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Old 11-11-2019, 06:44 AM
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Default Lies, half lies, half truths



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LIES, HALF LIES, HALF TRUTHS
The AMERICAN Dilemma

LIE - A false statement deliberately presented as being true; a falsehood.

TRUTH - A true statement. Consistent with fact or reality; not false or erroneous.

HALF TRUTH - A statement only partially true, or which gives only a part of the truth.

HALF LIE - Something that a person says or writes that they know to be partly untrue.

One of the things Americans thought they excelled at was being told the truth by their governments, their leaders, and their institutions of education, especially when compared with the former Soviet Union and other communist nations.

And yet, Americans are victims of the world’s greatest propaganda ministry, believing half truths as if they were true, and embracing a lie as reality.

Is it not a fact that Americans fought wars to “make the world safe for democracy” as if that was America’s form of government? Others smugly retort, America is not a democracy, but a representative democracy, or an indirect democracy. Others chuckle and argue that no, America is a constitutional republic, not a democracy.
A string of half truths, half lies, and lies commonly believed by millions of Americans is definitely proof of our victimization.
"The world must be made safe for democracy. Its peace must be planted upon the tested foundations of political liberty."
- - - Woodrow Wilson, Address to Congress on War (1917)

"Let us never forget that government is ourselves and not an alien power over us. The ultimate rulers of our democracy are not a President and senators and congressmen and government officials, but the voters of this country."
- - - Franklin D. Roosevelt
http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/ke...democracy.html

When presidents blatantly lie to Americans, how can we ever know the truth?

In the 2019 mini-series about Chernobyl, a common theme was that lies consistently sabotaged efforts at dealing with the disaster. Powerful people desperately hid the truth to preserve their power and avoid blame.
“When the truth offends, we lie and lie until we can no longer remember it is even there. But it is still there.”
- - - quoted from Chernobyl (2019)
The irony is that it is still propaganda. We cannot be sure that it was actually spoken or merely dialog from a dramatic recreation of a terrible tragedy.

Think of the millions of Americans who were misled to never embrace their birthright of sovereignty, freedom and independence. What can be offensive about all men having Creator endowed rights that governments were instituted to secure?
Nothing, really.
Except to the predators, who deem themselves superior over their prey, and feed upon us, taking our liberty, our wealth, our property and our lives for their use and benefit.

You are living and believing a lie, repeatedly told to you, by those who claim to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. It is tearing apart the country. Every lie, half truth, and half lie adds to the anger and fury.

If Americans are guaranteed a republican form of government, in which all men have Creator endowed rights that governments were instituted to secure, and nothing more without consent of the governed, then we’ve been deliberately robbed of our birthright.

If American people are “sovereigns without subjects” and government is our servant, whereas the citizens are subjects of that servant government, then the voters are not the source of power, nor the rulers.

If sovereign American people have rights, liberties, powers, privileges and immunities that cannot be denied by any constitution, vote, nor democratic majority, then we have been poorly used and abused by all the institutions that aid and abet those in power over us, claiming that it was “the will of the people,” that we comply and cooperate with our oppressors, begging their permission and paying tribute to their magnanimous administration of our sorry state.

But all the truths are in the public records, and only the lies repeated outside of that record, by those who don’t bother to comply with the law or even read the laws they enact. Many do not even file a signed oath of office, so that we cannot hold them liable for breach of oath. In fact, we’re misled to get into endless arguments with partisans and factions that are wholly foreign to America’s republicanism. Perhaps they hope we will finally explode into violent rebellion and thus authorize the heavy boot upon the neck of the people, so as to finally have “law and order.”


= = = = = = =
PUBLIC RECORD REFERENCES:

Declaration of Independence says: "We hold these truths to be self-evident: That all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed."

(For those who scoff at the legality of the Declaration, please check your state constitution. All state constitutions repeat the "self evident truth" of the Declaration.)

" PERSONAL LIBERTY, or the Right to enjoyment of life and liberty, is one of the fundamental or natural Rights, which has been protected by its inclusion as a guarantee in the various constitutions, which is not derived from, or dependent on, the U.S. Constitution, which may not be submitted to a vote and may not depend on the outcome of an election. It is one of the most sacred and valuable Rights, as sacred as the Right to private property ... and is regarded as inalienable."
- - - 16 Corpus Juris Secundum , Constitutional Law, Sect.202, p.987.

(No democratic majority, election or government can infringe upon endowed rights.)


SOVEREIGNS WITHOUT SUBJECTS
“... at the Revolution, the sovereignty devolved on the people, and they are truly the sovereigns of the country, but they are sovereigns without subjects, and have none to govern but themselves. . .
“... In Europe, the sovereignty is generally ascribed to the Prince; here, it rests with the people; there, the sovereign actually administers the government; here, never in a single instance; our Governors are the agents of the [sovereign] people, and, at most, stand in the same relation to their sovereign in which regents in Europe stand to their sovereigns.”

- - - Justice John Jay, Chisholm v. Georgia, 2 U.S. 2 Dall. 419 419 (1793)
https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremec...CR_0002_0419_Z
- - -
{In the republican form of government, the people are sovereigns (unless they consent otherwise) served by (not ruled by) servant government (composed of subject citizens). Their rights and liberties existed before constitutional government (which is why the republican form is NOT a constitutional republic - nor can a constitutional government institute a republican form).}

It would appear that the servants (and their minions) have decided to cheat the master, and run off with his silver. Sad, isn't it?
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Old 11-11-2019, 07:00 AM
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Agreed....

It's bad when governments lie


What's even worse is when we depend on the media to have an air of responsibility to report the truth and the facts.

Instead, they are themselves spreading the propaganda for certain members of the government and/or the shadow government

They slant, twist, lie, deny and give us opinion when we desperately need better

They have an agenda and it's not the truth!
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Old 11-12-2019, 04:32 AM
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The HBO mini-series on Chernobyl illustrated the need for facts and truth over lies and propaganda.
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Old 11-12-2019, 07:33 AM
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Jet,

What kind of government do we have, or rather, does the US Constitution require that we have?
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Old 11-12-2019, 07:46 AM
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I believe it was intended for the constitution to BE the government.
The definition of government is the Governing body if a state or nation.
The definition of governing is “having the authority to conduct the policy, action and affairs of a state”.
The constitution is the ultimate authority in this country, and I think we’ve been led to believe the people in offices are the government, and they aren’t. They are the bureaucracy that has grown up around the government, but the constitution is our government.
I think the bureaucracy that has grown up around the constitution is there to find workarounds to the legitimate government. That’s why Obama was so dangerous, he was a constitutional scholar, and who better equipped to dismantle something than someone who is well versed in it’s design?
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Old 11-12-2019, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics View Post
The HBO mini-series on Chernobyl illustrated the need for facts and truth over lies and propaganda.


Is that where you learned about the need for truth?
HBO??
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Old 11-12-2019, 04:29 PM
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Originally Posted by cujet View Post
Jet,

What kind of government do we have, or rather, does the US Constitution require that we have?
Pursuant to the founding document of the USA, the Declaration of Independence, 1776, all men have Creator endowed rights that governments were instituted to secure . . . by adjudicating disputes, prosecuting criminals, and defending against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

Anything beyond that requires consent of the governed.


This is what is known as the "republican form" of government. It is not synonymous with a republic nor is it a constitutional republic, since it existed BEFORE any compact.

In that same document the Founders pledged their lives, their fortunes and their sacred honor to the task of securing rights of the people - and thus formed the government. All subsequent citizens are presumed to have made the same oath - thus surrendering their endowment and accepting mandatory civic duties.

A reference to the "republican form" is in Article IV of Confederation wherein the free inhabitants are to be accorded all privileges and immunities of the free citizens. In essence, those who do not consent to be governed, retain their endowments but can exercise all privileges and immunities as well that do not involve consent to be governed. (Ex: immunity from self incrimination)

In the USCON, Art.4, Sec. 4 guarantees a republican form to the States. Of course, this really refers to the people in the States, not their citizens.

Hierarchy :
  • People (sovereigns)
  • Government (servants to the sovereigns)
  • Citizens (subjects of their sovereign government)
  • Denizens, excepted classes, status criminals, etc.
Though most assume that citizens are superior to the elected officers in government, simple observation refutes that assumption. The original basis of that belief was founded in the fact that the sovereign people were superior to the servant government. But once the masses volunteered into citizenship, all endowments were surrendered. Anyone liable for militia duty - the obligation to train, fight, and die, on command - certainly no longer had any right to life nor liberty.

As to the original composition of the servant government, that varied from state to state. With respect to the Federal government, only the House of Representatives was to be elected by popular vote (democracy). The Senate was to be chosen by each respective State government. The president and vice president were to be chosen by the Electors of the Electoral College who originally had the duty to examine all candidates and then vote for two, excepting that at least one had to be from another state. The executive branch would be filled by appointees of the elected president.


Under the original recipe, the citizenry were limited to those who were property owners, tax payers, militiamen, and held to a higher standard of behavior than the masses (service is a privilege, not a right). In addition, most public offices requires filing a hefty performance bond. In short, being a citizen was a step DOWN in status - and expensive.


I think this was derived from the fact that folks who prosecuted the revolution - the 3% - had no intention of letting just anyone 'join up' after the victory. They only wanted civic minded folks, who had property and courage, to be prospective public servants, as judged by their fellow citizens / militiamen.


Of course, these strict requirements were eased in the 1820s, and it went downhill after that, as partisan political parties rose in power and wealth, via the influx of new subjects to rule and tax.
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Old 11-12-2019, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Corpus View Post
Is that where you learned about the need for truth?
HBO??
"ILLUSTRATE" is not synonymous with need.

ILLUSTRATE - To serve as an example or clarification of.

The example was that secrecy and deception practiced throughout the communist government contributed to the destruction of the reactor at Chernobyl, as party members ducked responsibility or failed to act in a timely manner or were grossly negligent.
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Old 11-12-2019, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Revmgt View Post
I believe it was intended for the constitution to BE the government.
The definition of government is the Governing body if a state or nation.
The definition of governing is “having the authority to conduct the policy, action and affairs of a state”.
The constitution is the ultimate authority in this country, and I think we’ve been led to believe the people in offices are the government, and they aren’t. They are the bureaucracy that has grown up around the government, but the constitution is our government.
I think the bureaucracy that has grown up around the constitution is there to find workarounds to the legitimate government. That’s why Obama was so dangerous, he was a constitutional scholar, and who better equipped to dismantle something than someone who is well versed in it’s design?
Your beliefs, heartfelt as they may be, are not in harmony with the law in the public record, nor with the authorities, citations, and legislation.

As previously posted:
" PERSONAL LIBERTY, or the Right to enjoyment of life and liberty, is one of the fundamental or natural Rights, which has been protected by its inclusion as a guarantee in the various constitutions, which is not derived from, or dependent on, the U.S. Constitution, which may not be submitted to a vote and may not depend on the outcome of an election. It is one of the most sacred and valuable Rights, as sacred as the Right to private property ... and is regarded as inalienable."
- - - 16 Corpus Juris Secundum , Constitutional Law, Sect.202, p.987.
(No democratic majority, election or government can infringe upon endowed rights.)


SOVEREIGNS WITHOUT SUBJECTS
“... at the Revolution, the sovereignty devolved on the people, and they are truly the sovereigns of the country, but they are sovereigns without subjects, and have none to govern but themselves. . .
“... In Europe, the sovereignty is generally ascribed to the Prince; here, it rests with the people; there, the sovereign actually administers the government; here, never in a single instance; our Governors are the agents of the [sovereign] people, and, at most, stand in the same relation to their sovereign in which regents in Europe stand to their sovereigns.”
- - - Justice John Jay, Chisholm v. Georgia, 2 U.S. 2 Dall. 419 419 (1793)
These two references show that American governments are not the rulers of the sovereign people, but their servants, their regents, their agents. They have no powers over endowed rights to life, to liberty, to absolute ownership of private property, inherent powers, privileges and immunities.

If these are not explicit enough to convince you, here's another:

CONSENT OF THE CITIZENRY
“ Our theory of government and governmental powers is wholly at variance with that urged by appellant herein. The rights of the individual are not derived from governmental agencies, either municipal, state or federal, or even from the Constitution. They exist inherently in every man, by endowment of the Creator, and are merely reaffirmed in the Constitution, and restricted only to the extent that they have been VOLUNTARILY SURRENDERED BY THE CITIZENSHIP to the agencies of government. The people's rights are not derived from the government, but the government's authority comes from the people. The Constitution but states again these rights already existing, and when legislative encroachment by the nation, state, or municipality invade these original and permanent rights, it is the duty of the courts to so declare, and to afford the necessary relief. The fewer restrictions that surround the individual liberties of the citizen, except those for the preservation of the public health, safety, and morals, the more contented the people and the more successful the democracy.”
- - - City of Dallas v Mitchell, 245 S.W. 944
https://casetext.com/case/city-of-dallas-v-mitchell-1
. . .
"What I do say is that no man is good enough to govern another man without that other's CONSENT. I say this is the leading principle, the sheet-anchor of American republicanism. Our Declaration of Independence says: "We hold these truths to be self-evident: That all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights; that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed."
- - - Abraham Lincoln, Speech at Peoria, Illinois (1854)
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Abraham_lincoln
. . .
People who have not consented, are not governed (ruled), but served by government.
People who have consented, have no grounds to object to being governed by another man.



The rights of the individual / national / non-citizen / inhabitant / non-resident are not derived from government, but are Creator endowed.
But once consent to be governed is granted, via citizenship, that endowment has been surrendered / waived by the citizenry. Why? Because mandatory civic duties abrogate endowed natural rights, natural and personal liberty, absolute ownership of private property, etc, etc.
. . .
CONSIDER THIS -

If the population of citizens had remained at 3-5%, and only they were the tax payers, militiamen, and pool of public servants, how much power and wealth would they have been able to wield?

Very little.

THIS, I believe, was the intent of the FOUNDERS - to insure that the evils of democracy (majority persecuting a minority; partisan infighting; political rivalry) could never trouble the united States of America. Unfortunately, their intentions were circumvented in less than 3 generations after the revolution (1820-1776= 44 years).
. . .
In the 1980s, I wrote to 30 embassies asking questions:

1) Do you have a republican form of government, and
2) Other than the USA, do you know of any other republican form of government.
Of the embassies that answered, they all replied, "no, and no."

Only the United States of America has a republican form of government. 99% of its people cannot accurately define it, or its source and origin. "Someone" expended huge resources in eradicating it from the minds of Americans.

It's the reason why America has been under attack from day one.
Why?

Pursuant to the Declaration, All Americans are created equal before the law - no one has higher status. American inhabitants are thus presumed to have the highest status at law - sovereign.

The Declaration is also the source of the Republican form of government and the sovereignty of the Americans who have not consented to be governed. And this also explains why Americans are not obligated under international law to kneel nor bow to any foreign monarch. We're their social equals. Which also explains why Americans can marry foreign nobility without violating their local laws barring commoners from marrying nobility. Nor should sovereign Americans accept titles of nobility from foreign sovereigns. And the vulgar taunt : "Kiss my royal American @ss!" is technically correct and legally accurate.

That is why no other nation with a constitution has a “republican form.” No compact can grant sovereignty to its subjects.
No other government recognizes that its people are SOVEREIGN and thus SUPERIOR to it.
SUBJECT - One that owes allegiance to a sovereign and is governed by his laws.
...Men in free governments are subjects as well as citizens; as citizens they enjoy rights and franchises; as subjects they are bound to obey the laws. The term is little used, in this sense, in countries enjoying a republican form of government.
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p. 1425
There is only ONE NATION with a republican form in all the world, whose people are sovereigns, and have Creator endowed rights that are the envy of the world. If ever the people of USA were to restore their endowment, and then prosper, it would trigger a world wide conflagration as other people would seek to liberate themselves from lifelong submission to monarchies and governments.
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Old 11-12-2019, 08:39 PM
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I don’t see the issue.

Quit saying “a” democracy as if it were a noun.

We live in a thing known as a republic...but the concept of democracy is part of that. If we don’t have the idea of “democracy”, then our representative republic doesn’t work.

We want people to be able to choose their government, and democracy is how they do that. They should be free to choose to create a republic, a direct democracy, or whatever form of government they want. So making the world free for democracy isn’t a lie at all.

And forcing them to use our form....isn’t freedom.

All that said, the OP is right. People don’t understand that, and the knowledge and understanding is being wiped out.
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Old 11-12-2019, 09:13 PM
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Originally Posted by ajole View Post
I don’t see the issue.

Quit saying “a” democracy as if it were a noun.
[IT IS A NOUN.
DEMOCRACY - n. Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives.]

We live in a thing known as a republic...but the concept of democracy is part of that. If we don’t have the idea of “democracy”, then our representative republic doesn’t work. [The Founders hated democracy - especially England's parliamentary form, where the executives (ministers) were chosen from the legislators.]

We want people to be able to choose their government, and democracy is how they do that. They should be free to choose to create a republic, a direct democracy, or whatever form of government they want. So making the world free for democracy isn’t a lie at all. [It's UNAMERICAN!]

And forcing them to use our form....isn’t freedom. [A sovereign is supreme, and cannot be forced to use a government.]

All that said, the OP is right. People don’t understand that, and the knowledge and understanding is being wiped out.
SERF'S UP!

Let me put it this way, England is a monarchy, and Canada "thinks" it is independent, yet you can look it up and see that Queen Elizabeth II is their sovereign, and they are her subjects.
In the movie, "Fly Away Home," the Canadian game warden tells the children that "these are the Queen's Geese."

Now, you can get into arguments with Canadians who BELIEVE they're a free and independent country, etc, etc. Some even believe they're SOVEREIGNS.
. . .
Who's lying?
Or who's the victim of pervasive propaganda?
. . .
A REPUBLIC is not synonymous with a REPUBLICAN FORM

In American law, a republican form is one in which ALL MEN have Creator endowed rights. BUT. If you consent to be governed as a citizen, you surrender that endowment. No.Endowed.Rights.
In a democracy, a majority can legally persecute a minority, as shown by America's early years of slavery-a revenue taxable privilege. Since "Sovereigns without subjects" cannot own slaves, the Confederacy had to secede and form a new democracy rather than revert to the old republican form.
REPUBLIC - A commonwealth; That form of government in which the administration of affairs is open to all the citizens. In another sense, it signifies the state, independent of its form of government.
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, P. 1302
Here, we see a reference to citizens (subjects of a sovereign), which cannot refer to sovereigns (the people).
GOVERNMENT (Republican Form of Government)- One in which the powers of sovereignty are vested in the people and are exercised by the people ... directly...
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, P. 695
RFOG = people directly exercise sovereignty. OK.

A less Vague Definition:
A Republican Form is one in which all men have Creator endowed rights that governments are instituted to secure. Absent consent, all that governments may do is adjudicate disputes, prosecute criminals, and defend against all enemies, foreign or domestic...
DEMOCRACY - That form of government in which the sovereign power resides in and is exercised by the whole body of free citizens directly or indirectly through a system of representation, as distinguished from monarchy, aristocracy, or oligarchy.
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition, P. 432
Since there is no such thing as collective sovereignty, any minority is at risk in a democracy.

Another way of looking at it -
In American law, there are two statuses recognized:

• Sovereign Americans, who retain all Creator endowed rights, liberties, powers and immunities.
• Subject Americans, who have civil and political liberties (i.e., "civil rights"), but due to mandatory civic duties, have surrendered their endowment.

Much of the controversy in American politics stem from the fact that most Americans are unaware of how and when they consented to be governed, and therefore object to the civic duties and impositions placed upon them in the glorious socialist paradise.

By the way, sovereigns do not vote nor participate in government. Nor do they owe taxes, allegiance, or any other duty to the state. Ironically, in today's Peoples Democratic Socialist Republic, the laws on the books still support the republican form, so there are no grounds to "Alter or Abolish" it... yet.
You can check any state and find that non-resident free inhabitant non-citizen American nationals domiciled upon private property are still secure.

"Everyone knows" that Americans who are born within the jurisdiction of the United States Federal government are U.S. citizens, at birth, must be enrolled into Social Security as soon as possible, and must have that number to live, work, attend public schools, pay taxes, open personal bank accounts, own stocks, and so on. They have civil and political rights (aka “liberties”) to vote and serve in public office. All U.S. citizens / U.S. residents residing at a residence, must get permission / license and / or pay taxes to live, work, buy, sell, own, hunt, fish, travel, operate a business, drive a car, fly a plane, enter occupations, build a house, marry and / or own a dog. All citizens have mandatory civic duties that range from compulsory jury duty, paying a share of their property (taxes), paying a share of their income (excise tax), to militia duty, the obligation to train, fight, and die on command (Selective Service).

BUT HOW DO INFANTS GIVE CONSENT?
HOW CAN A GOVERNMENT INSTITUTED TO SECURE CREATOR ENDOWED RIGHTS, IMPOSE CITIZENSHIP THAT ABROGATES ENDOWED RIGHTS?

Move along, nothing to see here, do not look behind the curtain, little girl, we are the great and powerful government. You can trust us - we're the government!
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Old 11-12-2019, 09:21 PM
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Point to ponder...
When American expansion took over lands, and "freed" their people, it WAS a benevolent act.
Consider Hawaii, a monarchy. After the (questionable) revolution, all the people became sovereigns at law (if they were informed, that is).
If you were a new sovereign, monarch of your domain, would you prefer to return to the 'old ways' of submission to the monarch?
I'm betting on sovereignty.

Yup, America had to be made brain dead and turned into a pariah, because unleashing the republican form upon the world would destroy all the rich and powerful.

“I firmly believe that the benevolent Creator designed the republican Form of Government for Man.”
- - - Statement of (14 April 1785), quoted in The Writings of Samuel Adams (1904) edited by Harry A. Cushing
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Samuel_Adams

God does bless America - with His republican form of government.
(The source of "Creator endowed rights" is God, right?)
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Old 11-12-2019, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics View Post
IT IS A NOUN.
DEMOCRACY - n. Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives.]

SERF'S UP!
You’re full of yourself.

IT’S ALSO NOT A NOUN.

Democracy:

- control of an organization or group by the majority of its members.

- the practice or principles of social equality.

- political or social equality; democratic spirit.

- the common people of a community as distinguished from any privileged class; the common people with respect to their political power.

In many cases, democracy is used as a synonym for freedom. It is not...but it’s used that way. You can try to make a big deal out of it...but it’s not.
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Old 11-12-2019, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by ajole View Post
You’re full of yourself.

IT’S ALSO NOT A NOUN. [nope]

Democracy:
- control of an organization or group by the majority of its members.
- the practice or principles of social equality.
- political or social equality; democratic spirit.
- the common people of a community as distinguished from any privileged class; the common people with respect to their political power.

In many cases, democracy is used as a synonym for freedom. It is not...but it’s used that way. You can try to make a big deal out of it...but it’s not.
Thank you for the kind words of support. Insults from an opponent are high praise - I blush.

FYI:
Nouns are words that indicate a person, place, or thing.
In a sentence, nouns can function as the subject or the object of a verb. Nouns can also follow linking verbs to rename or re-identify the subject of a sentence or clause; these are known as predicate nouns.

All your examples were nouns. They were not verbs, adjectives nor adverbs.

As to the point of democracy, what is your point?

Do you dislike the Founders' "all men are created equal and have endowed rights" and prefer "socialist equality"?
OK.

But my point still stands unrebutted - that most Americans have been fed lies, half lies, and half truths so that they have no idea what the Founders instituted in 1776.

"Someone" has taken great pains to eradicate any memory of the republican form from 320 million Americans.

Who benefits?
Certainly not the millions of potential sovereigns, who have been cheated out of their birthright.
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Old 11-13-2019, 02:21 AM
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BUT HOW DO INFANTS GIVE CONSENT? [they can't]

HOW CAN A GOVERNMENT INSTITUTED TO SECURE CREATOR ENDOWED RIGHTS, IMPOSE CITIZENSHIP THAT ABROGATES ENDOWED RIGHTS? [it didn't]
Until you reach legal age and consent, any presumption that you're a U.S. citizen has no binding legal effect.

Also, carefully read the 13th and 14th amendments and you will see that what you think is being referenced as the "United States" are two distinct items - which shows the gigantic HALF TRUTHS in the law.
13th amendment, Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
{United States, in the plural, means the 50 States united aka "USA"}
14th amendment, Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside.
{The term “thereof” means of the thing just mentioned. So one who is subject to the “United States” for the purposes of U.S. citizenship means the federal government. United States, in the singular, must refer to the Federal government, a foreign corporation with respect to a State wherein the citizen resides. Why not just re-use the language in the 13th amendment? Because they're running a scam.}
"We have in our political system a government of the United States and a government of each of the several States. Each one of these governments is distinct from the others, and each has citizens of it's own..."
United States v. Cruikshank, 92 U.S. 542 (1875)
FEDERAL CORPORATIONS - The United States government is a foreign corporation with respect to a state.
- - - Volume 19, Corpus Juris Secundum XVIII. Foreign Corporations, Sections 883,884
"The United States and the State of California are two separate sovereignties, each dominant in its own sphere."
Redding v. Los Angeles (1947), 81 C.A.2d 888, 185 P.2d 430.

It will be admitted on all hands that with the exception of the powers granted to the states and the federal government, through the Constitutions, the people of the several states are unconditionally sovereign within their respective states.
Ohio L. Ins. & T. Co. v. Debolt 16 How. 416, 14 L.Ed. 997
How can one of the sovereign people have children born subjects of a foreign corporation?
Ans: They can't.

Explanation time.
For which group of people was the 14th amendment U.S. citizenship created?
Former slaves.
Emancipated slaves are not the same as manumitted slaves.
In other words, the once private chattels became subjects of the federal government, as U.S. citizens. They apparently were not given the opportunity to ascend to sovereign status, and were shunted to subjects of the federal government. Hence the "separate but equal" treatment under Jim Crow in certain states.

The so-called "Civil Rights" laws did nothing to elevate the U.S. citizen, but merely bring down all others in socialist equality.

Such statesmenship in the Glorious People's Republic [/sarcasm] !
MANUMISSION - From the Latin term manumissio, "setting slaves at liberty". A formal document in which a slave owner freed a specific slave, thereby giving the slave the right to all freedoms held by free men and women.

MANUMIT - To free from slavery or bondage.

EMANCIPATION - The act of freeing a person who was under the legal authority of another (such as a child before the age of majority) from that control (such as child reaching the age of majority).
Also, the Emancipation Proclamation only affected the Rebel states over which the Federal government had no authority, constitutional nor militarily, while not freeing the slaves in the Union states.

BUT AS LONG AS YOU CONSENT, NO HARM, NO FOUL.
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Before the passage of the 26th Amendment in 1971, 21 was the minimum voting age in most states—and thus served as the age of adulthood in most areas of law. Congress lowered the nationwide voting age to 18 as a response to unrest and passionate debate about the Vietnam War.

Militia duty (Selective Service) was compelling people who had not really consented to be citizens to train, fight, and die on command. The reduction in age appeared to make it legitimate, but it only masked the scam, since no one was made aware that they could avoid the legal duty by renouncing U.S. citizenship.

Militia duty:

“AGE.... In the United States, at twenty-five, a man [citizen] may be elected a representative in congress;
● at thirty, a senator; and
● at thirty-five, he may be chosen president.
● He is liable to serve in the militia from eighteen to forty-five inclusive, unless exempted for some particular reason.”
- - - From Bouvier’s Law dictionary, 1856 ed.

Title 10 USC Sec. 311. Militia: composition and classes
(a) The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section 313 of title 32, under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, CITIZENS of the United States and of female citizens of the United States who are members of the National Guard.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War
“The great draft riot in New York City in July 1863 involved Irish immigrants who had been signed up as citizens to swell the vote of the city's Democratic political machine, not realizing it made them liable for the draft.”

STATES HAVE MILITIA DUTY, TOO - - -

Pennsylvania General Assembly
Title 51, Part II, Chapter 3
The Militia
§ 301. Formation.
(a) Pennsylvania militia.--The militia of this Commonwealth shall consist of:
(1) all able-bodied citizens of the United States and all other able-bodied persons who have declared their intention to become citizens of the United States, residing within this Commonwealth, who are at least 17 years six months of age and, except as hereinafter provided, not more than 55 years of age...

NOTE: Parental consent is needed for 17 year olds to enlist.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetgraphics View Post
The HBO mini-series on Chernobyl illustrated the need for facts and truth over lies and propaganda.
The funniest thing in your statement is that the Chernobyl mini-series is also a product of the media, not a documentary.
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Originally Posted by Trackball View Post
The funniest thing in your statement is that the Chernobyl mini-series is also a product of the media, not a documentary.
Did you miss the next sentence where I pointed out that the show was propaganda?
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Homework assignment : check your own state constitutions / statutes for:
_ _ Explicit restatement of the republican form (from the Declaration of Independence)
_ _ Constitutional protection for PRIVATE PROPERTY
_ _ Recognition of the endowed rights of non-resident INHABITANTS domiciled upon private property
_ _ Any mandatory civic duties are limited to citizens / residents
_ _ Any taxes are limited to privileges, like qualified ownership of estate

= = = = = =
<Restatement of the Declaration of Independence, and the attributes of the republican form of government>
CALIFORNIA CONSTITUTION
Article I Declaration of Rights [Section 1 - Sec. 32]
( Article 1 adopted 1879. )
Section 1.
All people are by nature free and independent and have inalienable rights. Among these are enjoying and defending life and liberty, acquiring, possessing, and protecting property, and pursuing and obtaining safety, happiness, and privacy.
Pennsylvania Constitution,
Article 1, Section 1. Inherent Rights of Mankind

All men are born equally free and independent, and have certain inherent and indefeasible rights, among which are those of enjoying and defending life and liberty, of acquiring, possessing and protecting property and reputation, and of pursuing their own happiness.
PRIVATE PROPERTY v. ESTATE

Pennsylvania Constitution,
Article 1,Section 10.
...nor shall private property be taken or applied to public use, without authority of law and without just compensation being first made or secured.
Georgia Constitution, Article 1, Sec.3, Paragraph 1
"... private property shall not be taken or damaged for public purposes without just and adequate compensation being first paid.'
While private property is explicitly protected, real estate (aka real or personal property is subject to taxation).
PROPERTY TAX - "An ad valorem tax, usually levied by a city or county, on the value of real or personal property that the taxpayer owns on a specified date."
Black's Law dictionary, sixth ed., p.1218
INHABITANT v RESIDENT
" No inhabitant of this state shall be molested in person or property ... on account of religious opinions..."
- - - Georgia Constitution, Article 1, Sec.1, Paragraph 4


“ Citizens, protection of. All citizens of the United States, resident in this state, are hereby declared citizens of this state ; and it shall be the duty of the General Assembly to enact such laws as will protect them in the full enjoyment of the rights, privileges, and immunities due to such citizenship.”
- - - Georgia Constitution, Article 1, Sec.3, Paragraph 7
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Old 11-15-2019, 05:15 AM
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At the 'atomic' level, we can claim that "all men have Creator endowed rights that governments were instituted to secure."

Then pose the question how or when did we lose our endowed rights?

Obviously, if we have no idea how it happened, it was not done by consent of the governed.

If fraud was used to gain our consent, we have the right to withdraw that consent, and cancel any and all obligations associated with that consent.

Which may explain why the government authorized educational system is mute on the subject. If a majority (51%) of Americans "walked off" their reservation, the People's Democratic Socialist Republic is kaput.

Why?

Those who withdraw will no doubt be the best productive earners and taxpayers, thus reducing the federal revenues and budget accordingly. (No government instituted to secure endowed rights can tax rights. They can only tax privileges.) And by ceasing to be subjects, reduce the number of subjects ruled by government. Again, another means to enforce government reduction in size.
If the remainder of subjects are "takers" and not "makers" this puts an even greater strain on the collapsing socialist paradise.

Eventually, the government will have to end all public charity (socialism, relief, pensions, etc). Ditto, for the alphabet agencies. I also suspect that limited liability will be banned, which will directly affect corporations (artificial persons), as well as 'licensed' occupations like physicians.

When, not if, that comes about, having alternatives ready and preparations made, shall ease the transition.
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