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Old 07-29-2018, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by tiberius View Post
CO2 levels before the industion revolution where about 280 parts per million.

We starting testing them atmospherically in 1958 and now test them all over
the world daily and even via satellites.

Currently CO2 levels are 410 parts per million and we will go through an
interesting milestone within 5 years.
When we reach 420 parts per million we will have an atmosphere with 50%
more CO2 in it then before we started our exciting planetary scale fossil fuel
experiment.

https://www.esrl.noaa.gov/gmd/ccgg/trends/full.html

https://www.co2.earth/
Yeah, CO2 levels are higher, yeah it has a warming effect. But it's a mild one and one that is far easier to adapt to than to prevent. We're talking about maybe getting an extra couple hurricanes per year. Mild increases in severe weather events over multiple lifetimes. Society has spoken, and they're choosing to adapt to a slightly harsher environment over collapsing civilization.

There is no threat to existence or life. Life has been more abundant and diverse in much higher temperatures. Just changes to building codes and higher insurance costs. Animals may migrate slightly or change population ratios or favor slightly different traits in evolution. Growing zones might shift by a zone. That's pretty much it. And quite frankly it may save us from a mini-ice-age caused by other factors that cool the planet and tend to pop up unexpectedly. A slightly warmer climate gives us a slightly better buffer against such events.
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Old 07-29-2018, 04:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Justme11 View Post
Interesting! So how do the greenhouse growers increase the CO2 levels typically? Do they just run a little gas burner in the greenhouse or something?
I assume anyone that took the trouble to build a greenhouse would know this and use it to their advantage?
Move the man cave, refrigerator full of beer and soda and have a party in the greenhouse. Make sure everybody belches (CO2) inside the greenhouse.
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Old 07-29-2018, 09:15 PM
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Plants cannot live on CO2 alone
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Old 07-29-2018, 09:22 PM
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They don't even provide a reason why it's wrong and if you actually read the article it does nothing but support what they're calling a myth.

Their entire advanced knowledge supposition makes no actual argument against the original premise: "The effects of enhanced CO2 on terrestrial plants are variable and complex and dependent on numerous factors."

Their basic supposition makes no argument whatsoever: "More Carbon Dioxide in the atmosphere is not necessarily good for plants."
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Old 07-29-2018, 10:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justme11 View Post
Interesting! So how do the greenhouse growers increase the CO2 levels typically? Do they just run a little gas burner in the greenhouse or something?
I assume anyone that took the trouble to build a greenhouse would know this and use it to their advantage?
For a science fair project set up two terrariums. Start at the same time. Put a full can of carbonated water in one and non-carbonated water in the other. Change the cans every you pick the time. Best way is leave a carbonated can open and taste test for flatness.

https://www.google.com/search?q=para...w=1264&bih=816

https://www.google.com/search?q=gree...w=1264&bih=816
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Old 07-30-2018, 05:30 AM
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on a science oriented documentary about Volcanology (including warnings that WE are responsible for Global Warming/Climate Change), they said that any any given time there are an estimated 50 volcanos in one stage of eruption or another. this would dwarf what humans cause.

climate change isnt about the climate, its about population and economic control forced on people by those that want to tell the world how they should live.
Did volcanoes just start happending during the industrial revolution? Because, that is
when CO2 levels started to rise. I thought volcanoes had happened like - forever?
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Old 07-30-2018, 06:19 AM
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Originally Posted by tiberius View Post
Did volcanoes just start happending during the industrial revolution? Because, that is
when CO2 levels started to rise. I thought volcanoes had happened like - forever?
Mauna Loa observatory recorded 410 parts per million in May of 2018 and Kilauea volcano stated erupting in May. Kilauea is 20 miles from Mauna Loa.

I know they have other stations around the globe, but using Mauna Loa co2 readings is just asinine.

Scientist speculate that the end-Permian extinction was influenced by the volcanic activity in the Siberian Traps.

http://news.mit.edu/2015/siberian-tr...xtinction-0916

Quote:
Scientists suspect that massive volcanic activity, in a large igneous province called the Siberian Traps, may have had a role in the global die-off, raising air and sea temperatures and releasing toxic amounts of greenhouse gases into the atmosphere over a very short period of time. However, it’s unclear whether magmatism was the main culprit, or simply an accessory to the mass extinction.
If you'll notice my link is to MIT and not the daily mail.
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Old 07-30-2018, 06:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Creek Walker View Post
Mauna Loa observatory recorded 410 parts per million in May of 2018 and Kilauea volcano stated erupting in May. Kilauea is 20 miles from Mauna Loa.

I know they have other stations around the globe, but using Mauna Loa co2 readings is just asinine.

Scientist speculate that the end-Permian extinction was influenced by the volcanic activity in the Siberian Traps.

http://news.mit.edu/2015/siberian-tr...xtinction-0916



If you'll notice my link is to MIT and not the daily mail.
Volcanoes are sporadic in nature, we wouldn't see smooth curved rises in CO2 if they were a sizeable component..
Look how smooth and regular the Keeling Curve is...


https://www.skepticalscience.com/vol...al-warming.htm
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Old 07-30-2018, 08:05 AM
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There is a high degree of CO2 variation. There even measurable differences in the center of large corn fields vs. around the edges.

When plants consume CO2 it takes time for levels to redistribute themselves. In the case of a large corn field the redistribution is seldom fast enough for there to be no measurable difference between the center and edges.

For this reason using ice cores etc. are poor measurements because we cannot know what special causes occurred at or before the CO2 became trapped.
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Old 07-30-2018, 09:20 AM
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Did volcanoes just start happending during the industrial revolution? Because, that is
when CO2 levels started to rise. I thought volcanoes had happened like - forever?
Strange.....Co2 was much much higher before the industrial revolution too....



While one can say that humans have coincided with a planetary CO2 minimum, there is little evidence that we cannot exist with a higher level of CO2. The opposite seems to be true actually, humans continue to flourish with rising levels as we have more people, which are living longer, producing more food, and generally having a better quality of life.
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Old 07-30-2018, 11:04 AM
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Strange.....Co2 was much much higher before the industrial revolution too....
Millions of years ago when dinosaurs walked the Earth?
I imagine it was. However, that isn't very relevant to modern farming.
Let's look at the last 400 thousand years...
Oops when happened about 1910?
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Old 07-30-2018, 11:12 AM
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There is a high degree of CO2 variation. There even measurable differences in the center of large corn fields vs. around the edges.

When plants consume CO2 it takes time for levels to redistribute themselves. In the case of a large corn field the redistribution is seldom fast enough for there to be no measurable difference between the center and edges.

For this reason using ice cores etc. are poor measurements because we cannot know what special causes occurred at or before the CO2 became trapped.
Utter garbage.
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Old 07-30-2018, 11:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Colt View Post
Yeah, CO2 levels are higher, yeah it has a warming effect. But it's a mild one and one that is far easier to adapt to than to prevent. We're talking about maybe getting an extra couple hurricanes per year. Mild increases in severe weather events over multiple lifetimes. Society has spoken, and they're choosing to adapt to a slightly harsher environment over collapsing civilization.

There is no threat to existence or life. Life has been more abundant and diverse in much higher temperatures. Just changes to building codes and higher insurance costs. Animals may migrate slightly or change population ratios or favor slightly different traits in evolution. Growing zones might shift by a zone. That's pretty much it. And quite frankly it may save us from a mini-ice-age caused by other factors that cool the planet and tend to pop up unexpectedly. A slightly warmer climate gives us a slightly better buffer against such events.
Yes, we have had slight but noticeable effects thus far. However, it is entirely posslbe that we will have a tipping point, where we start to melt the tundra and billions of tonnes of frozen methane escapes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runawa...l_habitability

http://www.methanelevels.org/
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Old 07-30-2018, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by tiberius View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metcalf View Post
Strange.....Co2 was much much higher before the industrial revolution too....
Millions of years ago when dinosaurs walked the Earth?
I imagine it was. However, that isn't very relevant to modern farming.
Let's look at the last 400 thousand years...
Oops when happened about 1910?
So? Climate changed before....it will change again. The rate of change has happened before, prior to humans. The rate of change now has had ZERO negative effect on humanity. If you look at the actual data, we have continued to produce more food while supporting more people having longer lives.
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Old 07-30-2018, 12:52 PM
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Utter garbage.
Prove it ain't so.
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Old 07-30-2018, 12:54 PM
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So? Climate changed before....it will change again. The rate of change has happened before, prior to humans. The rate of change now has had ZERO negative effect on humanity. If you look at the actual data, we have continued to produce more food while supporting more people having longer lives.
Those scientists are just mental then - have you emailed them?
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Old 07-30-2018, 12:57 PM
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Utter garbage.
I just discovered I could buy a CO2 meter that measures CO2 ppm for $229. I might just buy one and do my own monitoring.

Might have to travel to my cousins' farm to find a large corn field I can wonder around in.
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Old 07-30-2018, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Metcalf View Post
So? Climate changed before....it will change again. The rate of change has happened before, prior to humans. The rate of change now has had ZERO negative effect on humanity. If you look at the actual data, we have continued to produce more food while supporting more people having longer lives.
Those scientists are just mental then - have you emailed them?
The alarmist scientists that scream the sky is falling with models that dont work and no predictions that come true?
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Old 07-30-2018, 03:44 PM
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Volcanoes are sporadic in nature, we wouldn't see smooth curved rises in CO2 if they were a sizeable component..
Look how smooth and regular the Keeling Curve is...


https://www.skepticalscience.com/vol...al-warming.htm
And of course the number they give is basically the minimum without eruptions. That site is consistently failing basic logical and scientific methods. It's not a credible.source.
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Old 07-30-2018, 03:54 PM
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Yes, we have had slight but noticeable effects thus far. However, it is entirely posslbe that we will have a tipping point, where we start to melt the tundra and billions of tonnes of frozen methane escapes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runawa...l_habitability

http://www.methanelevels.org/
There's also a possibility that we've reached a tipping point in music that will result in it being so terrible that we all go extinct from Mass suicide. Or maybe it'll just be somewhat obnoxious and unenjoyable. Conjecture isn't a solid foundation for how to run a civilization.

You're getting into planet x apoclypse territory. You'll find a lot of astronomy enthusiasts and some people with degrees that will tell you a giant dark planet is about to come barelling through the solar system in the next few days/months. We don't base our policies on the imminent arrival of nibiru either.
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