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Old 02-11-2014, 11:27 PM
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CrypticCRICKET CrypticCRICKET is offline
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I would guess that FEMA will quickly make promises that they can't possibly keep or people will quickly hear rumors of government assistance if they travel to govt. relief camps.
Most urban people will probably commit to the "easy cheese" by becoming a govt. sustained refugee and hopefully that means that they'll become someone else's problem by going somewhere else.

I fortunately have the experience and the ability and the tools to harvest seafood and game and wild edibles and I also live in one of the richest and most diverse natural ecosystems in the U.S. As a result it makes no sense to leave just because the fast and easy food ran out. I'll probably be surrounded by other self sufficient people if the grid ever goes down long term because the dependent people will leave or die quickly.

A widespread ecological disaster that destroys the entire food chain, long term, and also drops the entire grid = I'm screwed. Doubt I would survive whatever dropped the food chain. If I did survive, it wouldn't be for long hopefully.
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Old 02-11-2014, 11:35 PM
arleigh arleigh is offline
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I would assume that the government will see to it, that the starvation is drug out just as far as possible .
This would insure that any food that was being stored would have been consumed as well, either by poor planing or theft or confiscation , not sure there's a difference.
Gardening may to be under attack more so than it is been seen now. Officially.
Fighting over access to a garden prematurely might also be a problem even with on one's own group.
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Old 02-12-2014, 02:31 AM
Kansas Terri Kansas Terri is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Southpaw69 View Post
By far, the biggest industry in California is agriculture. I think the main problem for people would be clean water.
Well, the farms out there have been shorted on irrigation water for years so it produces less now. Also and more importantly California mostly produces vegetables and vegetables are low calorie.

Yes I know they also produce dairy, beef an a little rice but they do not produce enough calories to sustain the huge population for long.
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Old 02-12-2014, 02:52 AM
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Just have some big pants and shirt handy and put them on when you answer the door, if they ask for food tell them your out and when they see the baggy cloths on you it will look like your getting thin from not eating, just don't make it look to obvious. That's if you answer the door at all.
Answer the door with a ham sammage in hand and its game over hahaha...
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Old 02-12-2014, 02:57 AM
Nightwind Nightwind is offline
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With moderate activity and Zero food (only water) you will loose approx. 3kg per week or a pound a day! and that will taper off a bit as the weeks pass!

How much overweight are you???????

A prime athelete with minimal body fat will take only several weeks to be on the brink of death.
A fat fart may take 6 months or more to be on the brink but that maybe cut short by other things like vitamin defiencies! and damaged organs failing!

At the start most dying will be from misadventure from trying to secure food!
then the starving kicks in and those with existing health problems start poping there clogs!

First 6 weeks deaths will be from violence
next 6months violence will subside and starvation will be the main killer until more food comes available!
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Old 02-12-2014, 03:06 AM
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Not Fat at all hahaha.
My nephew played hockey in Australia Not so long ago, a month or so, cant remember the team tho will look it up.

He played for the Perth Thunder. 2013 had 46 points.
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Old 02-12-2014, 03:09 AM
George Newbill George Newbill is offline
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I think that 70 days will be about it.
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:19 AM
OliverR. OliverR. is offline
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I'd be more worried about the hungry people than anything.

Imagine a shtf scenario with the stores cleaned out and nothing is moving. I'd guess the avarage family has a week or two before they are out of food. Some sooner some later.

What will happen to avarage joe who kids have not eaten in 4 days, and smells that can of DintyMore your heating up?

And I wouldn't assume they would "fade into the sunset." People will survive even if it means cannibalization. Technically they would eat pretty good!

Something else to worry about
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:32 AM
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minneso...ion_Experiment

And


Are interesting...
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Old 02-12-2014, 12:19 PM
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The big problem will come from authorities. Mayor, city council, nat guard, etc. will want to begin a mandatory food turn-in/seizure program early on. Their driving thought will be self-survival, using their power to seize food, using hungry people as the excuse. You will find it easier to survive a hungry neighbor than a convoy of self-appointed marshals intent on seizing everyone's food, if you resist, so much the better, because now its your fault you got shot.
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Old 02-12-2014, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OliverR. View Post
I'd be more worried about the hungry people than anything.
They'll be easy to fend off. Just don't get too bloated on Spam and beans.
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Old 02-12-2014, 01:11 PM
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I think the concentration camps (work type) probably are the most realistic model we have for determining longevity under severe malnutrition coupled with physical exertion. The ones who survived were fortunate enough to hang on until liberation, usually because they had spent less time in the prison, i.e. the newer prisoners.

One thing I never see discussed is what about all the rotting corpses? Even with some distance away from the worst areas you could still be effected by the abnormal increase in flies.

If you look deep into history, even early Biblical times, you'll find mass migrations of peoples away from their home region to areas of available food. With masses of people moving into strange areas you're going to have friction. Its just how humans are.

A pretty ugly picture but if you're physically and psychologically prepared for it you'll be the better off for it. And after all isn't that why we participate in these forums??

In the background of this discussion I hear Axel Rose singing "Welcome to the Jungle".
Welcome to the jungle it gets worse here every day
Ya learn to live like an animal in the jungle where we play
If you hunger for what you see you'll take it eventually
You can have everything you want but you better not take it from me
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Old 02-12-2014, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Common-Sense View Post
Okay, so, there is no food in the stores and the gas supply has been used up. How long before everyone "around me" dies, with a mouth full of grass, thinking that will keep them from starving to death?

I ask this because if something serious does happen, people are going to be wandering around for a while and you will have to fend off the neighbors for "x" amount of time before they go away.....So, being that you were able to trick them away long enough to croak, god rest thier soul, how long would that take in the real world, with them eating bark and what not?

Any good ways to throw them off track so they think your starving like them and move on?

Well, imo, you're dictating one scenario where everyone is just sitting around and starving.

Humans have tendency to organize and group together.

Folks in Katrina survived by grouping together and pooling resources and such.

These are things you should be doing now- have a plan. Look at all water sources and see what food is there( fish, snails, turtles and birds, etc), look a parks and woods for sources of food( squirrel and birds). In Urban, you have boo coo buildings to search and scavenge. Animals like cats ad dogs and snakes and birds, etc.

With diligence and planning and practice, no one should be eating grass.

If folks come to you, put them to work getting water and food or defense.
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Old 02-12-2014, 03:00 PM
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Keep in mind that if there is no food there is a good chance there is no potable water. Its not likely that the utilites will continue to fuction when there is no food. Most people are clueless when it comes to water. Many will think they can boil any water they find and it will be safe to drink. I give it about two months for the majority of those who are going to die to die.

If there is no food where you are people will attempt to travel to wherever the rumor say there is relief. As these people head out of town or city no one staying behind will be motivated to stop them. Understand in the East there are no water sources that are safe to drink without treatment. (talking streams ponds rivers ect.) People will die from water borne diseases or the lack of water long before they will starve.
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Old 02-12-2014, 10:49 PM
Common-Sense Common-Sense is offline
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My honest scenario would be that things slowly get tight over time. Its gonna be a slow transition, but, bottom line is, still, you dont let people know what you have. I am in an area where wells are norm, even though there is city water to most, so, people with wells are numerous, enough to void the water issue. What requirement comes next is food. This is something most do NOT have, and or prepared for. Sure, they will have thier garden supplies and food ration stamps, but, its gonna be hard AND "if" things do dry up, one needs to be prepared for a dry-up scenario, hence my original goofy question "no food".

There wuill be many scenarios that could happen and I am loing at them all, least trying to. I assume where i will be living, not in the city and 10-15 miles out in somewhat expanded land, people will want to do something. I am trying to figure what a house per 2 acre area scenario will produce in a bad scenario. n that scneario, they are not gonna group in a field together and I doubt people know enough about each other to want to group or have the idea to group, so, they will either go roaming or high tail it into FEMA/the city.
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Old 02-12-2014, 11:30 PM
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The short answer is it's going to take months. People won't be 100% without food. They'll find some here and there even if it means cannibalism.

I think a major thing people seem to not want to deal with is that in a famine, you need to cut your calories too. Just because you have lots of food doesn't mean you should be stuffing your face like back in the day when food was unlimited. Preppers shouldn't be fat during a famine either.

Stretch your resources, get yourself slimmer and meaner, and lose some weight. Maybe not as much weight as your neighbors, but by the time they notice the difference they'll be too weak and psychologically disorganized to be nearly as much of a threat, and you going from obese to fit and lean will mean you're more capable of defending yourself. A famine is a great time to go on a diet.

That said, I think governments will tell people to go TO the cities to get free food, and people will do it. Even if there's not remotely enough food for everyone. They'll just fight over the scraps being thrown out of the helicopters and off of trucks. If they're not fighting over resources at a FEMA camp (such as the superdome during Katrina), they'll be too weakened and overwhelmed with starvation and despair to leave their homes. They'll sit and cry about it until they starve to death, or even kill themselves to end the hunger.

Does that mean there won't be people invading your home trying to rob you of food? Certainly not, but if you live in a suburb of 20,000 you're not going to be dealing with 20,000 people trying to bust in to your house. 20 maybe spread over half a dozen attacks, but not 20,000. The other thing to take in to consideration is that people are far more likely to try to trick you into an ambush than to just kick in the door. Why kick in the door when you can just knock and stick a concealed knife or gun in the gut of whoever opens it?
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Old 02-12-2014, 11:52 PM
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The smell. You cook your food others will smell it too.


However, in history most people become too weak by the time they are desperate enough to try and take your food.

Of course there are those that won't be too weak wait
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Old 02-13-2014, 12:59 AM
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[Anecdote flag on]
...
Back in my high school days, I knew a lass who fasted for one month, during the summer, and lost 100 lbs.
...
When she came back in the fall, she was unrecognizable.
...
Assuming a 2.5 - 4 lb loss (depending on activity) for each day of fasting, you can extrapolate from there.
...
A morbidly obese 400 lb sedentary person might endure 3 months of no food.
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Old 02-13-2014, 02:08 AM
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I saw a lady at the doctors office today, and she looked like she could survive a whole year off of body fat alone.
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Old 02-13-2014, 04:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vol 4 life View Post
I have often heard that if there were to be a total collapse of the power grid that there might be as much as a 90% die off in only 3 months. Some say even less time.

,,,,,,,,,,,,
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