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Old 02-07-2016, 12:48 PM
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Default INCH BAG Review , need some pointers



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Hello All,
I could really use some help with my BOB/INCH bag. First let me preface with my plan, right now, is to Bug In as long as possible and if I absolutely have to leave, I’m probably never coming back…at least not for a long time.

The Bag: click here for a pic of setup
  • Emberlestock F4 Terminator w/Rifle Scabbard (optional to include, takes up room in main bag compartment) Right now I strap the AR on the side, was considering adding 12 gauge shotgun, but weight has become an issue

For Defense:
  • AR 556 4 30 round clips
  • 2 9MM pistols with 250 rounds of ammo
  • Two Cans of Mace

Cutting Tools:
  • Kabar BK-22
  • Mora Standard Bushcraft knife
  • Ontario Machete/w sheath
  • SOG Folding Saw
  • Rope Chainsaw Blade
  • Folding Hacksaw

Other Tools
  • SOG Folding Shovel
  • Small Handheld Udigit trammel
  • Two C-Clamp Traps
  • 12 heavy gauge trapping snares
  • Slingbow Slingshot w/50 1/8” balls and 2 arrows
  • Two replacement bands for Slingshot #40 pull
  • Disc style sharpening stone
  • Small knife sharpening tool course/smooth sided
  • Small lightweight honing tool (very small and compact)
  • 24” combination padlock

Containers
  • Lifestraw Water Bottle w/filtration built in
  • Natrex water bottle (plastic)
  • Metal Water Cannistor (for boiling)
  • Cooking set Lightweight
  • 3 Liter Water Bladder

Cordage
  • 3 rolls of 50ft of Titan paracord
  • Spool of string (hemp)
  • Spool of rubber coated wire

First Aid
  • Trauma Kit
  • Day Tripper First Aid
  • Israeli Bandages (2)
  • Quickclot (2)
  • Sam Split 36” (2)

Food
  • 5 MREs
  • Snack Pack (trailmix, (2) mainstay Energy Bars)
  • 2 cans of tuna

Clothing (stored in Snugpack compression sack)
  • Change of clothes (pants, long sleeve shirt, two pair of underwear, two pairs of wool socks, UA 3.0 Base Layer)
  • Goggles
  • 2 Shemaugs
  • 1 Neck Gator
  • 1 pair of mechanix gloves
  • 1 Pair of Fleece Gloves
  • Watch Cap

Sleep System
  • One Wool Blanket
  • One Sleeping SnugPack Sleeping Bag (this could be swapped out with 4-piece military issue sleep system)
  • Air Mattress (NeoAir Thermarest)

Cover
  • 1 Military Poncho system (can be used a tarp)
  • 1 Tarp (camouflage)

Admin Pouch
  • Write In Rain notepad
  • Black Sharpie
  • Pace Beads
  • All weather pen
  • (2) Lensatic compasses
  • Local area topographic map
  • Field Repair Kit (straps, buckles, etc)
  • All Weather hand crank radio /w USB charger (enclosed in TechProtect Faraday bag)
  • Fresnel Lens
  • Reading glasses
  • USB stick with pertinent personal information
  • 6 AA batteries (will be replaced with rechargeable)

Water Treatment
  • 2 bottles of aqua water treatment
  • 1 pack of Terradyne..or some name like that (water treatment)
  • Lifestraw (in addition to the Lifestraw water bottle above)
  • Mini Sawyer Water Filtration System

Cooking
  • EtekCity portable stove /w 2 canisters of fuel
  • Emberlit Folding Stove

Combustion and Fire:
  • (2) Bic Lighters
  • Flint and Steel
  • Ferro Rod
  • Fire Tin, w/char
  • Small baggie of Vaseline soaked cotton balls
  • Baggie of Dryer lint
  • 1 waterproof container of storm matches
  • Fresnel Lens (see above)
  • 9volt battery /w steel wool
  • Small spool of Organic Flame – hemp fire twine

Optics
  • Vortex 12x50 Binoculars
  • Vortex M223 Scope on AR

Lighting
  • UCO candle burner w/6 9 hour candles (these put off some good heat too)
  • Fenix PD 32 Flashlight w/rechargeable 18650 battery and 2 disposables
  • Fenix E20 Flashlight runs off AA

Misc
  • Fishing Survival Tin
  • EDC Survival Tin
  • Bushcraft Book
  • Pack of playing cards
  • Small toiletries kit (toothbrush, extra pair of contacts, glasses, finger nail clippers, compressed tablets of toilet paper, moist towelettes for cleanup

Total Weight loaded with ammo and water = 82lbs

Things to be Added (weigh considering)

I realize this is way too much gear, way too heavy, which is why I’m considering a cart or wagon of some sort, like backpacking cart, maybe mono wheeled style. I’d love some suggestions on models.
Please feel free to critique my setup and make any suggestions.

I ask that you please keep in mind a couple things:
  • If vehicles work, I’m probably throwing the bag and some other stuff in the truck and I have 2 20 liter Jerry Cans w/fuel that I keep stocked and rotated
  • If travel by vehicle is not realistic I’ll head out on foot or I’m even looking into a pull wagon, cart or trailer to hook on the back of a mountain bike
  • I don’t have a predetermined BOL yet, although I’m reviewing a couple of options
  • This bag is really intended for an INCH bag and I will need to live out of it for an extended period of time
  • I realize that by Buggin Out I’m going refugee and that I’m not sure of my future

Thank you so much for taking the time to review my gear and providing any constructive feedback.

Anonymous Prepper
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Old 02-07-2016, 01:03 PM
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It does not look like an INCH kit to me. To me, an INCH kit contains the means to take care of yourself medium to long term, as well as have some way to continue or start up so form of income producing business to provide for yourself long term, through the PAW, and into the recovery.

I do not want to hijack this thread so I will start one with my thoughts on the subject that I have been asked to do recently.

Just my opinion.
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Old 02-07-2016, 01:36 PM
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What is your AO? If you don't want to publish exact locals, give us the climate, environment, etc.

Right off the bat, I can suggest a couple of things to reduce weight and add to your versatility, if, they are good to work within your environment.
1. Replace your stove kit with a small alcohol burner and a pint of fuel. This is for those times when you want a quick heat or its just too wet for natural fuel, or to dry out a little natural fuel. Use a light weight folding natural fuel stove. I have a Core 4 stove. Very versatile, folds flat and weighs ounces.
2. Dump the binocs. You have the scope on your AR. Personally, I would dump the AR as well. If you are planning on survIving a few pitched battles, you're too optimistic about your survival chances...and...you're way too little on ammo if you want to carry that thing. You only need one hand gun. I carry a carbine in 357/38 with 100 rounds of 357 and 38 and a Ruger MKII (22lr) pistol with 1000 rds of CCI. Both are primarily for putting food on the table. Self defense is a last resort in case I just can't E and E. I have a 20x Leupold monolcular that is light weight, shock and waterproof. Mostly used to keep from getting into a pitched battle.
3. MREs are too much weight. Go with dried foods, rice, beans, jerky, nuts and carry more of it. You don't have enough food to get through the lean times.
4. Forget the Goal Zero, too heavy. Go with a folding 14v, 14w, (or better) CIGGS technology solar panel. Folds to small package, very light, weatherproof and will work in any light.
5. Carry snare making equipment, gill nets, lots of hooks, braided line, frog gigs, etc. Then...learn to use them all.
I would rethink your shelter items depending on your AO. And you don't have enough clothes.

If you are going "INCH" you need to think about the things that you think you won't be able to replace. Then you need to decide if you really need those things at all.

The cart is a fine idea. If that's the way you are going tho, you can carry a lot more weight and bulk. Just be picky about your choices of what to take.

I have a survival kit that I carry on my back that is very comprehensive. It weighs in at about 55 pounds. But our AO has abundant food sources and water everywhere. Our primary concern is how to harvest the food and purifying the water. Our next concern becomes shelter, medical and hygiene.

We have a long term wilderness survival kit (INCH) that is basically a lot more of everything that is in my pack kit, plus more tools, weapons, etc. That kit rides in a travois-cart and/or a boat.

Don't be discouraged over the sceptics you will by hear from regarding INCH anything.
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Old 02-07-2016, 02:21 PM
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I think that if you shouldered that entire load, you'd be staggered (literally).

Bug Out implies having a destination. Your load should provide for reaching that destination. That's mainly a function of food, water, & insulation. If you think you're going to live an indefinite migratory existence, you'd better already be living in a rare land of plenty and also possess mad foraging skills. Otherwise, you're just running out the clock with a pack full of inedible widgets.

It's easy to fall into a trap where you try to solve two divergent problems while constrained by the same volume and carrying capacity limits for each. One problem is the same faced by every backpacker doing an extended hike. Going further, faster, and lighter. The other is trying to punch list solutions for every conceivable (if unlikely) scenario under the sun... even though those solutions have little to do with backpacking.

So you wind up with a collection of sharps, weaponry, traps, maintenance tools, cordage, electronics, light sources, optics, candles, and other widgets oriented toward contingencies... while still only carrying expendable items sufficient for maybe a week of hiking (towelettes, TP, MREs, gas canisters, etc.). Too much of one category. Too little of the other. Try to strike a balance that provides more days duration in the field.

You've literally got 13 fire means/assists listed (including your loaded ammunition, gas canisters, & candle). Why? What world do you envision encountering where that kind of redundancy is required? It all adds up in terms of ounces. Likewise, you've got eight (8) edged tools for self defense, utility chores, and processing meat, wood, toenails, or vegetation. Why? It's just too much. If you plan to build structures, you might really need an axe, adze, drawing knife... and a chainsaw. Choose a primary blade. Pick a secondary. One larger. One smaller. If there's room/weight left over after everything else is packed... maybe add a specialized energy saver like a chopper, camp axe, or saw.

Some of your backpacking essentials seem rather light to my eye. Not enough socks, no rain gear, not enough reserve insulation layers, and too much weight dedicated to a fair weather sleeping system. Well under a week's worth of food even at calorie deficit (starvation) rationing. You've got a change of shirt & pants listed but no jacket/sweater/parka.

No matter what situation has driven you into bug out mode, Job #1 is to accomplish what all backpackers strive to do: survive outdoor weather and stretch consumables (water, fuel, food) to cover a maximum number of days movement & bivouac.

Accomplish this first. Then, and only then, add items for enduring a longer term event. Perfect Is the Enemy of Good Enough.

You've got a lot of great items listed, but they aren't equally needed. 250 rounds of 9mm and two pistols? That's 5-10 times more ammo than you'll probably need even in a violent environment. Several days worth of food weight you could carry instead. You've got a rifle. One pistol is enough. A pistol with 3-5 loaded magazines. In 2002, I wandered around remotest Afghanistan with a loaded M9 and 3 spare magazines. Plus a carbine and a combat load. That was it. When you start to think you need more carried spare pistol ammo, what you really need is more rifle magazines.

I realize that you've got a flood of scenarios envisioned. One larger CCW pistol plus a BUG. Multiple gun fights with later topping off of now-empty magazines. Visions of not being the guy with only two or three rounds left in some post apocalyptic environment. But that's precisely the environment that's going to kill you with snow, rain, and cold long before hostile people do. Visions of chopping, slashing, sawing, batonning, whittling a whole lot of wood... in an environment where it's likely not prudent to display an open fire, a burning candle, or even a constructed camp.

Low observable & stealth might be premium considerations for a bug out. An environment where visible fires would probably draw all sorts of uninvited trouble. Things must have broken down significantly (social upheaval) for you to bug out and abandon home or vehicle. Else, why would you be bugging out to the bush instead of just staying at a friend's house, checking into a hotel, or getting a ride to somewhere safe? If it's just short term evacuation ahead of wild fire, flood, hurricane, industrial hazard, or blizzard... you really don't need to head to the bush. You just travel to an area where things are still normal. If it's some scenario where hostile people abound, you need a plan to hide and avoid contact.

A gear sorting technique I have used successfully, for everything from recreational backpacking trips to combat missions, goes like this:

Dump it all out on the floor. Every single thing. Even small items squirreled away inside of kits and containers. Then take an unflinchingly critical look at each item.

One at a time, examine an item and ask yourself if its absence is likely to result in your death, injury, or inability to continue walking. If so, place in a Critical Load pile. Things like rain gear, basic rations, sleeping system, rifle, compass/map, water, boiling container, basic medical items, warm hat, a single knife, shelter, etc. are likely to make it into this pile.

If absence of the item will not directly cause you to die, become a mobility kill, or suffer other debilitating injury... place it into a Don't Need pile. Shovel, machete, candle lanterns, ground cloth, playing cards, gobs of spare ammo, spare but redundant edged tools, etc. go into this pile. When you look at this gear, don't dive down a rabbit hole of "what if...". With a sharp knife or two already on your body, two or three extra blades stored in a pack are not critical. They are just redundant weight. Will lack of a shovel actually cause you to fall over and croak while carrying a pack? Of course not... unless people are shooting at you routinely and you see a need to construct fighting positions.

Also create a Nice To Have Pile. This is where things go that fall in between the other two groups. Weather radio, binos, traps, repair kits, stove, saw, spare sets of clothing, etc. Things that might not be strictly needed to survive outdoors for a time, but that might be invaluable in a hostile landscape where weather, terrain, or people are a threat. Dependent upon anticipated situation and remaining margin for carry of extra weight. Nothing from this pile goes back into the pack until you weigh, shoulder, and then walk with the Critical Load.

Weigh the Critical Load pile. Put it on. Go walk some local miles under it. When you get back, you'll have a better understanding of whether or not you can afford to add anything else.

The things that wound up in the Don't Need pile is the stuff that gets put into a separate vehicle storage container. It's useful stuff as long as you have an engine to haul it around or deliver it to a campsite.

You've got obviously good gear and some good ideas. No doubt you see some specific uses in your locale for some of those items. But you already know you need to lighten things a bit. Get it to where you've can mount a 10-day unsupported backpacking trip (in terms of food/fuel) in the worst expected weather. Then add the firepower. Then the food gathering tools. Then anything else.

(Edit to add: What's with the 24" padlock? Planning on securing something, locking an entrance, or just using it as a melee weapon?)
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Old 02-07-2016, 04:50 PM
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If you don't have to carry it your options as to what to include are all most limitless. If you have to carry it I'd suggest you try Whiteblaze.net, Trailjournals.com and Youtube videos dealing with hiking the AT/gear. Pay attention to those who give evaluations of gear after completing the hike. If you don't get your basic gear/loadout right all the other stuff you add will come for not. Be honest with yourself as to your physical condition as to the weight you can acutually carry with some comfort. Most of what you add over that weight will more than likely be left on the trail if you find yourself on foot.
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Old 02-07-2016, 09:02 PM
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The description above is a large BOB, not an INCH.

The idea of an INCH is something to use to totally rebuild elsewhere because you are never coming home again.

On that line some suggestions I would make:

Ditch the Mace for Bear Spray. More useful.

Couple boxes of each type weapon in spare ammo MINIMUM.

Add some sort of axe or hatchet. In shelter and camp building, let alone all the wood cutting you'll be doing, it will make life WAY easier.

Add a MINIMUM of 100 ft paracord to your cordage. Also, you are likely going to want to add rope (minimum 50ft).

At least DOUBLE the First Aid and add more miscellaneous stuff than just trauma and injury (calamine lotion, cold treatment, stomach upset, etc)

WAY more food as well as staples (flour, salt, spices, bouillon, sugar, drinks, etc) to add to stuff you acquire in the field.

Add cooking utensils and things like drink mugs, plates, etc. Stuff to make life easier will go a long way.

Double the socks and underwear MINIMUM, and double the clothes overall. Add some specific cold weather and wet weather stuff...the idea of INCH is you are going to be out there all times of year.

At least double the number of batteries and I would recommend a second pair of glasses stored in a totally different area of the pack (say with first aid gear).

More of the UCO candles. You can also get the citronella ones that keep mosquitoes away (I got those for mine). Also, add a head lamp of some kind for hands free work.

You may also want to consider a multi-season backpacker tent of some sort.

Another suggestion might be to switch packs for something more modular. I put my INCH in an expedition style pack that has a detachable belt pack (which I use for First Aid supplies) and a Smaller Day Pack (largely holds my immediate access stuff and doubles) both of which attach to the larger pack. This way, if I need to divide the load I easily can as well as if I need to stow the larger bag and carry less gear I can in a snap.


That would be my minimum suggestions if you want to call this an INCH pack.
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Old 02-07-2016, 10:43 PM
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I'd say put it on your back as is and start walking. I suspect you'll find Astronomy's assessment spot on if you do. Do some 10-20 km hikes in variable weather and refinements will present themselves.
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Old 02-08-2016, 03:40 AM
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Without the details of why,a few years ago I had a "never coming back"moment.
My car was my BOB,and I was gone in 9 hours prep time,mainly because i had to wait till the morning for a few places to open.
One thing I brought that I don't see mentioned much-A decent suit and tie and nice shoes.
It helped me get back on my feet when I showed up at places appearing "respectable"
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Old 02-08-2016, 07:31 AM
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it all depends on your plan. I'm bugging out with others, so I will be able to distribute some of the weight of things that would be nice to have. some of my thoughts on your gear...

-AR15 is great for fighting and very limited hunting, but a hunting 12 gauge shotgun will be good at fighting, but will excel at providing food... you can hunt rabbits, squirrels, deer, birds. if I were to bug out alone, it would be shotgun and 9mm coming with me. but my wife and child will be with me so she can help carry another long gun, and that will be an AR15.

-1 knife on your belt, one in your pack is plenty in my mind. an ax and machete style would also be valuable to me also. you have a way to sharpen and hone, great!

-I think too many options for fire starters, but all are light weight. 2 options on your person and 2 in your pack is minimum for me.

-you might also consider a bit more food.

but overall I think you have a great kit!!! but at its current weight, you will need a cart or you will have to cut weight somewhere. I really like the idea of separating everything into piles to reevaluate. I will be doing that this week with my BOB, but im also going to change it up for a backpacking trip Im planning this spring... so I need to cut some stuff anyway.

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Old 02-08-2016, 10:18 AM
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Back in the day, a real INCH setup looked like this:



which is a tongue in cheek way of saying that having your insurance up to date and an idea of where you could relocate is probably more important than your carry bag.

A cursory look at what the avg "Syrian refugee' carries shows a really light kit.



Many with just a change of clothes and a couple of cans of food....

In a wide-spread disaster, the kind of aid handed out to these migrants will likely not be available, hence the idea of at least planning of having a BOL, for a destination, if nothing else.

Good luck
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Old 02-08-2016, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Astronomy View Post
I think that if you shouldered that entire load, you'd be staggered (literally)...You've got obviously good gear and some good ideas. No doubt you see some specific uses in your locale for some of those items. But you already know you need to lighten things a bit. Get it to where you've can mount a 10-day unsupported backpacking trip (in terms of food/fuel) in the worst expected weather. Then add the firepower. Then the food gathering tools. Then anything else.

(Edit to add: What's with the 24" padlock? Planning on securing something, locking an entrance, or just using it as a melee weapon?)
Well said. I've read a lot of postings regarding this topic and none have been as succinct in summarizing this exercise in prioritizing you pack/load. Very good advice. Thank you.
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Old 02-08-2016, 02:25 PM
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I'm currently working on making an INCH bag out of my current BOB.

That is to say my knowledge is limited, but I would definitely say you could save some serious weight by consolidating your cutting/wood processing tools:

Keep the Kabar BK-22
Keep the Mora Standard Bushcraft knife
Keep the SOG Folding Saw
Add a Hatchet

Ditch the Ontario Machete/w sheath (unless you think you are going to be trailblazing)
Ditch the Rope Chainsaw Blade
Ditch Folding Hacksaw, keep some blades, you can make a new handle.

Ditch the Mace, Add more .223 and 9mm
Why do you have 2, 9mm pistols? Ditch 1 if you can. Take spare parts instead.
Ditch the Tuna
Replace the MRE's with something more light weight, possibly take the pick of the litter and supplement with dry food (as others have said).
Ditch the Binos
Add more clothes.


Overall, Good list of stuff. It's hard to leave stuff when you know if you could help you out down the line. I think choosing what to take and what to leave will be one of the hardest decisions.
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Old 02-08-2016, 04:37 PM
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Some of the OP's items would be valuable for a SHTF bug out as opposed to a recreational hike.

Binos? I don't normally carry for hiking unless my load is light and I expect some epic views (or I'm looking for wildlife). But in a former military life, they were absolutely invaluable for small patrol movement. Useful for detecting people, examining structures, observing vehicles, and searching out potential next legs of movement. All from a distance. In other words, binos are mission gear when you need to move surreptitiously. They work effectively day and night. Even if you are already carrying a night vision device. Eagle eyes are useful when people are a threat. Or when hunting for meat.

One of those maybe items. Unnecessary weight for recreational hiking? Yes. Worth the weight in troubled times? Probably. You're already carrying firearms in expectation of threats. Something that allows you to avoid that trouble in the first place makes a lot of sense.
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Old 02-08-2016, 04:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UnWorthy1 View Post
Why do you have 2, 9mm pistols? Ditch 1 if you can. Take spare parts instead.
I wondered about that, also. My guess was he's maybe got a full sized and a subcompact BUG . . . but yeah, might be nice in a lot of scenarios, but ones where grams and ounces count, not so much.

Quote:
Ditch the Tuna
Replace the MRE's with something more light weight, possibly take the pick of the litter and supplement with dry food (as others have said).
+1. Field strip out the entrees (or just order entrees from places that sell components), plus stuff like cheese and peanut butter, for something to eat on very short stops or on the move, but go Mountain House or similar for the bulk of calories (unless water is scarce in OP's area, which isn't stated).
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Old 02-08-2016, 06:39 PM
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[QUOTE=Astronomy;8459081

A gear sorting technique I have used successfully, for everything from recreational backpacking trips to combat missions, goes like this:

Dump it all out on the floor. Every single thing. Even small items squirreled away inside of kits and containers. Then take an unflinchingly critical look at each item.
[/QUOTE]

It may sound weird, but this is my absolute favorite thing to do. I love outfitting a trip. I'm at my happiest when all my stuff is spread out on the living room floor and I'm re-assessing and re-packing it.
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Old 02-08-2016, 07:43 PM
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There is a reason I usually refer to it as an INCH kit, rather than bag. Because if you can carry it on your back, unless 25% of the weight carried is cash, silver, gold, and perhaps a couple of investment grade diamonds, or something else small and light that can get you started over, then it is not an INCH kit at all in my way of thinking. If you cannot start over and be financially secure, it simply is not an INCH kit. If others have a different opinion of what an INCH kit is, it would be nice if they stated it with their load out, especially if it is just a back pack. So far I have not seen one back pack INCH kit list that has anything with which to start over financially, and very few with anything for reliable, reasonably time effective, long term food supply.

Just my opinion.
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Old 02-08-2016, 08:00 PM
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Honestly...its a setup to fail, and put you in a dangerous position in 10 or so days.


But you left out the key factor in those sorts of circumstances. What state and general portion?

This is key as to what you take on your back and what comes out of the ground when you get there.

I have 3 bags. 63, 65, and 67# with no food, no water and all of them are 85 liters and larger. You are not just fighting weight, your also fighting liters. I keep one in the truck, one is here and the other is in the RV. I'm very strong in camp craft (bushcraft) and can do a very superior job at raping the wilderness of food. I can say you are way ahead of the pack in some areas, but are lacking in most.

You just cant approach the thought process from past militarily experience, or any other standpoint than starting at it fresh.
1. You do not have the right kind of gear to collect food consistently over the long term.
2. You have to have ways to treat large amounts of water rapidly, besides wasting hours every day boiling it. And have larger containers than just a camel back. That's if your treating your cooking, cleaning and bathing water. If you don't....well....

You have to have both of those on the front end if you think your going to be packing a pack that large, and live. If your moving you will lose 2-3 pounds of body weight per day and need to consume almost a gallon or more of water.

I have some very good insight on this, because my backpack dredge weighs 74# and I add a small bushcraft style pack at 22# and I carry two days worth of food for every 5 day run of work. This allows another 2 gallons of fuel, but its always a crapshoot on getting lucky and eating. 60/40 against me, but I need the fuel to do the job.

The bad is your a long way from where you want to be.

The good is you only have to learn/do it once.

Watch both of these.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SyIN70iif_0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hLzQ...E9tD9&index=42
And remember if your in the north, legholds can fail a lot. More so if you have alternating rain, snow and freezing conditions. If your in a cold dry place they are fine. Otherwise conibears. I keep 2 doz snares in every pack. When they are gone they are gone. A 160 or 220 conibear is like an entire case of ammo and a few years of not wasting time hunting. It will fire a 1,000 times on its own and seldom miss.

Then read this entire thread. There is a lot of stuff tipped in it. Listen to what they are saying and look at the pics close.
https://www.survivalistboards.com/sho...aring+trapping

When it comes to fishing, I used to run a longline boat back when you could fill the hold. I know how to find and collect fish. A lot of people get skunked. You can't get skunked when you need to eat.

A lot of these folks are very smart. Its good to see some of the long replies here.

Don't look or think about your gear. Get a notepad and start a list. What do you need at a minimum to survive?

1. Shelter/fire.
2. Clean water.
3. Daily meals.
4. Sanitation-all around.
5. Bodily cleanliness.
6. Medical knowledge.
All those have to come first. Just to stay alive. Before you even begin on predator defense and any comforts. Those 6 will be a solid 40# in your pack depending on the weight of what you choose, to take care of them. But those must be the most solid and foolproof and long lasting bits of gear you collect.

You are doing the right thing by asking. I had some crappy years back in the 70s and 80s that didn't have to happen. Now its easy to reach out and get the right answers.
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Old 02-08-2016, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
It may sound weird, but this is my absolute favorite thing to do. I love outfitting a trip. I'm at my happiest when all my stuff is spread out on the living room floor and I'm re-assessing and re-packing it.
Doesn't sound weird to me at all. I kinda love doing that as well. It's a form of mental rehearsal for the actual event. Getting re-familiarized with every item, its purpose, and its placement.

I've put together so many load outs over the years, that a lot of it is just well practiced motion. 75% of my gear is standard & packed away through long familiarity & proven need. Mainly make gear changes to meet the seasons. But that last 25%? I can agonize over that stuff for hours... sometimes days. Tossing, adding, weighing, substituting. It's like fitting together a mostly familiar jig saw puzzle but with some of the pieces missing. The game is in finding those missing pieces for inclusion. Especially chow.

Hell, I do the same thing with a suitcase and carry-on for a flight. I can pack in a hurry, but I prefer a leisurely and detailed effort. I hate forgetting something because I was in too much of a hurry to consider it.
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Old 02-08-2016, 08:54 PM
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Awesome posts....everyone...really

Thank you so much for all the great input. I'll be revisiting this post and revising my load out quite a bit.

I'm really leaning toward a cart of some sort.

Someone asked me where I am at, right now, South Dakota and buggin out right now would be miserable. As far as clothes, I'b be buggin out in full hunting gear that's kept me warm sitting in the snow for five hours not moving while bow hunting, plus the change of clothes in my bag. Only other thing I might add to it would be a heavy parka that I'd just tie to the outside of the bag if I wasn't wearing it.

What I'm shopping for right now is a rugged enough but light enough cart that I can put the bag on and pull behind me or hook up to a fat tired mountain bike. This is assuming of course gas or vehicles weren't available.

I did pick up another bag a 3 piece ILBE Gen 2 pack (in good shape) for 150.00. I may load that up with a different setup. Something that if I had to wear the pack I could shoulder it.

I put the pack on the other night with all 82lbs with water containers all filled and ammo loaded and wore it for about 30 minutes walking around my place and climbing my stairs - it's doable but I about fell over for ten minutes after I took it off. It's alot of weight, I can't imagine trying to carry all of that for a ten mile hike in rough terrain.

Once again, thanks for the posts I'll definitely reassess what I"m taking with me.

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Old 02-08-2016, 10:14 PM
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Jerry D Young: There is a reason I usually refer to it as an INCH kit, rather than bag. Because if you can carry it on your back, unless 25% of the weight carried is cash, silver, gold, and perhaps a couple of investment grade diamonds, or something else small and light that can get you started over, then it is not an INCH kit at all in my way of thinking. If you cannot start over and be financially secure, it simply is not an INCH kit.
I'm with Jerry on this. I've never bought into the wilderness survival backpack version so beloved on survival forums. My feeling is that you can have small pack, a medium pack, or the biggest pack you can physically handle. But that pack size has little to do with permanent relocation. The load merely reflects your ability to carry weight and your un-resupplied duration afoot.

I'm Never Coming Home (INCH) is a statement of intent & reaction to circumstance... not the ability to carry it off.

I've joked about it, but my own INCH kit looks like a contracted moving company, luggage, money, passports, and either airline tickets or a road trip worthy vehicle. Having relocated more than 25 times in my life, many of those moves to overseas locations, and all of them to destinations where I spent more than a year (often several)... my idea of relocating doesn't involve a friggin' backpack.

I constantly see folks referring to an INCH pack that is really nothing more than a big expedition sized backpack full of stuff. Stuff they see themselves needing for some hypothetical and ill-defined wilderness stay. A bunch of foraging gear and some tools "to build a cabin". They see themselves as never returning home, but rarely have any better destination or plan than some sort of hazy Euell Gibbons / Jeremiah Johnson approach to wilderness living. Living a bushcraft primitive existence for the rest of my life? Not happening. Figure the odds.

I see the INCH backpack concept as a mostly imaginary endeavor.

If you get driven out of your home ground for any reason, no matter that you carry a 120 lb carefully crafted survival backpack... or just a plastic garbage bag full of your remaining possessions, you are effectively a refugee. Even if you have a destination in mind. And you're still a refugee until you can get to that safe location. Which is unlikely to be a spot in true wilderness. There are relatively few skilled people with access to uninhabited places rich in year round food, water, and survivable weather. That's a rare confluence of opportunity, ability, fortuitous location, and deliberate planning. Not to mention luck.

The INCH kit is just what Jerry describes. Something that allows you to arrive somewhere else, by hook or by crook, and get re-established. Somewhere where things & society still function to some degree. Some place where immediate survival threats are manageable (or nearly non-existent). Another Community. Another State. Another Nation. Another Hemisphere. Another chance at Life. Money Makes the World Go Round. Whether you can carry it with you or just have access to it on the other end.

My former landlord in Germany was a refugee at age five. In the face of advancing Soviet armies, his mother pulled him in a small wooden wagon from the coast of East Prussia to suburban Stuttgart during the last months of WWII. Hitching rides here and there, but never losing that cart. Father killed on the Eastern Front, everything they owned in haversacks and that wagon. War refugees. They arrived with nothing but had a few distant relatives to take them in. The war ended and they helped to rebuild their bombed out new home. Today he's a prosperous business man and pillar of his community. An INCH kit... on a child's wagon. Starting over, somewhere else.

An INCH kit could be a Mayflower Moving Van and one way airline tickets. It could be a suitcase or pack full of portable valuables, electronically accessed funds, or just cash. Absent those funds, it isn't likely to be a backpack full of anything other than basic bivouac gear and tools of a valued trade. Even in some post-apocalyptic world. Trappers don't live out of backpacks. They live in cabins or base camps and work trap lines across a territory. Settlers crossing the 19th Century Great Plains walked alongside huge wagons, livestock, and pack animals. Irish immigrants fleeing starvation arrived in the USA on steam ships... and integrated into either industrial society or agricultural work. They didn't start a new life by backpacking into the wilderness. Even the Mountain Men of 1800s North America had remote homesteads; paying jobs; and a regional support structure for trading, selling fur, and resupply. They used pack animals as well.

Just living out of a pack for months or years on end? Perhaps if you're a doctor with surgical implements & pharmaceuticals; a musician with instrument; a tinkerer, craftsman, teacher, gunsmith, or technician with tools and materials to repair or fix things... or instruct. That's someone who might successfully live out of an INCH backpack while living an itinerant existence. Trading their skill for a roof, security, and food. Or cash & barter items. They'd be itinerant providers of a service. If successful, they'd eventually acquire transport (pack animals, wagon, vehicle, etc.). If really successful, they'd find a safe place to plant roots.

Plinking squirrels, trapping fur, and hooking trout for rest of your life? Probably not a viable long term plan. Those that can are mostly already doing it. And those remote places are not generally accessible. The less remote ones will look like festival seating at an outdoor concert. Because you won't be the only person to think of them.

The INCH pack idea is just a big BOB. As much backpack as you can carry and still cover ground. No matter what you call it, you are pretty much limited to carrying a max of roughly two weeks food (in temperate weather) and the means to hopefully scrounge some more. So you'd best have a specific destination in mind. Because without that destination, a seriously well thought out plan, and some sort of reliable resupply (stocked caches, BOL, rich foraging/hunting ground, or other refuge), your gonna find out what starvation is all about. Unless you freeze to death first because you brought along everything but the cold weather gear you really needed.

I just plan a pack's contents around what I expect to accomplish and for the length of time I need to do it. Two weeks food on your back and, after that, you either find more or you're terminal/expectant in about 45-60 days. Never mind water procurement problems in an arid environment. The ability to go to ground and live out of a pack for a few weeks is certainly a nice to have option. That out of sight/out of mind time might be temporarily useful for avoiding troubles until the dust settles a bit. There's something to be said for a secure hidey hole away from chaos or threats. But you can't stay there forever. Not even with fish hooks and traps. Not unless it's truly remote and hospitable. Not too many places fit that description.

I'd rather take my chances where there's people, law and order, food, mutual defense, and the possibility of using/earning money to get restarted. Which reasoning also explains hundreds of thousands fleeing war in the Middle East and eventually travelling to Europe or North America. They aren't out foraging in the remote regions of Syrian, Afghani, Somali, Sudanese, Yemeni, Libyan, or Iraqi war zones. Life is better somewhere much farther away.

Arriving at a distant land with a suitcase, ID, money in the bank, connections/sponsors, and a plan... or just societal welfare benefits... beats foraging for dandelions and small mammals.

The OP identified his pack as an INCH/BOB. I'd just call it a bug out bag and leave it at that.

Just my $.02

Last edited by Astronomy; 02-09-2016 at 11:08 AM.. Reason: typos
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