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Old 11-12-2011, 03:00 PM
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Ok everyone, you have to let me know when I need to stop, ok??
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Old 11-12-2011, 03:02 PM
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Christie this is for you about Bourgas.

It's a really nice town, with old bits and new bits. Good shopping, relaxed, has one or two universities, lots of eateries.

Right near Bourgas there are other beaches, but I actually prefer the beach at Bourgas, it's where the locals go, the tourists go to Sunny Beach and Sozopol, Sveti Vlas and Slancho Briag, and those places look and feel really touristy. Most tourists don't go to the Bourgas beach.

The Sand at Bourgas is grey/black with lots of mica glitter in it, so it sparkles, and it's incredibly soft, it's velvety. The temperature of the water is great, not too warm and not too cold. It usually has a stiff breeze, which is actually very pleasant. At the edge of the beach farthest away from the water is where the restaurants are, the food and drinks are great and cheap.

You'll see lots of parasols along the beach, you rent these from the restaurants, includes beach chair and I recommend them, it is much more comfortable and allows you to get out of the sun when you want. And it's great when you can lounge on the chair and they bring you your mohito.

Incidentally, it is actually really therapeutic to go to the beach, aside from being very relaxing, the waters is really good for your skin. I had lots of small cuts on my legs from working in the garden, and they just didn't heal very fast. Next day after the beach they were all gone and my skin felt and looked really nice.


Right beyond the bicycle path are the "sea gardens" which is a long strip of park with really nice gardens, fountains and other kinds of features, lots of trees, very cool and calming right next to the hot beach.

In the off season it's also really nice, off seasons starts end of September and ends towards mid May. It's great to walk along the beach with your pooch.

Here are some videos for you,

cycling through Bourgas

Bourgas coastline

sailing along bourgas

Last edited by Daisy; 11-12-2011 at 03:35 PM.. Reason: added somethign
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Old 11-12-2011, 03:05 PM
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There's some really good skiing in Bulgaria and it too is very cheap.

The two best places are Bansko and Borovets, but there are several other places as well.

These places are nice in summer too, but obviously won't have the tourism then.

Here are some videos so you can get an idea

skiing at Bansko

Skiing at Borovets
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Old 11-12-2011, 03:16 PM
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For those of you who like to fish, this is also a great area for fishing, lots of lakes and streams. Mainly carp and trout, although at this link (http://www.informationbulgaria.com/f..._bulgaria.html ) they give a huge list of the types of fish which can be caught here

Many guys love fishing here, and Bulgarians do like Carp. I never used to like it, but my neighbour Penka makes it and it's lovely.

Anyways, here's someone catching a trout


Here's some carp that are bloody outrageous
http://www.bulgariafishing.com/
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Old 11-12-2011, 03:19 PM
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Because we have so many different types of mountains here, we have a lot of mountain biking and climbing.


When I saw the next video, it made me realize that actually a BOL IS accessible with a bike, I reckon most people wouldn't think of coming to find you with a bike :D
http://video.mpora.com/watch/T9NHm983d/
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Old 11-12-2011, 03:27 PM
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I'd mentioned to you all before that people really do like their Rakia (home made whiskey) here. It's usually made from either grapes or plums, which grow in vast quantities here.

A few months before distilation, all the fruit is put in vats. It becomes a brown slurry, when the time is right, it gets brought to the distilling shed/house in the village, and poured into copper containers and then there is a complex (for me) system whereby magically out of some other vat with a little pipe, this clear liquid comes out. The first bit tends to be the strongest, and they put that aside for "medicinal" purposes, the rest is then put in other vats and taken home either by car or horsecart. The liquid is colorless, so what they do is take slivers of oak and put it in the vats with the rakia, this makes it caramel color over time.

For any of you who ever might make it over here, you will have many offers of rakia. I find it is fine when you drink it, but the next day, you'll notice all your brain cells are stuck to your skull and it feels all empty inside.

Here's an example of tooo much rakia
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Old 11-12-2011, 04:06 PM
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omg those 2 guys were hysterical!!!!!!!

ty for all the links Daisy, it really looks like a beautiful place
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Old 11-12-2011, 04:15 PM
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Thanks Mourka, I really really do love it here.
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Old 11-12-2011, 04:38 PM
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Ok folks, one last link for today, this will explain why it's such a good BOL.

http://expatbulgaria.com/en/bulgarianvillage.php

nighty nighty!
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Old 11-12-2011, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by felicia View Post
Daisy,

I looked at the houses on the website you provided.

It looks almost everyone has water damage ?

It looks like almost everyone will need a kitchen revamp ?

What would be the cost of fixing water damage ?

What would be the cost of revamping a kitchen ?

What would this conversion equal in square feet 240m2
Yes, most of the older village homes have no insulation, and they don't use damp coursing here. This is why you will see two floors, the bottom one being more or less of a cellar for storage, and the top one is where they live. Also, older folks often live in the "summer kitchen" which is a seperate smaller house. Also, many don't have bathroom, but an outhouse.

Please understand that these village homes will be nothing like what you are used to in UK or US. There is not the concept of living room, dining room, bedroom. Every room is a miscellaneous room, and they normally all have beds in them. This is so that people can stay over. The kitchens are TINY.

Having said that, for one year I lived in our summer kitchen, which had not been renovated. It was very cozy. Very simple, but I felt very comfy in it.

These houses will need major overhaul. Our house was bought for about 10,000 GBP (approx $16,000) and we spent an additional GBP 15,000 for the following
roof taken off and new roof and tiles
inside walls broken and new rooms made
all windows replaced with double glazed windows
Insulation on outside of house and rendered
whole house rewired
whole house replumbed
kitchen put in
bathroom put in
bathroom tiled fully
kitchen tiled
hallway tiled
laminate in living, dining and bedroom
rooms plasted and painted
skirting boards put in
new wood doors put in
boiler put in
Aircon put it
built in ceiling lights in every room
house is about 60 sqm
Has entry hall, large-ish living dining/room, bedroom, large bathroom, kitchen.

It is an adorable little house. People who come visit from the UK really like it.

That was in 2007. Prices have gone up, but it looks like they are coming down again. I think the material costs will have gone up somewhat.

You should count on any one of those houses that they will need a lot of work. My friends Sandy and Andy came over in 2007 and they did theirs themselves. He took it slow and they are really happy. It's more or less done, he just put a new roof on this summer and extended it some, so he now has a bigger space in the loft, he's currently working on making that into a room and just got the plasterboard and insulation today. He never runs out of ideas, he's going to make a long porch along one side of the house next summer. Two years ago, he built a really nice barbeque area.

You can also look for a newly built house, you'll find some of them have reduced greatly in price.

If you pm me and let me know your budget and what kind of area you want to live in, and what you like the look of so far, I can possibly help you find something that works for you or at least give you some more pointers, things to look for and ways to bargain.
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Old 11-12-2011, 06:43 PM
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Felicia, these two look ok

9,000 Euros
http://www.bulgarianrealestateonline...407/Itemid,29/

GBP 15,400
http://expatbulgaria.com/en/offer_pics.php?offer=332

You'll still need to do some work but it's not as major as some of them.
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Old 11-12-2011, 10:04 PM
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Thanks Daisy! I really like reading this thread. Keep it up!

So you like your area. Can you tell us more about what day to day life is for you there in your specific area? People you see, what to do...all of it.
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Old 11-12-2011, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Daisy View Post
yes, gun violence is very low here. It IS possible to get a gun and license (as per previous post but I will get more up to date information and also let you all know what is available)

Yes, there are some places with contamination, but like you said, this can be checked. And when you come and see the place you will see - there are such vast tracts of land with just nature, you can see there was no manufacturing. And by the same token there are some of the most ecologically clean areas of Europe to be found here. I will try to get more information for you on this, but from memory there are 3 places in this country where the air is some of the best in Europe, having to do with the mountain ranges and how the air moves through the country. In the old communist days, people came from all over the soviet union - here for the clean mountain air, many people with asthma and breathing difficulties came here to get relief. Also there are many mineral baths/spas that people would come to for cures for certain conditions. Many of the baths are dated but still operational. some have been made in to trendy resorts.
Sorry I have to bust you on this but it needs to get busted. I don't care about gun violence by itself. When 500 N.igerians were killed in a mass machete attack in 2010 I don't think their primary concern was the rate of gun violence.

My main concern living in bulgaria would be that after SHTF and after the Russian gangs arrived my fellow neighbors wouldn't offer any help in holding them off and the Russians (or any other better armed group) would take what they wanted.

Given that the civilian population of the USA buys 56% (2007 small arms survey) of all new manufactured firearms in the world (while the other 44% of firearms are bought by the US military, all other militaries in the world combined, all police forces in the world combined and all other civilians in the world combined) I think we can assume that after SHTF any foreign gangs that enter the USA to plunder will die quickly. If you know your neighbors would offer resistance it gives you safety in knowning that any group of invading theives would likely be killed long before they happen to find your house; however, if your neighbors are disarmed surfs, then after the gangs are done with them they will have full strength and numbers when they attack your house.

The N.igerian population has 1.5 guns per 100 people yet they manage to be very violent based on WHO data.

Bulgaria is estimated to have as many has 21 guns per 100 people by gunpolicy.org. The rate of gun ownership and violence in N.igeria shows us that you don't need very many guns in order to have out of control violence. The rate of gun ownership in china (4 guns per 100 people) shows us that a total gun ban and an authoritarian government that does whatever it wants to the people cannot even get the civilian gun possession rate below that of N.igeria. My conclusion is no amount of gun control, bans or fascist/socialist authoritarianism will ever be able to create a gun free/violence free utopia and any atempt to do so (such as the total gun ban in N.igeria or strong gun control) only results in guns being transfered into the hands of violent criminals and the good, law abiding people being disarmed.

Another thing you need to consider is that your murder rate in Bulgaria is likely to be the murder conviction rate of your country and you may think that comparing that to our "murder" rate is honest, yet it is not. Our "murder" rate that you are able to look up is actually composed of murder convictions, ciminals killed by police officers, justified self defense, unsolved murder cases that appear to be murder, and suicides in which the spouse tries to blame it on murder so that she can get life insurance all added up into an inflated number used to create the impression that there is a violent crime crisis so that police agencies can get more funding and push for more gun control.

You probably think that what appears to be a low rate of violent crime in your country has to do with tough gun control. It's not. Gun control does not ever lower violent crime rates. The low rate of violent crime in your country has to do with other factors.
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Old 11-13-2011, 02:22 AM
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Sorry I have to bust you on this but it needs to get busted. I don't care about gun violence by itself. When 500 N.igerians were killed in a mass machete attack in 2010 I don't think their primary concern was the rate of gun violence.

My main concern living in bulgaria would be that after SHTF and after the Russian gangs arrived my fellow neighbors wouldn't offer any help in holding them off and the Russians (or any other better armed group) would take what they wanted.

Given that the civilian population of the USA buys 56% (2007 small arms survey) of all new manufactured firearms in the world (while the other 44% of firearms are bought by the US military, all other militaries in the world combined, all police forces in the world combined and all other civilians in the world combined) I think we can assume that after SHTF any foreign gangs that enter the USA to plunder will die quickly. If you know your neighbors would offer resistance it gives you safety in knowning that any group of invading theives would likely be killed long before they happen to find your house; however, if your neighbors are disarmed surfs, then after the gangs are done with them they will have full strength and numbers when they attack your house.

The N.igerian population has 1.5 guns per 100 people yet they manage to be very violent based on WHO data.

Bulgaria is estimated to have as many has 21 guns per 100 people by gunpolicy.org. The rate of gun ownership and violence in N.igeria shows us that you don't need very many guns in order to have out of control violence. The rate of gun ownership in china (4 guns per 100 people) shows us that a total gun ban and an authoritarian government that does whatever it wants to the people cannot even get the civilian gun possession rate below that of N.igeria. My conclusion is no amount of gun control, bans or fascist/socialist authoritarianism will ever be able to create a gun free/violence free utopia and any atempt to do so (such as the total gun ban in N.igeria or strong gun control) only results in guns being transfered into the hands of violent criminals and the good, law abiding people being disarmed.

Another thing you need to consider is that your murder rate in Bulgaria is likely to be the murder conviction rate of your country and you may think that comparing that to our "murder" rate is honest, yet it is not. Our "murder" rate that you are able to look up is actually composed of murder convictions, ciminals killed by police officers, justified self defense, unsolved murder cases that appear to be murder, and suicides in which the spouse tries to blame it on murder so that she can get life insurance all added up into an inflated number used to create the impression that there is a violent crime crisis so that police agencies can get more funding and push for more gun control.

You probably think that what appears to be a low rate of violent crime in your country has to do with tough gun control. It's not. Gun control does not ever lower violent crime rates. The low rate of violent crime in your country has to do with other factors.
You sound really upset and like you wanna pick a fight and bust somebody.

I think there are advantages and disadvantages to gun control, but I think the main reason why crime rate is lower here, particularly in the villages, is because people are less greedy, they don't have a lot, but strangely that makes them more giving, and they have more relationships within the community because it seems to help them, so they are not eager to kill.

I'm sorry I actually lost some of my coffee on the keyboard when I read about the Russian gangs coming over.

They gonna come steal the tree stump the two guys on the bike were taking home? They're gonna come and steal Baba's Goats? Did you look on the map and see where Russia is in relation to Bulgaria?

I think you have to live here to understand.

The more I look at it, I see that different places will have different problems to contend with. I more and more look at our actual situation and see that the most likely thing that will happen here, is that people from the city will rely on the villagers to come to the market with their food, and they will barter.

It's hard work to grow stuff and keep animals. The people in the towns here know this, because they almost all of them have experienced helping out their family during summer holidays. They will either move back out to the country with their family there, or stay in the city and trade/help each other with whatever they got.

I think in this country, in the beginning when shtf, the biggest problem for ordinary people will be petty crime from the Gypsies. I used to worry about this, but I don't anymore. Recently there was an event that happened in one of the large towns - one gypsy lord had someone killed by running them over. There was a very large backlash in the whole country. Like I mentioned before, people don't like gypsies here. In a shtf scenario and I can very easily see gypsies being burned out of their settlements and made to flee. Sounds cruel, but I think that could well happen.

I'm pretty confident that in shtf scenario here, life will continue pretty much the same. Maybe there won't be TV and electricity, but even that, people would take in stride because they live so frugally and prepared already.

In the old days of communism, factories were built in big towns, along with those big old grey horrible apartment buildings. People lived in the apartments close to their work. When they got too old to work in the factory, they "retired" to just outside the city, where little village settlements were formed, and the older people would garden, raise pigs, sheep, veggies, etc. They would come in to town and bring the fresh produce to the family, and the family helped the old folks with whatever they then needed. This has carried over. Almost everyone has older relatives in the villages and these often supply stuff from the garden, even if it's unwanted these days. That may change, I think if shtf, people will be very happy to receive jars of preserves, sacks of potatoes and garlic, etc.

With regards to guns, I have numerous barter items, that if I really really needed a gun, in shtf, I would be able to get one one the black market.

I know that for many of you this seems unreal, because you live in such different circumstances. If I were living in America, I too would make weapons the first priority in my preps, because I would need to. I think when you see the videos I posted above, you can get a bit of a sense of what it's like here. The priorities here would be more to get stuff, tools that help you grow stuff better, easier, faster, and materials that you would need to make repairs or do building projects.
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Old 11-13-2011, 05:10 AM
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if the bulgarians there are other then the bulgarians here its ok
but the most former sovjets that are walking around here are troublemaking drunken thiefs
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Old 11-13-2011, 06:28 AM
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if the bulgarians there are other then the bulgarians here its ok
but the most former sovjets that are walking around here are troublemaking drunken thiefs
I'm sorry to hear that. When you say most former soviets, are you meaning only Bulgarians, or Poles, Chechs, Croats, Romanians, Serbs, Lithuanians, Latvians, etc?

If they were like that here, I would not be very happy!

I do know that there is a criminal element which exploits people here and in the rest of Europe. I know that girls get recruited to become prostitutes and used to go to Holland to work, I think they go to Belgium and Sweden now. And I had a friend in the UK who had Bulgarians working for him in building construction, and he said they were shady. I have heard of Bulgarian Scammers abroad as far as USA and they do things like cash till scamming and identity theft. They are not here, I guess because there's not much that they want here.

I also personally know numerous Bulgarians that have gone to England, Sweden, Germany, and they work hard and send money home. They are definitely not thieves and not drunks.

There IS a big "GRAY" area here in relation to "cheating the government" yet at the same time "using" the government to get what you need/want. This ties in with the very low income, that people actually cannot survive on, and seems to have started when communism collapsed.

Even the finance minister admits there is a grey economy alongside the regular economy, and mentioned that it is not ideal, but does help people keep going and to some degree does also help keep the economy going.

Also, I feel safer here in Sliven and the village, walking around at night, then I ever did anywhere else. I wouldn't do it in Sofia and Varna, because those cities have become westernized and have more street crime.
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Old 11-13-2011, 08:24 AM
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Well if any of the people who live outside of Europe ever decide to open their mind a bit...travel and stay for an extended period of time. I am from the states and I live in Slovakia and have traveled to MANY countries in Europe, including Bulgaria.

#1. Don't be such an idiot and complain about the wages here because in Central and Eastern Europe, cost of living is very low.

Teas can be purchased for 0.40 Euro Cents ($0.55)
Dinner at a nice place can cost as HIGH as 5 Euros a person, whereas in the states, (in Ca) I couldn't get a good meal at a nice place for less than $15 a person...and so on...almost everything is cheaper in Central and Eastern Europe.

As far as gun laws go...LOOK BEYOND WHAT IS ON THE NET. Most of these countries don't post their laws on the net and what I have found is that gun laws in reality are far different from the perception of Americans. For example, I have a Vz58 bought for far less than can be purchased in the US and with far less restrictions and issues than in California.

As far as Soviets...Well most of the people in other older generations 45+ are stone cold alcoholics. I have never walked in a city or a village and seen so many drunks and degenerates as I have seen in Central and Eastern Europe. But, not all people are like that. I mostly have to remind people to STFU and mind their own business because people in villages are nosy.

All this being said, it is easier for me to live here with my family than in the states. Sad to say it, but its the truth. I am educated and have a highly technical background. I got every job I applied for here, while having major issues in the states. I work for a decent company and get paid the average for my field and the cost of living in the area...

...still hate the commie mindset of the older folks here...but all in all not such a bad place...
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Old 11-13-2011, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Daisy View Post
I'm sorry to hear that. When you say most former soviets, are you meaning only Bulgarians, or Poles, Chechs, Croats, Romanians, Serbs, Lithuanians, Latvians, etc?

If they were like that here, I would not be very happy!

I do know that there is a criminal element which exploits people here and in the rest of Europe. I know that girls get recruited to become prostitutes and used to go to Holland to work, I think they go to Belgium and Sweden now. And I had a friend in the UK who had Bulgarians working for him in building construction, and he said they were shady. I have heard of Bulgarian Scammers abroad as far as USA and they do things like cash till scamming and identity theft. They are not here, I guess because there's not much that they want here.

I also personally know numerous Bulgarians that have gone to England, Sweden, Germany, and they work hard and send money home. They are definitely not thieves and not drunks.

There IS a big "GRAY" area here in relation to "cheating the government" yet at the same time "using" the government to get what you need/want. This ties in with the very low income, that people actually cannot survive on, and seems to have started when communism collapsed.

Even the finance minister admits there is a grey economy alongside the regular economy, and mentioned that it is not ideal, but does help people keep going and to some degree does also help keep the economy going.

Also, I feel safer here in Sliven and the village, walking around at night, then I ever did anywhere else. I wouldn't do it in Sofia and Varna, because those cities have become westernized and have more street crime.
the aren't all drunks
im a international truckdriver so ive seen my share off those guys
they sh1t everywhere except the toilet
they take 3 sausage's and pay 1
if the even pay at all
the most of them refuse to talk another language
the only german they can is "dies adresse" and thats it
they park and camp everywhere
and as i say former sovjet i mean the entire region
or it must be like with the turks and moroccans
that we got the a holes and the nice people stay in there country
ever since the open borders we got the feeling that we got all the trash from the east
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Old 11-13-2011, 08:41 AM
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Very interesting, but can you work there as well? I mean if the living costs are so low, what will you earn when you have to work?
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Old 11-13-2011, 09:34 AM
Daisy Daisy is offline
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Originally Posted by xdewit View Post
Very interesting, but can you work there as well? I mean if the living costs are so low, what will you earn when you have to work?
Xant
THAT is the main problem. Unless you have a business abroad or internet business, it will be difficult here. I do have a Dutch friend, who is married to a Bulgarian girl and they are doing really well, they provide products made here, to Holland, and they are maxed out with orders. But I think he would not have made it without her, she makes it possible because she is Bulgarian, knows the ways of doing things business wise, and knows the way to network to get things done.

There's in Austrian guy here, he also has something made here that he sells on line and I think he is doing quite well.

But it IS very difficult. I did say in the title of the thread that this would make a really really good BOL, a place to be when things go really bad, because you can survive here under those circumstances. Or if you are retired and have your pension.

I myself work from home for my Sister who has a company in the US, I do admin work for her. In the past year and a half I have been prepping like mad. I don't earn a lot but enough to get me by and get some prep stuff each month. There are still some things on my list, but not much anymore. I really feel like after another paycheck or so, if poop did hit the fan, I could survive on nothing because I've made it so I can be self sufficient and live quite comfortably. And I think this is also possible for others to do so here, quite comfortably.

Once you have a roof over your head, water, fuel, food, (meds if necessary) knowledge of how to do things, those are the vital elements.

And these things are not expensive or hard to get. Even if you get a place that needs work, you can do repairs over time, get the basic materials. Share resources with neighbours/friends. You'll find neighbours are very willing to help.

I certainly would not have been able to do this in Holland, England or USA, and there would have been many interventions by government alone.

The fact that it is also very beautiful here is icing on the cake. Land is fertile, there's lots of it, climate is good for growing stuff (zone 7/8), I like the people, and the healthy way of life. People are self sufficient, so there will not be hordes of people coming to your place to come after your food.
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