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Old 09-17-2019, 03:16 AM
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Originally Posted by ralfy View Post
The U.S. has been allied to Saudi Arabia since 1974, and that involves military support in exchange for the petrodollar. That started with Nixon.

The U.S. also funded Islamic fundamentalists to counter the Soviets, with Saudi Arabia and Pakistan providing support. That also involved Reagan.

Thus, it's not just liberal "cults" but also conservatives that have been allied to Islamic ones.
The United States and Saudi Arabia have been allied since 1931, with Standard Oil exploring the region shortly after. So much so and despite maintaining its neutrality in WWII, Saudi Arabia allowed allied powers to both stage troops and utilize its air space.

Furthermore, ARAMCO was founded in 1950, with a mutual defense agreement signed in 1951, to include the trade of military arms and petroleum, as a means to combat communism.
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Old 09-17-2019, 06:39 AM
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Don't know.
.
It is the Sira that gives the Quran context and chronology. One cannot understand the Quran without the Sira. I admit it is one tough read. Once a Muslim figures out what Muhammad would do the Hadith tells him how to do it. Right down to how to ... and wipe.
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Old 09-17-2019, 07:27 AM
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Mormons are by definition, Christians.
Mormons call themselves Christians. Christianity is defined by the doctrines of Catholicism, Eastern Orthodoxy, and Protestantism. Mormon doctrine differences place it outside the umbrella of Christianity.

Catholicism, Eastern Orthodoxy, and Protestantism have their NT based on the OT. Where Mormonism uses Jesus Christ’s death on which new revelations of modern prophets are based.

Mormons are no more Christian than Jews are Christian. The fact that Jews and Christians share the majority of their common doctrine does not make either one with the other. Mormonism shares less of the Christian NT than Christians where Christians share [with few exceptions] Hebrew Bible with Jews.

Your secular misunderstanding is one I once shared. I was wrong then and you are still wrong.
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Old 09-17-2019, 11:54 AM
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I have to differ from your characterization of Oprahs Butt Cheek Face as a traitor. She was never an American, and she is stone cold loyal to Somalia.

She is a Cuckoos Egg; a false flag waver, but not a traitior.
She became a US Citizen on a false pretense. She swore an oath of fealty to do so. Classic definition of a traitor!!
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Old 09-17-2019, 12:00 PM
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We have freedom. We don't really need guns.
until you do, then it is too late.

chinese communist china
russians/ukranians etc in communist soviet union
jews in nazi germany
cambodia
rwanda
venezuela
hong kong
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Old 09-17-2019, 12:04 PM
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We have freedom. We don't really need guns.
If you don't have guns, you assuredly don't have freedom!!!
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Old 09-17-2019, 12:13 PM
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My understanding is that inside every hellfire missile launched from a drone during the Obama Administration was a little love letter.
That 'love letter' is now a small side of bacon!!!!
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Old 09-17-2019, 12:18 PM
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Originally Posted by PalmettoTree View Post
Mormons call themselves Christians. Christianity is defined by the doctrines of Catholicism, Eastern Orthodoxy, and Protestantism. Mormon doctrine differences place it outside the umbrella of Christianity.

Catholicism, Eastern Orthodoxy, and Protestantism have their NT based on the OT. Where Mormonism uses Jesus Christ’s death on which new revelations of modern prophets are based.

Mormons are no more Christian than Jews are Christian. The fact that Jews and Christians share the majority of their common doctrine does not make either one with the other. Mormonism shares less of the Christian NT than Christians where Christians share [with few exceptions] Hebrew Bible with Jews.

Your secular misunderstanding is one I once shared. I was wrong then and you are still wrong.
Differences of opinion. On this issue can anyone really "know". What sort of secular misunderstanding did you once share? And how can you know I am wrong? But Mormons do everything in the name of Christ, such as pray in his name over meals, dedication of graves, name of their church, doing baptism for the dead, anointing the sick and afflicted, and many other things. I have neighbors who are absolutely sure that they are Christians because they believe in the virgin birth, Jesus' miracles, the resurrection and the atonement and many would die before they denied Jesus.

During SHTF times, will you want to have them as your neighbor? Remember that many of them are dedicated preppers. Who determines whether a faith is Christian? You or God?
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Old 09-17-2019, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by PalmettoTree View Post
I get all my information from the Qur'an, Sira, and Hadith. I have read the Qur'an several times. I use the ”bilingual edition approved by Al-Azhur University the chief center of Islamic and Arabic learning in the world…”

The Sira of Mohammed:

The Sira of Mohammed is to Islam what the Gospels are to Christians. The following is an English translations of Sira scripture the first letter denotes the translation (I for Ishaq) and number is the margin number.

I426 According to Mohammed, “to resist the doctrine of Islam and persuade Muslims to drop their faith is worse than killing. …justice in Arabia was a killing for a killing, but now to resist Islam is worse then murder."

As I have said, I do not judge a religion by its followers. There are followers of every religion that are bad people and their acts are not in concert with their religion.

I compare Islamic scripture to Jewish and Christian Scripture.

I will be honest. I have had and worked with several good Muslim friends. It is difficult for me to believe they follow Islam as their religion.

Few have the time I once had to do the research I did. So if one wants to find the most honest least controversial reading on Islam, I recommend:
Unveiling Islam: An Insider's Look at Muslim Life and Beliefs
Book by Ergun Caner

He and his brother grew up Muslims and converted to Christianity. The do not deal in many of the violent Islamic scriptures I quote.


What do you know about Muhammad? If you want to understand Mormonism, you need to know about /smith and his life and teachings. If you want to find out about SDA's, you need to learn about Ellen G. White and the JW's about Charles Taze Russel. For Christianity, the closest to being the founder was probably Paul, although their could be others to learn about. The life of Muhammad and how close he was to Christian teachings should be understood before explaining Islam. A lot of our understanding of Muhammad is missing a lot of facts of his life just as we are missing so much of the life of Jesus.
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Old 09-17-2019, 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Idaho Survivalist View Post
Differences of opinion. On this issue can anyone really "know". What sort of secular misunderstanding did you once share? And how can you know I am wrong? But Mormons do everything in the name of Christ, such as pray in his name over meals, dedication of graves, name of their church, doing baptism for the dead, anointing the sick and afflicted, and many other things. I have neighbors who are absolutely sure that they are Christians because they believe in the virgin birth, Jesus' miracles, the resurrection and the atonement and many would die before they denied Jesus.

During SHTF times, will you want to have them as your neighbor? Remember that many of them are dedicated preppers. Who determines whether a faith is Christian? You or God?
Mormonism is to Christianity like Christianity is to Judaism.
Christianity is not Judaism.
Therefore Mormonism is not Christianity.

Surely I do not need to spell that out to you.
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Old 09-17-2019, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Idaho Survivalist View Post
What do you know about Muhammad? If you want to understand Mormonism, you need to know about /smith and his life and teachings. If you want to find out about SDA's, you need to learn about Ellen G. White and the JW's about Charles Taze Russel. For Christianity, the closest to being the founder was probably Paul, although their could be others to learn about. The life of Muhammad and how close he was to Christian teachings should be understood before explaining Islam. A lot of our understanding of Muhammad is missing a lot of facts of his life just as we are missing so much of the life of Jesus.
You are rationalizing to make things as you want them to be not as how they are.
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Old 09-17-2019, 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Idaho Survivalist View Post
What do you know about Muhammad? If you want to understand Mormonism, you need to know about /smith and his life and teachings. If you want to find out about SDA's, you need to learn about Ellen G. White and the JW's about Charles Taze Russel. For Christianity, the closest to being the founder was probably Paul, although their could be others to learn about. The life of Muhammad and how close he was to Christian teachings should be understood before explaining Islam. A lot of our understanding of Muhammad is missing a lot of facts of his life just as we are missing so much of the life of Jesus.
Why don't you tell us what you yourself know about Muhammad? Then, we'll properly judge whether you know anything about him in particular, and Islam in general.
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Old 09-17-2019, 06:26 PM
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Why don't you tell us what you yourself know about Muhammad? Then, we'll properly judge whether you know anything about him in particular, and Islam in general.
Exactly!!!
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Old 09-17-2019, 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by clocker View Post
Look at the Socialist Left in Europe. Not only are they stupidly tolerant of Islamist in their countries, for the last decade or so, they've been actively importing them, causing their incidence of sex crimes and terrorism to go thru the roof. In many EU countries, as I understand it, it is a crime (or, at minimum will get you economically sanctioned) to even speak critically of Islam & Muslims, let alone decry the Muslim invasion and criticize their governments (and those who run the EU) for bringing the Evil into their midst.

Ralfy, you can quote historically where some on the Right have allied with Islam, and may even find those today who'll do that even now. But for sheer numbers, Leftists here and elsewhere are NOW the ones who allying with the deathcult that is Islam. Not conservatives. Not the Right.
Not just speaking against Islam but even anti-Semitic views, which include speaking against Judaism and even claiming that the Holocaust is a hoax.

Islam is against homosexuality, modernism, and free speech, which means it will never be allied with the left. If any, Muslims will use the left to get what they want.

That invasion is taking place because of poverty in Africa. What caused that was colonialism followed by support for various dictators by military powers, including those in Europe, the U.S., the former Soviet Union, and now China.

Finally, we're not just talking about a few historical instances but a long history of the right working with Muslims. That includes the petrodollar that the right has been using for decades to buy all sorts of things in a consumer spending economy, which has included investments from gulf oil sheiks.
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Old 09-17-2019, 07:53 PM
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Originally Posted by PalmettoTree View Post
Mormons call themselves Christians. Christianity is defined by the doctrines of Catholicism, Eastern Orthodoxy, and Protestantism. Mormon doctrine differences place it outside the umbrella of Christianity.

Catholicism, Eastern Orthodoxy, and Protestantism have their NT based on the OT. Where Mormonism uses Jesus Christ’s death on which new revelations of modern prophets are based.

Mormons are no more Christian than Jews are Christian. The fact that Jews and Christians share the majority of their common doctrine does not make either one with the other. Mormonism shares less of the Christian NT than Christians where Christians share [with few exceptions] Hebrew Bible with Jews.

Your secular misunderstanding is one I once shared. I was wrong then and you are still wrong.
Christianity was defined within the Scriptures:

Quote:
“…So for a whole year Barnabas and Saul met with the church and taught great numbers of people. The disciples were called Christians first at Antioch” (Acts 11:26)

“Then Agrippa said to Paul, ‘Do you think that in such a short time you can persuade me to be a Christian?’” (Acts 26:28)

“However, if you suffer as a Christian, do not be ashamed, but praise God that you bear that name” (1 Peter 4:16)
They were termed “Christian” because their actions, speech, and behavior were like that of Jesus. The word "Christian" actually means, “a follower of Christ,” "anointed one," or “belonging to the party of Christ.” It doesn't even have the meaning 'of Christ' or 'related or pertaining to Christ'.

As there wasn't a Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, and Protestant church during the time of Jesus, it would appear that not even the Jesus' Disciples could have been considered Christian, based upon your definition.
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Old 09-17-2019, 08:11 PM
Idaho Survivalist Idaho Survivalist is offline
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Mormonism is to Christianity like Christianity is to Judaism.
Christianity is not Judaism.
Therefore Mormonism is not Christianity.

Surely I do not need to spell that out to you.

Mormonism is based on Christianity's book, the Bible and Mormon scripture, (The BoM). Christianity. Christianity is based on Judaism's book, The Hebrew scriptures, and Christian scripture (The NT.) Mormons are to Christianity as Christianity is to Judaism. Surely I don't need to spell that out to you. And the front of a Book of Mormon says : Another Witness for Christ.

I'm not a Mormon. I just know a lot more about Mormonism and their claims than you do. Their main difference from you is that they do not believe in the Trinity. And most Christians do because they believe that the Catholic leaders were inspired when they made their decision on the character of God at the Nicene Council. If the Catholic Church was inspired of God in those earlier issues, why don't Protestants re-join with the Catholics and then there would be one faith, one church, and one baptism? Maybe the Catholics, the world's largest Christian faith is, indeed, God's true Church, as they say.
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Old 09-17-2019, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Mr. Sockpuppet View Post
Christianity was defined within the Scriptures:

They were termed “Christian” because their actions, speech, and behavior were like that of Jesus. The word "Christian" actually means, “a follower of Christ,” "anointed one," or “belonging to the party of Christ.” It doesn't even have the meaning 'of Christ' or 'related or pertaining to Christ'.

As there wasn't a Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, and Protestant church during the time of Jesus, it would appear that not even the Jesus' Disciples could have been considered Christian, based upon your definition.
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Originally Posted by Idaho Survivalist View Post
Mormonism is based on Christianity's book, the Bible and Mormon scripture, (The BoM). Christianity. Christianity is based on Judaism's book, The Hebrew scriptures, and Christian scripture (The NT.) Mormons are to Christianity as Christianity is to Judaism. Surely I don't need to spell that out to you. And the front of a Book of Mormon says : Another Witness for Christ.

I'm not a Mormon. I just know a lot more about Mormonism and their claims than you do. Their main difference from you is that they do not believe in the Trinity. And most Christians do because they believe that the Catholic leaders were inspired when they made their decision on the character of God at the Nicene Council. If the Catholic Church was inspired of God in those earlier issues, why don't Protestants re-join with the Catholics and then there would be one faith, one church, and one baptism? Maybe the Catholics, the world's largest Christian faith is, indeed, God's true Church, as they say.

Mormonism vs. Christianity - The Differences
Mormonism (The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints) was birthed in 1820 by a vision in which two celestial personages appeared to Joseph Smith claiming all existing churches were wrong, all their creeds were an abomination, and all their professors were corrupt. According to these personages, Smith had been chosen to restore—not reform—a church that had disappeared from the face of the earth. The Mormon doctrines that evolved from this vision compromise confuse or contradict the nature of God, the authority of Scripture and the way of salvation.


Mormonism vs. Christianity - View of God
First, while Christians believe that God is spirit, Joseph Smith taught, “God Himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens!” Mormonism also holds to a plurality of Gods and contends that “as man is God once was; as God is man may become.” Additionally, the Latter-day Saints compromise the nature of the God-man, Jesus Christ. In Christianity, Jesus is the self-existent creator of all things. In Mormonism, he is the spirit brother of Lucifer who was conceived in heaven by a celestial Mother and came in flesh as the result of the Father having sex with the Virgin Mary.


Mormonism vs. Christianity - Revelation
Furthermore, in sharp distinction to orthodox Christian theology, Mormons do not believe that the Bible is the infallible repository for redemptive revelation. In their view, the Book of Mormon is “the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion.” Two further revelations complete the Mormon quad, namely Doctrines and Covenants and The Pearl of Great Price. Doctrines and Covenants is a compilation of divine revelations that includes the doctrine of polygamy. Not until threatened by the federal government did Mormon president Wilford Woodruff receive a revelation relegating polygamy to the afterlife. The Pearl of Great Price is no less troubling. It was this extra-biblical revelation that was used by Mormonism to prevent African Americans from entering the priesthood and from being exalted to godhood.


Mormonism vs. Christianity - Heaven
Finally, while Christians believe that they will stand before God dressed in the spotless robes of Christ’s righteousness, Mormons contend that they will appear before heavenly Father dressed in fig-leaf aprons holding good works in their hands. According to the Latter-day Saints, virtually everyone qualifies for heaven. Murderers, unrepentant whoremongers and the world’s vilest people make it into the Telestial heaven; lukewarm Mormons, religious people, and those who accept the Mormon gospel in the spirit world typically enter the Terrestrial heaven; and temple Mormons make it to the Celestial heaven. Only those who are sealed in secret temple rituals, however, will make it to the third level of the Celestial kingdom, become God’s of their own planets.

These and many other doctrinal perversions exclude Mormonism from rightly being called Christian.

Isaiah 43:10 says, "'You are my witnesses,' declares the LORD , 'and my servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor will there be one after me.'"

https://www.allaboutreligion.org/mor...ristianity.htm

Now clearly you are highjacking this discussion and I am helping you. So this is my last post on this thread regarding Mormonism.

I do not consider Mormonism a Christian theology. That said, they sure are not like Muslims. To say more would be to continue the highjacking of this thread. So if you want to discuss Mormonism then start a thread.
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Old 09-17-2019, 11:04 PM
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The only thing that stands between the world elites and their dream NWO is the Patriotic American citizen! THE only thing!
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Old 09-18-2019, 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted by PurpleKitty View Post
The "god" of islam (not capitalized either) is the "god" of barbarities too many to mention not to mention horrific abuses of women, gays, and unbelievers.

That is not the same God as the God of Paul, who wrote "Husbands, love your wives as Christ loved the Church". (Ephesians 5:25)

I read "Understanding islam" a very interesting book I loaned out and never got back. It states how the founder, as a child, was sent out into the desert to be raised by a Bedouin woman, but he had seizures. His birth mother kept sending him back into the desert (rejecting him). Later, he married many women but his favorite wife was his first, a woman old enough to be his mother.

Then he raped a little girl, married a family member's wife, took a slave "bride" who refused to marry him - she accepted his advances because she had no choice but refused to marry him - he often held her up to the other wives as an example of a spiritual woman. The man was seriously ****ed up and how anyone could take his babblings seriously is a source of amazement to me. The whole quoran makes no sense because it contradicts itself if you put it in chronological order.

But you can learn the most by how a believer treats other people, especially unbelievers.
That still happens in Idaho by the way.

They just squashed laws that would have changed it.

I mean while we are commenting on a society a few hundred years ago.

https://youtu.be/erRrF8YWGd4
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Old 09-18-2019, 08:04 AM
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I believe islam to be the single greatest man made threat to western civilization, if not humanity.
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