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Old 08-01-2019, 11:20 AM
arleigh arleigh is offline
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Is it reasonable to assume that those that intend on doing harm have some training as well ?
To assume a criminal is ignorant and bad shot is foolish to say the least .
The only solution is armed citizens who are trained and can anticipate trained assailants.
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Old 08-01-2019, 12:10 PM
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ROCK6 ROCK6 is offline
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Is it reasonable to assume that those that intend on doing harm have some training as well ?
To assume a criminal is ignorant and bad shot is foolish to say the least .
The only solution is armed citizens who are trained and can anticipate trained assailants.
I think it's a very prudent assumption, but many talk about being attacked by a rogue platoon of Force Recon SPECOPS snipers to support their weapons choice or defensive measures necessary to survive. I understand that you can't just assume Barny Fife will be attacking you in his birthday suit, but your planning does require balance and realistic expectations. Very few criminals use tactics or posses above average skills in current attacks and assaults; however, it doesn't take a trained and experienced sniper to get in close and take shots at you if you're not being aware of your surroundings.

Even an untrained group of attackers can get lucky. You should train as realistic as you can and incorporate tactics with your marksmanship training and associated drills. You can't account for the skill level of potential threats, but you can train how you react (or better yet, preempt). to potential threats.

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Old 08-01-2019, 01:19 PM
America's Patriot America's Patriot is offline
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What does it mean "gun-allowed zones"? Do you mean outside? Also, do they consider the stipulations? I mean, if you're a licensed peace officer or have a conceal carry... but in most states, how easy is it to get a concealed license? So "gun-allowed zones at 70%" could mean nothing in the grander scope of things.

I have a problem with most researches because if they are biased, they get to determine what their criteria are and sway the results in one way or another. Even an unbiased one can get screwed up if they don't consider some factors.

Common sense would tell you that if you had 30 people in a crowd that were proficient with a firearm and someone walked in and started shooting, at least one of those 30 people would put him down quick. If only one person in the crowd had a firearm, that armed perp has the potential of killing everyone, including the one person with a firearm. It's really not rocket science and you don't have to be a mathematician to see the numbers.
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Old 08-01-2019, 03:35 PM
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ForgedInTheFlame ForgedInTheFlame is offline
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Not the way I was trained or indoctrinated.

"...and complete the mission, though I be the lone survivor".

"Surrender is not a ranger word..."

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I knew I had a gem in here.

Well said FITF.

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Old 08-01-2019, 03:38 PM
arleigh arleigh is offline
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I think that in that scenario you'd have 30 people aiming at a perp having drawn his gun out, not one .
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Old 08-01-2019, 06:35 PM
ajole ajole is online now
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Just because itís neat...in Utah, teachers with a regular carry permit can carry at work. I know of 5 of us with permits, 3 regularly carry.

But our thing is hide-fight-run. We donít want a bunch of people running the wrong way and getting shot because we told them to run, so we secure doors hide out of sight lines, and prepare to defend, or run.
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Old 08-01-2019, 07:49 PM
Trebuchet Trebuchet is offline
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My employers training video includes hitting the shooter with a fire extinguisher after you cant run or hide. Also tells you to leave everyone behind and save yourself
We must use the same video where I work.
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Old 08-03-2019, 10:34 AM
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Just because itís neat...in Utah, teachers with a regular carry permit can carry at work. I know of 5 of us with permits, 3 regularly carry.

But our thing is hide-fight-run. We donít want a bunch of people running the wrong way and getting shot because we told them to run, so we secure doors hide out of sight lines, and prepare to defend, or run.
Our school district hasn't allowed teachers to carry yet, but my wife has been identified as one they would want to carry in her school. Interesting though on the hide-fight-run. My wife's latest training is that if they can get word an active shooter is on the other side of the school in a different wing, they are encourage to run. Their plan is to get outside and run into a wooded area and designated rally point with the ability to take the kids deeper into the woods if necessary. The challenge is intel, and they have access to the school cameras via the web and an system to quickly report potential threats in specific areas of the school.

As is, my wife is on the second floor and was given permission to eventually get a drop ladder or even a rope to escape out the window. They upgraded the manual door locks and my wife practices every year with her kids on actions for active shooters.

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Old 08-03-2019, 11:34 AM
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It sounds like this training is geared towards children and pacifists...which isn't necessarily a bad thing. I never attended a run, hide, fight training session. It sounds as if it would have been interesting.


Although it was well know that a number of employees were carrying concealed while at work. We did millions a week in business, so I naturally assumed it had more to do with the threat of robbery than dealing with an armed and disgruntled employee.


One day I was informed by my boss that if I wanted to I could keep a weapon in my vehicle which was parked about 20 feet from my work station. So yeah...if you are wondering. I took him up on that offer. I'm retired now, so it's water under the bridge.
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