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Has anyone heard of Helly Tec Knives? AlphaSierraCharlie Knives, Swords & Axes 26 02-16-2019 02:48 PM
KEL TEC PMR-30 22WMR 4.3" Pistol (NAVY BLUE) Cope's Distribuitng Cope's Distributing 0 02-01-2017 12:56 PM

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Old 02-04-2017, 07:48 PM
JEEPEXPLORER JEEPEXPLORER is offline
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what do you guys think o the Kel Tec rile the su 16 and the carbine the sub 2000?
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Old 02-04-2017, 08:03 PM
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I have not had the opportunity to shoot one. But I have heard, for what its worth, that the barrel is very thin and it gets hot quickly. That would limit the amount of rapid fire groups of shots that could be sent down range from it.
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Old 02-04-2017, 08:16 PM
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I had a 1st gen Sub2k with the Glock 9mm magwell - it performed flawlessly for years after I broke it in. I probably put around 2000 rounds thru it, only had a few stovepipes when I first started shooting, they cleared up pretty quickly. It was my trunk gun for 8+ years, I sold it in a moment of weakness. A friend has a newer (gen2?) version, and it has given him a few problems with the hinge point. I think he got it resolved, but it puts a damper on my enthusiasm for KT.

Might I recommend a nice AR pistol, if you are looking for an ultracompact rifle?

I have not had any experience with the su16.
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Old 02-04-2017, 08:19 PM
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I had the 2000, realized it wouldn't do anything I couldn't do with my G19 and sold it to spend the money on a AK74 parts kit.
Never regretted selling it.

I've played with the 16's.
Fun little plinker, but for the price (and ESPECIALLY considering the low price of AR's...) buy an AR instead

And THIS ftom A Guy Who DOESN'T LIKE AR's!
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Old 02-04-2017, 08:29 PM
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I have a Sub2K Gen2 in .40. Glock mag. It fills a nitche for us. I like it personally. No it does not take the place of a full power rifle....but as I said...it fills a nitche for us. YMMV.
As far as the SU16...can't say good or bad about it. But...if the opportunity presents itself...I'd own one. But there aren't too many guns I wouldn't own if the right opportunity came along. But that's me.
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Old 02-04-2017, 08:59 PM
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I'm on my 2nd Glock 9mm Gen II, the one I have now has all of the most recent factory updates. It's definitely a niche gun, a 100 yard gun, a fun range gun, a gun that's easy to feed & shoot, it's an accurate HD gun that's easily suppressed. 33 round Glock 'happy sticks' make it that much better.
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Old 02-05-2017, 12:05 AM
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I have the 1st gen sub2k in .40. I installed a quad rail so I could mount my Eotech. I can hit 1 gallon milk containers at 100 yards easy. Something I can't do with my pistol. For me it filled a niche. I wanted a carbine that used the same mags as my pistol.

Never had any issues with it other than I didn't like the factory sites but they are easy to remove. It's a fun gun to shoot and I always get asked "can I shoot that" when I take it to the range. Makes a really good trunk gun.
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Old 02-05-2017, 12:08 AM
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TAG for info....
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Old 02-05-2017, 04:21 PM
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I have an SU-16B, but it came with a "C" stock installed when I bought it. The factory sights were junk, but I have no other complaints. Just be aware that, aside from the caliber/magazine compatibility, it doesn't resemble an AR15 in terms of performance. I suppose buying the AR-style grip/stock kit might change that, but it is best judged on its own merits, not against an AR.

I don't shoot the SU-16 as accurately as an AR unsupported, probably because it's so light and balances differently, but it is a toss-up shooting from a bench. The "C" stock allows you to fire with the stock folded, but it's not something I see myself doing.
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Old 02-05-2017, 04:24 PM
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If you're after a foldable rifle for carry in a vehicle, the SU16 has its good points. Back in the days I drove a Triumph Spitfire, it would have been a great thing to have.
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Old 02-05-2017, 04:31 PM
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Speaking of thin barrels, I recently sent my PMR 30 back to Kel Tec for replacement after it blew up in my face...the barrel appeared to be CAST>>>! When I get my new one, it is surely going to be traded for a safer built pistol.

Regards to all...
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Old 02-05-2017, 04:35 PM
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I can't think of anything I would need to shoot with a 9MM from far away. these things look like a solution without a problem.
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Old 02-05-2017, 07:33 PM
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One of my range buddies has a sub2k. Pretty neat actually. Could fit in a briefcase or backpack. Compatible with Glock mags. I was a tad nervous about shooting it at first, because it felt a bit flimsy, but it performed better than expected.

I've handled the SU-16s but they feel flimsy too. I couldn't tell you how one fires though.

I'm not a big fan of fiber optic sights. They have great visibility but I've seen them shoot loose on handguns, and hunters that had them on their shotguns found them broken off somehow on the way to their stand. Great for competition but little else in my opinion.
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Old 02-05-2017, 07:52 PM
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Unless you absolutely NEED a folding PCC, then save yourself a bunch of money and get a Hipoint 995. I have a Sub2K, I paid a little under $300 for it before the prices on them started getting just stupid. I have the S&W version and also have the conversion for the Beretta mags. It is not as durable or accurate as the 995, but it does have mag capacity and crossover with other pistol mags and the capability to fold, and it is lighter. However, 995's now have higher capacity mags that work perfect "Redball" 20 rounders are now available for 995's.

Again, if folding and weight are your two most important considerations, then get the Sub2K. If not, make another choice. There are plenty of 9mm PCC to choose from. Just Right Carbine, AR, Hipiont, Sterling Sporter, Beretta PX-4, Ruger Police Carbine etc.

You best bang for your buck IMO is the Hipoint 995, 4095 or 4595.
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Old 02-05-2017, 08:03 PM
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I never understood taking all the disadvantages of a pistol (lower relative power) and a rifle (size) and combining them.
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Old 02-05-2017, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper6Niner View Post
I never understood taking all the disadvantages of a pistol (lower relative power) and a rifle (size) and combining them.
Because a PCC increases the velocity over a pistol, increases the accuracy via longer barrel, longer sight picture and better ergos which allows the shooter to extend the effective range of the round by at least double or triple.
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Old 02-05-2017, 08:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by panoz77 View Post
Because a PCC increases the velocity over a pistol, increases the accuracy via longer barrel, longer sight picture and better ergos which allows the shooter to extend the effective range of the round by at least double or triple.
And falls short of a comparably sized rifle in both energy and range with the added bonus of the magazines costing 3 times as much.
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Old 02-05-2017, 08:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper6Niner View Post
And falls short of a comparably sized rifle in both energy and range with the added bonus of the magazines costing 3 times as much.
Intermediate rifle cartridges are far more powerful, in some cases you don't WANT that much additional power. That's why even the military used PCCs. For every "disadvantage" you claim there is an advantage. For instance, weight and space savings for pistol caliber vs. rifle caliber and larger capacity magazines.
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Old 02-05-2017, 08:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by panoz77 View Post
Intermediate rifle cartridges are far more powerful, in some cases you don't WANT that much additional power. That's why even the military used PCCs. For every "disadvantage" you claim there is an advantage. For instance, weight and space savings for pistol caliber vs. rifle caliber and larger capacity magazines.
Describe me a scenario where you would want less power and why that scenario is likely enough to leave the rifle behind.
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Old 02-05-2017, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper6Niner View Post
Describe me a scenario where you would want less power and why that scenario is likely enough to leave the rifle behind.

Suppressing a long gun... easier to be done with pistol calibers in a carbine. Take a 230 grain .45... subsonic in most loads up to a 16" barrel.
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