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Old 06-08-2019, 06:31 AM
eyepal eyepal is offline
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What you're talking about HAS been done, but put underground.
I believe I pointed this out already.
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Old 06-08-2019, 07:56 AM
WilliamAshley WilliamAshley is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrypticCRICKET View Post
Interesting question so I googled it.

Shipping containers are designed and built to withstand 180 mph winds without flexing.
LINK: https://www.falconstructures.com/blo...nd-with-safety

You just have to design a way to keep it attached firmly to the ground with those wind speeds.


Lets add some more container specs: http://steinecker-container.de/conta...h%20cube20.pdf


Looks like the container wall panels are made from steel .064" (1/16" thick). Roof panels are made from .080" thick steel. Steel hurricane shutters are a minimum of .030" (1/32") thick.



1/16" steel might stop a wind driven projectile or it might not. Hiding the container behind some trees and brush would take the energy out of most projectiles. If the trees aren't stripped away by the winds.


Google seems to have a lot of info on this subject.
Why not just trench it?


Put it in a trench reinforce with cross beams driven into the earth. If you get really serious then cap the crossbeams with a concrete foundation or stone.
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:08 AM
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I own a 20ft shipping container. I bought a premium quality container that had been used once. No dents, no leaks, no rust. They make terrific storage. Nice and dry and easy to secure. But the door locks from the outside, the walls are thin mild steel, and it has a lot of surface area. The only advantage I can see is, shipping containers are designed to be supported on the corners, and have have tie down holes for steel chains.

I also built a basement for my house built from Insulated Concrete Forms. It is a walkout design with the South wall dug 8 ft below surface.
The ICF walls are supported by deep footings, with lots of rebar, and 20 yds of concrete. Then more rebar is laid into the forms, and they are filled with more concrete.

A finnished ICF structure is the strongest structure against tornado damage I am aware of. I built a log home on top of my basement, and i might suffer some damage to the roof and deck work, but my wife and I will survive a direct hit from a twister.

Folks seem to be attracted to shipping containers due to the low cost. They are very usefull, but they not as cheap as a pole barn, and not nearly as safe as a real shelter. And nothing is as safe as an ICF basement.
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:11 AM
PA_Robert PA_Robert is offline
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Another option is to use pre cast concrete structures such as septics, box culverts or vaults.

The attached pdf is a 25,900 lb septic. It's not monolithic but the sections could be secured together with steel plate and concrete anchors

Whatever path you go just make sure that if it is a sealed, confined space, you check oxygen content before you rush in for shelter. It would suck for the structure to survive an F5 but they find you inside, dead, from an oxygen deficient or hazardous atmosphere.
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Old 06-08-2019, 09:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselmudder View Post
Could a shipping container, properly anchored to the ground survive a tornado?
Addressing this from an engineering perspective; the forces required to anchor an above ground container from winds, and protect those inside from "stuff" penetrating the container, would be a daunting task.

A container is not designed for the stresses of winds, or objects of mass hitting the container at high speed. As was seen in Celina OH when they had the tornado two weeks ago, objects like 2x4 ejected from the vortex into the container will penetrate the shell. Likewise, when introducing a container to the pressures and rigors of wet earth, the container will fail, caving in.

The points of structural integrity are designed for stacking on vertical posting, and there is no reasonable limit to the downward force, dead-center in the container's roof from a ton of dirt.

The only reasonable method for container burial is to construct what is basically a cement basement, where the container is craned into the void. (Note, drainage is essential as moisture of earth will eventually weaken walls from rusting).

Then overtop the container you have to place trusses to prevent the earth, and whatever is on top of the earth from collapsing the ceiling.

A client had a neighbor who didn't take these precautions after burying the container some 6' below ground level. He then back-filled over top the container, and leveled it to match the rest of the yard. Although he noticed the center of the ceiling of the container sag 13/16", he called it good. That is until he was mowing his grass, drove over the container, and found himself (and tractor), in a hole caused by the structural failure of the container.

Containers are great for storage, but unless you add some reasonable engineering to them for occupancy, and think out all the variables in installation, the outcome can become bad very quickly.

Anything good is typically not cheap, and anything cheap is typically not good or safe.
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Old 06-09-2019, 07:25 PM
dieselmudder dieselmudder is offline
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After seeing the Safe Shed, I think that's the way to go. Although considerably smaller it is much more robust

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Old 06-10-2019, 10:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamAshley View Post
Why not just trench it?


Put it in a trench reinforce with cross beams driven into the earth. If you get really serious then cap the crossbeams with a concrete foundation or stone.

If you're going to create a below ground shelter, I would never use a steel container under ground because of the constant moisture in the soil. Holes in the ground fill with water. It seeps through the soil and will find any voids to fill them. Rust the container into a pile of iron oxide and take it back to Mother Earth.


Shipping containers already have condensation problems because of their thermal mass. The ability to store cold and heat. I think they need to be above ground where they have air movement all around them and through them to reduce condensation issues.
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Old 06-17-2019, 06:23 PM
kavibalc kavibalc is offline
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It's not the wind. If it was just the wind I could survive a hurricane naked strapped to a tree.

It's the massive objects like houses being hurled at 180 mph winds that the shipping container will get shredded by.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrypticCRICKET View Post
Interesting question so I googled it.

Shipping containers are designed and built to withstand 180 mph winds without flexing.
LINK: https://www.falconstructures.com/blo...nd-with-safety

You just have to design a way to keep it attached firmly to the ground with those wind speeds.


Lets add some more container specs: http://steinecker-container.de/conta...h%20cube20.pdf


Looks like the container wall panels are made from steel .064" (1/16" thick). Roof panels are made from .080" thick steel. Steel hurricane shutters are a minimum of .030" (1/32") thick.



1/16" steel might stop a wind driven projectile or it might not. Hiding the container behind some trees and brush would take the energy out of most projectiles. If the trees aren't stripped away by the winds.


Google seems to have a lot of info on this subject.
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Old 06-17-2019, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kavibalc View Post
It's not the wind. If it was just the wind I could survive a hurricane naked strapped to a tree.

It's the massive objects like houses being hurled at 180 mph winds that the shipping container will get shredded by.

Yeah that's true.


Pieces of houses. Pieces of trees. Entire vehicles. All potentially being thrown against corrugated sheet metal twice as thick as a hurricane panel. Certainly no guarantee that a person would be protected by the shipping container.
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Old 06-18-2019, 08:42 AM
Mr4btTahoe Mr4btTahoe is offline
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You could certainly use a shipping container for a shelter but not by itself. Free standing, it wouldn't survive.

The cheapest way to do it would be to place it on higher ground... partially sink it into the ground (only 1-2' as shipping containers can't hold weight on their sides or top without substantial work).. anchor it down and then berm 3 sides. The dirt will give it adequate protection against projectiles and will help keep it on the ground. It'll take a lot of dirt and a lot of effort.

We built something similar using earthbags. Has worked great for our needs. I've got a thread on here about the build.
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Old 06-18-2019, 09:44 AM
eyepal eyepal is offline
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Regardless of what you go with, I'd sink it underground.
Did anyone happen to notice the damage done to the concrete building at the roof edge?
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Old 06-18-2019, 10:33 AM
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tedlovesjeeps71 tedlovesjeeps71 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyepal View Post
Regardless of what you go with, I'd sink it underground.

Did anyone happen to notice the damage done to the concrete building at the roof edge?


Cost of burying it would negate using one in the first place.
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