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Old 08-25-2014, 09:14 AM
BigSeanStudd BigSeanStudd is offline
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Default Temperature sensitive smokeless powders



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Me again. I was hoping that reloaders could chime in with what smokeless powders that they have used that had the wildest temperature swings. I've looked around the internet and haven't come across where people list what powders to really stay away from, or in the least, use them as a last resort... I know I know, another 1-star thread... Sigh.
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Old 08-25-2014, 11:16 AM
franklin franklin is offline
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Some powders are more sensitive than others.
Here is a link to Hodgden's line of powders which are more stable than some others.
http://hodgdon.com/extreme.html

Probably the most variance I had was when I prepared in summer for a fall elk hunt. While working up loads it was in the 90s and I was at 500 feet elevation. I hunted between 6,000 and 9,000 feet at 20 Deg. I'm sure some others do the same but get out in even colder weather.

I was loading a 7mm mag and wanted to be at the upper pressure limits to get the most out of any long shots. The powder I was using was Hodgden H4831. That was before Hodgden identified H4831 as one of the more stable powders.

Unless you are pushing the edge on pressures or experiencing extremely large temp swings it's not hard to accommodate.
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Old 08-25-2014, 06:55 PM
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W748 ball powder is extremely temperature sensitive. I have a tack driver .223 load that loses almost all accuracy below 40 and over 80, but it'll put thirty rounds through a dime from 40 to 80.
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Old 08-26-2014, 10:09 AM
whirlibird whirlibird is offline
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Single base powders are generally more cold resistant.

There are any number of extreme temperature powders out there today.
Find one that works for you.
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Old 08-26-2014, 10:24 AM
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I have had a problem with primers in the past. Non Magnum primers don't fire off well after 10 or 20 degree's in Temperature. So My loads I work them up with Magnum primers to begin with and test at all different temps. Because you don't want to hear a click when you need a boom.
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Old 08-26-2014, 11:12 AM
AK_Red AK_Red is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweeper80 View Post
W748 ball powder is extremely temperature sensitive. I have a tack driver .223 load that loses almost all accuracy below 40 and over 80, but it'll put thirty rounds through a dime from 40 to 80.
Huh.

I use W748 for my .223 and don't really notice a difference between 80 and negative 20. Then again, I am usually not shooting at targets. It is more what my father called MoOC (Minute of Oil Can), though these days I should probably call it minute of bouncy target. I am not disputing your claim, just stating my ability to shoot a bouncy target with an AR doesn't change much between 80 and -20.

We did have a dumb ass idea once to go shooting at negative 45. Accuracy was non-existent, but I think that had more to do with us repeating "****! It's cold! Why are we out here?" over and over. Pro-tip - I don't care how well bundled up you are. An hour and a half outside at -45 gets chilly. But we did have the range to ourselves.
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Old 08-26-2014, 02:52 PM
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Win 760 and 748
IMR 4350

I've heard CFE223 can be, but I can't confirm that one.
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Old 08-26-2014, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK_Red View Post
Huh.

I use W748 for my .223 and don't really notice a difference between 80 and negative 20. Then again, I am usually not shooting at targets. It is more what my father called MoOC (Minute of Oil Can), though these days I should probably call it minute of bouncy target. I am not disputing your claim, just stating my ability to shoot a bouncy target with an AR doesn't change much between 80 and -20.

We did have a dumb ass idea once to go shooting at negative 45. Accuracy was non-existent, but I think that had more to do with us repeating "****! It's cold! Why are we out here?" over and over. Pro-tip - I don't care how well bundled up you are. An hour and a half outside at -45 gets chilly. But we did have the range to ourselves.
Can't tell the difference in my 16" AR, but my 22" exaggerates inconsistencies and changes, tight bore and chamber as opposed to the less sensitive standard 16" setup. Going from shooting consistent dime sized groups at 100 yards to shooting 2-3" groups and fragging projectiles was a helluva surprise. I've developed a 3031 load for the tack driver during higher temps.

What powder charge and bullet weight are you using? Mine's 27.2gr behind a 40g V-max
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Old 08-26-2014, 07:01 PM
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I typically use IMR powders for my hunting rifles and have NOT experienced any issues. (25-06, 270, 30-06)

I use W748 in my .223 and 30-30 and not seen any issues but both are 2 MOA anyway.

If you think it's an issue, keep your hunting cartridges in your pocket
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Old 08-26-2014, 07:49 PM
AK_Red AK_Red is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweeper80 View Post
What powder charge and bullet weight are you using? Mine's 27.2gr behind a 40g V-max

I am using more bullet and less powder. 40gr bullets don't do well out of my AR.

The smallest bullet I use is 50gr Vmax with 26.4gr of powder. That's well below max load but, when I worked it up for my rifle, more powder didn't improve accuracy. Since I shoot a lot of it, less powder=more ammo. The 50gr bullets should not work as well out of my barrel (if you are a believer in the barrel twist/bullet weight charts for the AR) as they do, but I don't complain about it.

I have 62gr (back when you could buy ss109 on ebay, I indulged) and 77gr Nosler's as well. I usually use RL15 for these guys, but I have not been able to find it recently. So I will be back to using 748 (don't get that either, but I still have some from before the great panic of '12) when I run out.

Win 748 may act differently in lower temps and I just don't notice it because it is not enough to throw off my aim. If I hit the bouncy ball I am happy. When I do shoot at paper it is in the summer. At those temps, 60-90 degrees, I notice no difference in grouping.

My apologies for all the parenthesis. I get carried away sometimes.
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Old 08-26-2014, 08:58 PM
thess02 thess02 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK_Red View Post
I am using more bullet and less powder. 40gr bullets don't do well out of my AR.

The smallest bullet I use is 50gr Vmax with 26.4gr of powder. That's well below max load but, when I worked it up for my rifle, more powder didn't improve accuracy. Since I shoot a lot of it, less powder=more ammo. The 50gr bullets should not work as well out of my barrel (if you are a believer in the barrel twist/bullet weight charts for the AR) as they do, but I don't complain about it.

I have 62gr (back when you could buy ss109 on ebay, I indulged) and 77gr Nosler's as well. I usually use RL15 for these guys, but I have not been able to find it recently. So I will be back to using 748 (don't get that either, but I still have some from before the great panic of '12) when I run out.

Win 748 may act differently in lower temps and I just don't notice it because it is not enough to throw off my aim. If I hit the bouncy ball I am happy. When I do shoot at paper it is in the summer. At those temps, 60-90 degrees, I notice no difference in grouping.

My apologies for all the parenthesis. I get carried away sometimes.
Wideners has bulk SS109 projectiles on sale...."milspec" according to their website.

Added: https://www.wideners.com/itemdetail....1079|1085|1726

Last edited by thess02; 08-26-2014 at 09:01 PM.. Reason: Added link
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