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Old 09-05-2019, 08:14 PM
Buck91 Buck91 is offline
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Pretty straight forward question. All other factors being equal, would you prefer slugs or buckshot for home defense? What about for SHTF shelter in place defense? Lets assume we are not considering over penetration as a factor in this discussion. I suppose to be specific, lets discuss 12 gauge 00 buck verse 12 gauge 3/4 to 1 ounce foster style slugs (or similar).
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Old 09-05-2019, 08:36 PM
ForgedInTheFlame ForgedInTheFlame is offline
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Buckshot.

There are people who find slugs situational. I'm not one of them. If I can't hit my target with buckshot I'll either close the distance, or transition to a weapon with greater range.



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Old 09-05-2019, 08:44 PM
ScottPreps ScottPreps is offline
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If over penetration is not an issue, I'd have the first round loaded be a slug and then buck afterwards. This way, the first shot is better at distance and a real power stopper. Then I've got buck available a fraction of a second behind.
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Old 09-05-2019, 08:52 PM
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You should have access to both.
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Old 09-05-2019, 09:05 PM
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I like my cast Lyman sabot slugs 1.25 oz. I also like factory 41 pellets of #4 buck or 18 OO copper plated buffered. I cast my own #4 and OO. I load 12 OO 3.75 DE in my 2.75 shells or the slug, 4 DE. I don't remember the #4 count. I'd use the buck for home work or owning camp. The slug is good to 90 yards - will stay on a 3# coffee can. Not bad for a 20" smooth bore barrel pistol gripped combat 870. Has a spot in the INCH cart load out.

You need to shoot your loads and see what they do. Choke tubes can help. I installed a mid bead in the rib to serve as the rear sight. 1000's of rounds down range helps too.

I reach for a pistol first as home defense.
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Old 09-05-2019, 09:28 PM
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Buckshot. Any situation that would call for a slug would be better handled with a rifle. I would only use a shotgun as an interior protection/fallback room option. A slug may get stopped by either hard or soft body armor but buckshot increases your chances of finding a weak spot in armor. In SHTF, I would keep two or three slugs on the shotgun shell holder on my stock just in case I had to escape into the wilderness (big game/longer distance take down). For a similar reason, I would also keep a handful of birdshot shells on my belt.
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Old 09-05-2019, 09:42 PM
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Buckshot. I only use slugs for hunting and that’s because I am basically forced too by law.
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Old 09-05-2019, 10:09 PM
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I like Federal's 000 loading where our realistic home defense matrix ranges from 125 lb meth heads to four-legged punks weighing several hundred pounds.
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Old 09-06-2019, 11:30 AM
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As Sabotage said, buck first for defense. Slugs for deer hunting, at least in 12 G.

20 gauge I would consider slugs for both deer hunting and defense.
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Old 09-06-2019, 01:21 PM
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Buckshot given the unique multi-hit qualities of it, for human or small animal (rabid dog) defense from 10-30 feet or interior to structures. It's essentially the equivalent of a burst from a SMG, with ~9-12 .30 caliber rounds and energy dump.

But slugs are a close match, and sometimes preferable if expecting larger threats or greater distances, say out to 100 yards (e.g. bear country).

For a single projectile, an AR or AK is probably superior for anti-personnel. Lighter, flatter shooting, and better penetration particularly against soft armor over the slugs.
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Old 09-06-2019, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leadcounsel View Post
It's essentially the equivalent of a burst from a SMG, with ~9-12 .30 caliber rounds and energy dump.
Ssssshhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!! Don't let liberals know this or Diane Feinstein will be pulling her hair out and screeching for a ban on buckshot! Of course we all know they'll be going after shotguns anyway, soon after they get so-called assault weapons outlawed, using the point you made here. And sniper rifles too (currently called hunting rifles). And of course handguns.

As far as which would I prefer, as others here said, buckshot seems to be best for the kind of ranges you would encounter in your home. But I like the idea of having access to both. Buckshot loaded in the magazine, but with two ammo carriers closeby that I can throw over my shoulder or clip on a belt, one with buck and one with slugs. At close range though I don't know how much it matters whether the bad guy gets hit with one big hunk of lead or nine smaller hunks of lead (or even twelve). I suppose it could though, and within buckshot range any advantage goes to the multiple hits.

There is no doubt a rifle has advantages over a shotgun when you get beyond buckshot range. But the advantage of slugs is that you can have a shotgun, and if the range of a fight gets beyond buckshot distance, you can still engage an enemy out to a hundred yards anyway. That versatility is one of the advantages of a shotgun.

I'd be curious about what police carry in their shotguns, and the military too. My opinion here is speculation, but if there is a common practice among police and the military, as I assume there might be, that would be based in experience, and their common practice would be far superior to my opinion. Just keep in mind that their missions and situations are not the same as yours (or each others' for that matter), so what's best for them is not necessarily what's best for you, but what they use and why is certainly worth considering.

Do you remember the North Hollywood shootout? The police weapons were said to be unable to penetrate the body armor of the perpetrators. If I remember right at least one officer on the scene had a shotgun. Does anyone know if that officer had access to slugs? And if not, would slugs likely have made a difference?
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Old 12-11-2019, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deprogramming services View Post

I'd be curious about what police carry in their shotguns, and the military too. My opinion here is speculation, but if there is a common practice among police and the military, as I assume there might be, that would be based in experience, and their common practice would be far superior to my opinion. Just keep in mind that their missions and situations are not the same as yours (or each others' for that matter), so what's best for them is not necessarily what's best for you, but what they use and why is certainly worth considering.
Someone I know is a Law Enforcement Officer who has trained with and carried a shotgun for over 30 years. He would tell you that, while Police Depts have transitioned to rifles (223/5.56), many Officers still carry 12ga because they are proven to be a top defensive weapon. Someone I know would say that Law Enforcement and Military long ago learned that 00buck it is unsurpassed against someone wanting to commit an evil act. Many Officers also carry slugs but mostly for "just in case".
Remember, with 00Buck you get nine 32cal pellets heading with great power toward the bad guy every time it goes boom. Very few types of body armor (or bodies for that matter) can withstand a hit from 00Buck unless there is a lot of distance. Within a 50 yard distance you can't go wrong with 00buck.
Someone I know has a 12ga loaded with 00Buck. He has extra rounds on the stock with a few slugs mixed in- just in case the 00buck doesn't give the necessary penetration. If some fool tried to break into his house, someone I know would skip the 9mm, the 357 and the 5.56 and pick up the 12ga every time.
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Old 09-06-2019, 01:46 PM
Revmgt Revmgt is offline
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I have A bandoleer of Winchester PDX for the house gun, a slug with three pellets. I donít try to mix and match ammo with slugs here and buckshot there. Iíve been in very high stress situations before, ringing in ears and narrow vision, when that physical reaction to stress happens I donít think having to choose what shell to load will be a good thing.
At home defense distances the pattern spreads less than 10 inches so a 1 oz slug and 3 00 pellets would do the job
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Old 09-06-2019, 07:59 PM
Buck91 Buck91 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Revmgt View Post
...I’ve been in very high stress situations before, ringing in ears and narrow vision, when that physical reaction to stress happens I don’t think having to choose what shell to load will be a good thing.
At home defense distances the pattern spreads less than 10 inches so a 1 oz slug and 3 00 pellets would do the job

This sounds 100%. Currently I keep my scattergun stocked with #4 in the tube and 00 on the sidesaddle. Figuring the #4 will take down any reasonable threat with less danger to the neighbors while the 00 will offer better ballistics on an exceptionally bad day if I need to utilize the extra rounds.

I need to pattern my different scatterguns with slugs "just in case" but I just don't see a time where they would be preferable. Was looking to find reasons to stock them vs not to worry about it. So far I'm not worried about it- if I need to hunt deer in the shotgun zone I can buy a couple boxes for patterning and use.
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Old 09-06-2019, 02:21 PM
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Buck inside slugs outside.

Double gun with double or select trigger works great for this application.


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Old 09-06-2019, 05:19 PM
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The beauty of a shotgun is that you have both. I don't see a reason to pick just one. Slug swap drills are a staple of my range routine.
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Old 09-06-2019, 06:39 PM
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I have a lot of molds, buck, ball, and slug
All three are useful
One favorite popularized by the late James Gates of Dixie Slugs is
The Tri-Ball
Three .60" caliber balls going 1,200 fps
Around 1,000 grains of lead
Terminal effect, crazy
For perspective,
At the Linbaugh Seminars, #00 buck penetrates in the Bone Box around 8 to 9 inches max
The Tri-ball goes 27 inches and makes a huge, hard to believe hole
A simple .678" lead ball will shut it down
A solid hit with a decent slug anywhere, body, arms, or legs, is a fight ender
I suppose the same could be said for most any rifle
In the house will always use my .310" buckshot and outside same to 25 yards
After that, time for the big heavy loads
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Old 09-06-2019, 08:22 PM
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I thought military guards carried shotguns to reduce chance of material damage. As in don't shoot at the nuclear weapons. Or the 100 million dollar aircraft.
In the field i thought shotguns were doorbreakers with non ricochet powdered metal ammo, not really used as weapons anymore.
Slugs are much more expensive than buckshot.
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Old 09-07-2019, 08:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmas View Post
Slugs are much more expensive than buckshot.
Not really...
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Old 09-09-2019, 02:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vodka Wizard View Post
Not really...
So where do you get slugs? Or are you talking about making them?
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