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Old 10-21-2019, 01:43 AM
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billwilla billwilla is offline
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Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post
I'll acknowledge all the internet commando statistics on ballistic coeffients, muzzle velocity, fragmentation vs tumble, etc, etc....
It doesn't appear you are acknowledging the internet "commando statistics"

Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post
However... even at 300 yards, is 5.56 THAT much more effective than a 22LR?
https://www.mcarbo.com/22LR-Ballistics-Chart

http://guide.sportsmansguide.com/bal...ts/223Rem.html

http://www.shooterscalculator.com/ba...php?t=f31587ba

http://www.shooterscalculator.com/ba...php?t=4e72518c



Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post

I'm thinking a bunch of 22LR with decent rifles for 100-300M placement would be a great baseline.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post
I totally made a typo in saying 100-300M. I really meant 100-300Y.
Very little difference at those ranges.

300 yards = 274.32 meter

300 meters = 328.08 yards

http://www.onlineconversion.com/length_common.htm
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Old 10-21-2019, 02:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Eddie_T View Post
I don't understand why people want to make fun of newbie. These forums should be a place where newbies should be able to ask questions without ridicule.
It's how they present themselves. This one tried to pass off BS as forgone accepted knowledge.
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Old 10-21-2019, 08:08 AM
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I shoot 22lr at 300 yards quite often. The only way I can make those hits is itís a known distance and I know my drop. Iím literally raining them in at 45 degrees at that distance and I barely hear the 18in gong.
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Old 10-21-2019, 08:47 AM
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I GUESS.. you could use the cheapy .22lr ammo for scaring people off when not serious to see if they will stay away
and
save the GOOD center-fire ammo for if things get serious.

Since it sounds like the OP is talking about "warning shots"

Something I am definitely not in favor of because of all the negative sides of doing same.
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Old 10-21-2019, 08:57 AM
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Since it sounds like the OP is talking about "warning shots"

Something I am definitely not in favor of because of all the negative sides of doing same.
Dumbass Joe Biden and his shotgun warning blast speech.

I have yet to meet a cop, guard, or military man who thinks a warning shot is a good idea.

The only warning shot that I ever though of value was a rock salt load on punk rural kids, and the shooters didn't try to miss. I think the days of that being of value have come and gone.

When one is fully responsible for every round then tossing one off in a random direction is just irresponsible.

If it seems like it will work then give a verbal warning and aim center mass. Then let the thug deal the play.
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Old 10-21-2019, 09:31 AM
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Jesus, great discussion! Lots of serious, tough hombres on this board.

Please tell me, dear internet friends, who is the first volunteer to approach my house and shake off a 22LR round and prove how ineffective it is in stopping Joe farmer from ransacking my place.

Granted, I would consider a 300yd shot challenging with any caliber, 22LR more so. I'm really trying what to stockpile long term. Several thousand rounds of 5.56 and .308. Just thinking beyond that.

Lighten up dudes.
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Old 10-21-2019, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post
Granted, I would consider a 300yd shot challenging with any caliber,....
Except...itís simply not that challenging in many calibers. Itís almost literally point and shoot for almost anything over 2800 FPS, thereís little to no holdover required for center mass hits, and if you use a rest...not a bench, but just a rest, like against a tree or over a shooting stick...itís going to be a hit. We did it with iron sights for decades. Slower stuff requires you to know and use some holdover, or to dial in a scope. But again, itís not that hard.

Unless you canít shoot.
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Old 10-21-2019, 10:11 AM
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Point taken ajole.
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Old 10-21-2019, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajole View Post
Except...itís simply not that challenging in many calibers. Itís almost literally point and shoot for almost anything over 2800 FPS, thereís little to no holdover required for center mass hits, and if you use a rest...not a bench, but just a rest, like against a tree or over a shooting stick...itís going to be a hit. We did it with iron sights for decades. Slower stuff requires you to know and use some holdover, or to dial in a scope. But again, itís not that hard.

Unless you canít shoot.
Yea, I can ironsight at 300 with my A2. I simply hold at the top of a 12in gong.
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Old 10-21-2019, 11:20 AM
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22LR is a very effective round, much more effective than most will give it credit for. However, I am not sure how well suited it is for ranges out to 300m. 100, and maybe even 150m - yes. 200 and beyond - yes it is still a very deadly round at that range, but I am not sure how accurate the average shooter would be with it because of the trajectory of the bullet.

At 200m you are looking at an average bullet drop of about 40 inches (about 100cm) and even at 150m you are still looking at an average bullet drop of about 20 inches (about 50cm). What this means is that you need to aim so high that you are no longer able to actually see the target that you are shooting at because the barrel (not just the font sight, but the barrel itself) is covering the target.

223/5.56 on the other hand is effective with a reasonable expectation of being able to hit your target at 400+m. If you know what you are doing, you can hit your target pretty much every time out to 500m (When I was in the military I qualifies Expert at ranges out to 500 yards which is almost 460 m).
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Old 10-21-2019, 01:04 PM
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Personally, I would leave .22LR for hunting small birds and animals at distances not exceeding 150 meters. Maybe, also for some covert shooting with a silencer, if you can legally purchase it (In my country, for example, the sale of silencers is not regulated at all and you can buy it simply in a store or just via the Internet). For everything else, I would prefer to stick with 5.56 or 7.62
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Old 10-21-2019, 01:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post
Jesus, great discussion! Lots of serious, tough hombres on this board.

Please tell me, dear internet friends, who is the first volunteer to approach my house and shake off a 22LR round and prove how ineffective it is in stopping Joe farmer from ransacking my place.

Granted, I would consider a 300yd shot challenging with any caliber, 22LR more so. I'm really trying what to stockpile long term. Several thousand rounds of 5.56 and .308. Just thinking beyond that.

Lighten up dudes.
How about this, you and four friends fire on two guys at 200 yards. You have 22lr and they have 5.56. While you are calculating the holdover and the slow velocity they would take two shots and move. And just then you realize that the third guy 100 yards back farther has. 30-06 with a decent scope and flanks you and picks you off. End the fight quickly and there won’t be a fight.

And if you didn’t mind the uptick in price, I would go with a 6.5 Grendel.
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Old 10-21-2019, 02:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post
Jesus, great discussion! Lots of serious, tough hombres on this board.

Please tell me, dear internet friends, who is the first volunteer to approach my house and shake off a 22LR round and prove how ineffective it is in stopping Joe farmer from ransacking my place.

Granted, I would consider a 300yd shot challenging with any caliber, 22LR more so. I'm really trying what to stockpile long term. Several thousand rounds of 5.56 and .308. Just thinking beyond that.

Lighten up dudes.
I shook one off when I was 9, I think I weighed 50 lbs at the time, still have the scar.

I'll guarantee that my brother hasn't forgotten muzzle control

Last edited by Sharkbait; 10-21-2019 at 03:28 PM.. Reason: brother
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Old 10-21-2019, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post
Jesus, great discussion! Lots of serious, tough hombres on this board.

Please tell me, dear internet friends, who is the first volunteer to approach my house and shake off a 22LR round and prove how ineffective it is in stopping Joe farmer from ransacking my place.

Granted, I would consider a 300yd shot challenging with any caliber, 22LR more so. I'm really trying what to stockpile long term. Several thousand rounds of 5.56 and .308. Just thinking beyond that.

Lighten up dudes.
This board is filled with cops and military with downrange time.

You picked the wrong forum to try to talk smack in.

300 yard shot? Give me an AR and preteen girl and I'll have her hitting upper torso shots all day long by the second day.

An AR is a laser beam at that range. If you can't hit at 300yds then it is an operator flaw.
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Old 10-21-2019, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post
Jesus, great discussion! Lots of serious, tough hombres on this board.



Please tell me, dear internet friends, who is the first volunteer to approach my house and shake off a 22LR round and prove how ineffective it is in stopping Joe farmer from ransacking my place.



Granted, I would consider a 300yd shot challenging with any caliber, 22LR more so. I'm really trying what to stockpile long term. Several thousand rounds of 5.56 and .308. Just thinking beyond that.



Lighten up dudes.
Nightvisionary?

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
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Old 10-21-2019, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fragnar View Post
Nightvisionary?

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
Thatís what Iím thinking.
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Old 10-21-2019, 03:16 PM
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Joe Farmer ain't the problem. The problems will be with narco gangs, who ain't gonna be deterred by a measly .22 rimfire.

I used to poo-poo the idea that SHTF was gonna be Armageddon, but looking at what's happening in Venezuela has made me think again. SHTF isn't gonna be total wipeout of all energy sources, immobilizing the looters, it's gonna be a slow breakdown, in which the gangs will have the means to travel and loot at will. They won't be armed with .22s.
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Old 10-21-2019, 03:42 PM
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I personally choose the .17 HMR
by volume I can carry more ammo that has a reach 2x that of .22
by accuracy it is far more accurate than most other rounds
Not being as popular as other rounds .
Great for small game ,seeing there won't be much large game post SHTF. though it is capable of taking deer.
Unlike other rounds it fractures making it a more dangerous round to be hit by.
@ 2550 FPS and a small projectile , it will still decimate a 8x8x16 cement block in 3 shots.
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Old 10-21-2019, 07:05 PM
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I think most of us here own a 22 lr and are aware of its positives and negatives. there is always a troll or arm chair warrior who thinks it is better than it is. i look at 22 lr as a fine 50 yd weapon. I can be pressed to do more but why? 22 mag or hornet will add another 50 yards to that projectile size and make a fine varment/small game round in the 50 to 100 yd range. The 223 wins up to 400 yards. Now how many people can hit a target at 400 yards? Maybe we should spend less time beating the nubie or letting the troll controls us and spend time on more important things. I'd like to see some facts and opinions on Barnes copper vrs Hornaday gilding metal projectiles.
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Old 10-21-2019, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterbuzz View Post
Point taken ajole.
I would just add that AR's are about as cheap as they'll ever be right now.
It's a great time to add a supremely effective SD/HD weapon for <$500.

They're a great investment, and with a 22LR kit you can actually use it for rimfire too.

Here's an example, though shop around and watch the sales and you might be able to beat that too. Palmetto State Armory is always a good place to watch.

https://gun.deals/product/ati-omni-h...l-30rd-mag-399

https://gun.deals/product/del-ton-ec...ady-mlok-39999

https://gun.deals/product/ruger-ar-5...elect-red-dots

https://palmettostatearmory.com/

(Not endorsing, supporting, supported by, or otherwise affiliated with the above. Just posting as examples.)
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