and ever will be; God the Son who forgives all mankind for their sins that believes in Him; and God the Holy Spirit which dwells within each if we will only listen.
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Old 07-23-2019, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyzer Soze View Post
... everything you thought about what makes a Catholic Catholic and what we’re allowed and not allowed to believe might just go up in flames because you probably won’t hear anything about an “Immaculate Conception” or Mary being conceived without the guilt of original sin ...
Are you sure?
https://www.icshrine.org
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Old 07-23-2019, 12:06 PM
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... The papal bull formalizing this doctrine wasn't issued until 1854...
Your opinion notwithstanding, I'll go with the infallible Papal determination regarding this doctrine:
Hail, full of grace ... (Luke 1:28)
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Old 07-23-2019, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Watchingtheweasels View Post
... Even great western Roman Catholic luminaries such as St. Bonaventure and St. Thomas Aquinas rejected the doctrine, saying "... if the Virgin Mary had been sanctified before her conception, she would not have needed the redemption of Christ concluding that "Blessed Virgin was sanctified after animation." ....
So? Show where the magisterial authority of the Catholic Church concurred with them.
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Old 07-24-2019, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trogshak View Post
The Original Posting in this thread is an excerpt from the article linked below the quote. It is from a Roman Catholic source.

https://catholicmom.com/2014/12/08/w...te-conception/

Have you ever been to Sunday services at an Eastern Catholic parish?
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Old 07-24-2019, 09:43 PM
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Is this your parish?


Quote:
The Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church previously embarked on a campaign of de-Latinization reforms. These include the removal of the stations of the cross, the rosary, and the monstrance from their liturgy and parishes. In 2001 a priest, Vasyl Kovpak, and a small group of followers opposed to certain policies (such as de-Latinization) and ecumenism of the UGCC hierarchy, organized themselves as the Priestly Society of Saint Josaphat (SSJK). The SSJK possesses close ties with the Latin Rite Traditionalist Catholic Society of Saint Pius X, which rejects and condemns certain actions and policies of both Husar and the Pope. On 21 November 2007 the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith excommunicated Kovpak.[28]

Critics claim that the SSJK's liturgical practice favours severely abbreviated services and imported Roman Catholic devotions over the traditional and authentic practices of the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church. Proponents counter that these symbols and rituals, influenced long ago by their Polish Roman Catholic neighbors, have been practiced by Ukrainian Greek Catholics for centuries. To deny them today is to deprive the people of a part of sacred heritage which they have learned to regard as their own.

In 2008, a group of Basilian priests from Slovakia after relocated to the Pidhirtsi monastery declared that four of them had been consecrated bishops without permission of the Pope or the Major Archbishop. The "Pidhirtsi fathers" had opposed de-latinization, liberal theology, and the ecumenical approach of the hierarchy. Excommunicated in 2008, in 2009 they constituted themselves as the Ukrainian Orthodox Greek Catholic Church calling the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church "heretical".

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Old 07-24-2019, 10:42 PM
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It would seem that the Ukrainian Catholic Church not only does not recognize the "Immaculate Conception," but also does NOT include the filioque in the Nicene Creed.

https://ucymb.wordpress.com/the-nice...politan-creed/

I Believe in one God, the Father Almighty, maker of heaven and earth, of all things seen and unseen. I believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ, the only Son of God, eternally begotten of the Father. Light from Light, true God from true God, begotten, not made, one in being with the Father, through Him all things were made. For us men and for our salvation He came down from heaven; by the power of the Holy Spirit, He was born of the Virgin Mary, and became man. For our sake, he was crucified under Pontius Pilate; He suffered, died, and was buried. On the third day He rose again in fulfillment of the Scriptures; He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father. He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead, and His Kingdom will have no end. I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Giver of Life, Who proceeds from the Father. With the Father and the Son He is worshipped and glorified. He has spoken through the prophets. I believe in one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church. I acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins. I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come. Amen.

Bірую в єдиного Бога Отця,
Вседержителя, Творця неба і землі, і
всього видимого і невидимого.

Iв єдиного Господа Ісуса Христа, Сина
Божого, єдинородного, від Отця
народженого перед усіма віками. Світло від
світла, Бога істинного від Бога істинного,
родженого, несотвореного, єдиносущного з
Отцем, що через Нього все сталося. Він задля
нас людей і нашого ради спасіння зійшов із
небес, і воплотився з Духа Святого і Марії
Діви, і став чоловіком. І був розп’ятий за нас
за Понтія Пилата, і страждав, і був
похований. І воскрес у третій день, згідно з
Писанням. І вознісся на небо, і сидить
праворуч Отця. І вдруге прийде зі славою
судити живих і мертвих, а Його царству не
буде кінця.

Iв Духа Святого, Господа животворного,
що від Отця ісходить, що з Отцем і Сином
рівнопоклоняємий і рівнославимий, що
говорив через пророків.

Bєдину, святу, соборну й апостольську
Церкву.

Iсповідую одне хрещення на відпущення
гріхів.

Oчікую воскресіння мертвих і життя
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Old 07-24-2019, 11:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Batko10 View Post
It would seem that the Ukrainian Catholic Church not only does not recognize the "Immaculate Conception," but also does NOT include the filioque in the Nicene Creed.
That's what I thought as well. Before I became an Orthodox catecheuman, I attended the Divine Liturgy and Othros at several Eastern Catholic parishes and monasteries. Never heard the filiouqe recited in the Creed. As a Latin Catholic, I was stunned that ANY church in communion with Rome would DARE to omit the filoque from the Nicene Creed. I even purchased a copy of the Publican's Prayer Book (Sophia Press, Boston, 2008) so I could prove that fact to both Roman Catholics and Orthodox alike.

Apparently "The Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church" is something entirely different.
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Old 07-25-2019, 12:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyzer Soze View Post
Have you ever been to Sunday services at an Eastern Catholic parish?
Yes, both Russian and Ruthenian Byzantine Catholic Divine Liturgies.
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Old 07-25-2019, 12:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyzer Soze View Post
Is this your parish?
It is not.
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Old 07-25-2019, 12:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trogshak View Post
Yes, both Russian and Ruthenian Byzantine Catholic Divine Liturgies.
Was the filioque added to the Creed?
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Old 07-25-2019, 12:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Batko10 View Post
It would seem that the Ukrainian Catholic Church ... does NOT include the filioque in the Nicene Creed ...
That was my experience as well in both the Russian and Ruthenian Divine Liturgies.
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Old 07-25-2019, 12:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keyzer Soze View Post
Was the filioque added to the Creed?
No, it was not.
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Old 07-25-2019, 08:01 AM
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I am patient. Orthodox are patient people. I am waiting until the heresies in the Catholic Church and Protestant congregations go so crazy and so insufferable by God loving people until they all come to the Orthodox Church, the original Church of Jesus Christ. Come to be saved. Don't wait any longer. God waits at the door to receive you in His peace.
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Old 07-27-2019, 07:18 PM
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I am patient. Orthodox are patient people. I am waiting until the heresies in the Catholic Church and Protestant congregations go so crazy and so insufferable by God loving people until they all come to the Orthodox Church, the original Church of Jesus Christ. Come to be saved. Don't wait any longer. God waits at the door to receive you in His peace.
I will not join you. If the gates of Hell prevail against the Catholic Church, I will leave Christianity altogether.
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Old 07-28-2019, 12:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Trogshak View Post
I will not join you. If the gates of Hell prevail against the Catholic Church, I will leave Christianity altogether.
A case could made that the Papacy departed from Christianity in 11th century. The Papacy condemns reformers for departing from Rome in the 16th century. Today what I'm saying to you is this: When you're facing a loaded gun, what's the difference?

All one needs to do is repent of his errors and return to the one holy catholic and apostolic church. It's been here all along and stands ready to welcome you back.
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Old 07-28-2019, 06:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Trogshak View Post
I will not join you. If the gates of Hell prevail against the Catholic Church, I will leave Christianity altogether.
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