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Old 08-23-2012, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by OkieOutlaw View Post
I will admit that I was a little sceptical at first, but as it was an anniversary gift from my wife I surely was NOT going to complain in any way. It was only after handling and shooting it that I became totally satisfied with her choice and appreciate the weapon more and more.
my lord your wife is a keeper buying a gun for you.
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Old 08-23-2012, 04:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Unobtanium View Post
Can you take a picture of the castle-nut on both weapons, and the gas-key staking on both weapons, and post them for us? That will tell us a great deal about this last in red.
Honestly, I don't get really excited about either one of those things much anymore. I own a MOACKS and invested $10 in a Harbor Freight Auto Punch for castle nuts. If you can't fix those two minor issues yourself....should you even own guns at all?
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:15 AM
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I totally agree with Lawyerman.
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Old 08-24-2012, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Lawyerman View Post
Honestly, I don't get really excited about either one of those things much anymore. I own a MOACKS and invested $10 in a Harbor Freight Auto Punch for castle nuts. If you can't fix those two minor issues yourself....should you even own guns at all?
Sounds like a solid way to go. I still am a bit finicky over chambers, though. I prefer a true 5.56 chamber, and the only way to get that reliably is with a reamer or by going with a reputable manufacturer KNOWN to turn them out.

For a plinker, that's all that I think matters, really. 5.56 chamber so you can shoot XM193 in it with less chance of popping primers if you get some hot stuff, (one of Pat Rogers classes saw new Federal XM193 consistently measuring 68,000psi once they measured it when they grew suspicious. In a .223 chamber, this could be a real issue.), and properly staked items as mentioned, which your tools above take care of just fine.
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Old 08-24-2012, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Unobtanium View Post
Sounds like a solid way to go. I still am a bit finicky over chambers, though. I prefer a true 5.56 chamber, and the only way to get that reliably is with a reamer or by going with a reputable manufacturer KNOWN to turn them out.

For a plinker, that's all that I think matters, really. 5.56 chamber so you can shoot XM193 in it with less chance of popping primers if you get some hot stuff, (one of Pat Rogers classes saw new Federal XM193 consistently measuring 68,000psi once they measured it when they grew suspicious. In a .223 chamber, this could be a real issue.), and properly staked items as mentioned, which your tools above take care of just fine.
Agreed. I won't run a .223 chamber or a non chrome lined bore, period. I spend money on the "important stuff". I don't care what name or logo is on the lower etc...(In fact, dirty little secret? I've built a bunch of guns on DPMS lowers- I love the color of their finish and they always go together without a hitch and I was buying them for $99 apiece tax and all).....but the bolt carrier, bolt, barrel- I NEVER skimp on that stuff.

You bring up another good point though. Even ammo that is supposed to be "good ammo" "milspec, brass case, major American manufacturer" etc....You never know exactly what you are getting. I was at a shotgun class with Louis Awerbuck last year and on day two we were shooting buckshot at plates. Guy had a sealed case of Speer Lawman buckshot- blue hulls- good stuff generally. He's loading his gun and happens to notice that one of the rounds is a damn SLUG! Exact same color hull etc...the four other rounds in that box were buck etc....Same class. Guy pulls out a 50 round box of Remington UMC- yellow box 9mm. The cartridges looked like the Rocky Mountains- cartridge lengths all over the map- factory ammo from a sealed case. You just never know.
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Old 08-28-2012, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Lawyerman View Post
Honestly, I don't get really excited about either one of those things much anymore. I own a MOACKS and invested $10 in a Harbor Freight Auto Punch for castle nuts. If you can't fix those two minor issues yourself....should you even own guns at all?
You make a valid point as far as having the tools and skills necessary to make repairs, but you need to ask yourself, if they can't do something as simple as staking a couple of bolts, what else are they cutting corners on?

To me that is the equivalent of an auto manufacturer not tightening the lug nuts on the wheels before they ship out their vehicles. Would you bring a torque wrench with you when you bought a new car?
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Old 08-28-2012, 01:51 PM
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Old 08-28-2012, 09:51 PM
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Originally Posted by luke_a View Post
You make a valid point as far as having the tools and skills necessary to make repairs, but you need to ask yourself, if they can't do something as simple as staking a couple of bolts, what else are they cutting corners on?

To me that is the equivalent of an auto manufacturer not tightening the lug nuts on the wheels before they ship out their vehicles. Would you bring a torque wrench with you when you bought a new car?
That's a fair question. Unless you have a laboratory you don't really know.

Did they use Carpenter 158 for the bolt head? Why the hell are we even using Carpenter 158 anymore- that's the same milspec as 1964- there's nothing better?

We haven't learned anything about the platform since then? Like the fact that the tiny bolt lugs are a real liability, like the bolts routinely fail at the extractor cut and at the cam hole.....is there a way to fix that or do we just keep blowing bolts at 10-15,000 rounds?

Personally, I think there are good reasons NOT to stake a castle nut at the factory. The "take off" stock bin at my local gunshop is full of them! Fully half the guys that buy a rifle one of the first things they do these days is change the buttstock. Now, grinding the stake out isn't that big of a deal....but not having to do it just to change out the stock, ain't a bad thing either. All my guns are staked- but then I have them set up the way I want them at this point.

On the gas key- NO EXCUSE for not doing that at the factory. Unfortunately there are quite a few companies that otherwise produce decent rifles that do this. That's why the MOACKS etc...are so popular. Again, this is also something that has become more well known only in the last 5-6 years. For a long time- you NEVER heard a thing about carrier key staking unless you attended an armorers class etc....Users learn, they demand changes, the platform advances.....everything gets better.

Personally I find it funny that we have such little things to bitch about. Twenty years ago you had exactly three, maybe four choices in AR15's and that was it- and Colt, now always a "First Tier" gun, was producing some of the crappiest guns they had ever made- full of "non milspec" parts (the horror!)- going bankrupt etc.....

Now they sell 3 different brands at Walmart and all we can do is bitch about who doesn't park under the front sight tower! That's not to say things can't get better and we shouldn't push for that but I think a lot of people (for whom it will NEVER really matter) spend a lot more time and money on this stuff than they need to. My thought? Buy what you want, what will work for you, shoot it until it breaks (this will cost you $2-5k with current ammo costs) if you can afford that much ammo, you can afford a new rifle at that point and will probably be in a position to really use and understand- benefit from- the "improved" rifle.
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Old 08-29-2012, 08:56 AM
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Sounds like Lawyerman has been around almost long as me. I can totally agree with what he is talking about here. Thanks Gladius for that great vid, I love this new gun and know I have a quality weapon so who cares what anyone one else thinks but its good to see positive feedback on it and I actually learned a couple of things too.
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Old 08-29-2012, 01:10 PM
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I will also add that I spoke with a company rep this morning and he tells me that using steel cased ammo in your WW rifle will NOT void the warranty. Some have asked me about this so I contacted them to get their position on the use of the ammo. They do recommend that you clean your rifle regularly if using steel to avoid stuck cases, especially when going from steel to brass -- which is true of any AR15 type rifle.
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Old 08-29-2012, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Doc_Shane View Post
I've handled one and I am very impressed with it over all,didn't get to shoot it but it appears to be well put together.
Maybe the employees learned from the mistakes of the previous management and improved the quality?
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Old 08-29-2012, 04:25 PM
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Forgot to mention earlier but a few other deputies and I went out to the Sheriff's dept range this past weekend just for some informal target practice and general plinking just to have a good time. As deputies we have the privelidge of using the range anytime we want as long as we clean up after ourselves. I even have my own key. Anyway we put lots of ammo downrange and had a really good time. Between myself and others that wanted to try out my new gun I am now up to a little over 1,000 flawless rounds without cleaning other than running a brush through the bore and lubing the bolt. We got her pretty warm a few times and she took it all in stride. I am getting more impressed with every trip. She kinda had the center of attention as it is the first any of us had seen or handled to any extent. To say they were impressed would be an understatement. No one even bothered to shoot my Colt LE6920 at all during this shoot. Windham might even sell another rifle or two to my buddies or so they said.
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Old 09-04-2012, 10:56 AM
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Default Range report update.

Well the gang and I got together again over the Labor Day weekend. ( Hope everyone had a good one.) We all gathered up down on the river for a BarBQue and just to have a good time and bust some primers with the wives and kids. We all had a great time and donated lots of lead to the river gods. Together we put around 500 more rounds through the rifle with still no malfunctions at all. So far she has shot my reloads as well as every factory loading imaginable all without a single problem. I am really impressed with this little rifle. Over 1500 rounds and counting...
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Old 09-04-2012, 01:52 PM
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I just picked one up. I can't wait to go shoot the thing but this thing called work currently has my attention..

I also put a reflex sight on mine, no iron sights, or any sights for that matter, were included. That's fine with me though, I'd rather not pay for something that I'll end up replacing anyways.
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Old 09-05-2012, 11:57 AM
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Default The really nice thing

The really nice thing is that out of those range / plinking sessions I added around 2,000 rounds of once fired brass to my stash. Good Luck with your new rifle there Onealx4. Mine was equiped the same way but I already had a 2.5x10 scope I planned on using on it, and after a few minutes shoppin on Fleabay I purchased both a folding front and a rear backup set of sites for it too, Now if the kindly old mail man will ever deliver my new quadrail I will be in business for sure.
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Old 09-09-2012, 08:44 AM
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I took Wednesday off work and went to the range. I just can't let a new rifle just sit in the box so I had to get to the range and check it out.

I love this rifle.

I only brought the 5 boxes of ammo I bought when I got the rifle. I have one round left. The one round would of also been fired had it not been for the fact that it jumped out of its box and hid down in the bottom of my ammo can.

This is an excellent "entry" level rifle. I think "entry" is a huge understatement though, its a really nice rifle.
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Old 09-09-2012, 10:26 PM
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Glad you like yours as much as I do mine. If I ever get all this dang brass loaded back up I plan on shootin the hell out of her again. Between work and reloading not much time for shootin. LMAO>
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Old 09-18-2012, 07:22 PM
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Default Finally !!!

Well guys I finally got all that hoarded brass loaded. Man it takes a while to load up 1,948 rounds of once fired brass on a old RCBS single stage. I think I did pretty good though considering the number of guys that have gone to cheapo steel case stuff. I ended up mostly with LC, Rem, and PMC with a few hundred Fed thrown in for good measure. Sure knocked a hole in my stored up reloading components though, I would much rather have all the fresh loaded ammo. Been putting lots more rounds down the tube on the new rifle though and all without a single malfunction of any kind at all. I did manage to sell a couple more of these guns to my friends and so far theirs are running good also.
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Old 09-18-2012, 07:45 PM
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Looks like just any other AR FIT, FORM and, FUNCTION.

What, is the price only higher?
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Old 09-19-2012, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Musibike View Post
Looks like just any other AR FIT, FORM and, FUNCTION.

What, is the price only higher?

Not higher at all or else I dont think my wife would have given me yet another ar for our anniversary. She bought it at our local WalMart and the price was $799.00. I already own 2 Colt LE 6920 as well as a complete DPMS upper. I had looked at this gun before and thought it was quite well made and better than most in the F&F catagory. I was truly surprised when I found it lying in my bed the night of our 36th anniversary. I have a little over 2500 trouble free rounds through the tube now and am even more impressed with the quality as well as her judgement. She has even come around and really enjoys shooting this gun and laughing claims it as her new gun now. It really does make a nice match for her EDC Glock 26.
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