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Old 02-15-2013, 08:03 PM
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Question 9mm reloading question????



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Hi all,
I just started reloading 9mm, and I finally got my dies adjusted.
My question is, I'm using Red dot powder with a 115 gr. plated bullet. I've never used Red Dot before, so I'm not used to using a flaked powder. My Hornady handbook has 2 loads for 115 gr. using Red Dot. One is 3.7 gr. and the other one is 4.1 gr.
On to the real question part, is it normal for the powder to almost fill the entire case?

After I seat the bullet, I cannot here the powder rattle

Is it just Red Dot powder or ist it normal for 9mm period?


Thanks in advance.....
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Old 02-15-2013, 08:10 PM
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I haven't used Red Dot for 9mm but..

It's not uncommon for powders to fill the entire case and some can be compressed.

Start off with the lighter load and work your way up to the bigger loads.

It's also possible the lighter load, won't let your weapon function properly and you will need to work up.
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Old 02-15-2013, 08:22 PM
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Yes it can be normal. Depends the powder, I personally have never used red dot but Unique is a flake and I have used that.It isn't a bad thing as a double load will be very apparent. Just follow the book on the low side and go from there. I have found that I can stay on the low side for most of my pistols as the projectile tends to be more accurate than the shooter anyway.
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Old 02-15-2013, 08:42 PM
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This is my first time loading pistol rounds, but is it normal for there to be a slight bulge, where the bullet is seated?
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Old 02-15-2013, 08:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jodier7 View Post
This is my first time loading pistol rounds, but is it normal for there to be a slight bulge, where the bullet is seated?
I have factory rounds that are if we are talking about the same "bulge". Is the circumference slightly larger at the of the base of the bullet and up?

If so then I hesitantly say its okay. I use hesitant without seeing it. Check some factory stuff and compare

Are you bullets .355?
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Old 02-15-2013, 08:56 PM
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Yes it starts at the bottom base of the bullet, not the case.

I don't notice the bulge on a factory round.

The bullets are Ranier 9mm plated bullets
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Old 02-15-2013, 08:59 PM
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As the others already said - yes it is normal for powder to nearly fill the case. You'll find in many calibers, a nearly full to compressed load is generally more accurate. Not in all cases but most. Also, the slight bulge in the case where the bullet is seated is normal as well. My old Hornady (Volume II) says 3.8 to 4.5 grains Red Dot powder with 115 HP (no doubt things changed since then). That is min and max. Not sure what you mean by "two loads". Good luck, enjoy handloading and be safe doing it!
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Old 02-15-2013, 09:00 PM
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I've only 9mm with Unique. Depending on the powder, it could easily fill the case.

My .357 and 45 acp loads have the same bulge that you describe.
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Old 02-15-2013, 09:04 PM
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Some reloaders select a powder so that the case will overflow if Double-Charged, thus preventing a Dangerous Condition.

Some powders, like BullsEye and Unique, are so powerful that it would be possible to put Two and maybe even Three powder charges in a single case! That would Blow up even the most stout gun! They are Great Powders, but Only use Powders like this when You have a LOT of experience, and are CERTAIN that You will NEVER Double Charge a Case.

*****Starting out, it is a good thing to select a bulky powder so you will be less likely to overcharge a case.*****

As far as a "Bulge" at the heeel of the bullet when it is in the case, it is often evident. The real test is if You can still chamber the round, it is OK. If the Round won't EASILY chamber, you are doing something Wrong. Maybe your bullets need Sizing. Maybe the case or the bullet dimensions are incorrect.Sometimes, you have seated the Bullet too deeply. The COAL (Cartridge Overall length) is an Important Measure, too! Seating a Correct Bullet In a Correct Case, With Correct Powder and Primer can STILL Cause Dangerous condition, if You seat the Bullet just a FEW HUNDREDTHS (Nearly Invisible to observe) Too Deep!!! Always use the EXACT Bullet Brand, Construction, and Weight when using Your Load "CookBook".

Never Compress a Charge, Unless the Loadbook Says the Load is to be compressed! If you mash a Bullet into a case, and Compress a Load that is Not designed to be compressed, you can get a Bulge. It may also cause Damage to You or Your Gun.
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Old 02-15-2013, 09:07 PM
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Pics would be helpful on the buldge you speak of. As lowlife says Hesitantly ok. I use a different powder and it fills right up to the bullet and is almost a compressed load.

Are the loads you mention below Start loads or Max loads? Most the pistol loads seem to vary depending on what application you are using. I look up a couple and pick my start loads that are within all the charts. (It may be the start of one, mid on another and lower mid on another - then I work up from there). Most the powder differences will have different COALs which would affect the pressure. I found the Coal that feeds the best, then experimented with powders and loads. 1 of my 9's fed great except if the Mag was full. Once I worked around the Coal, I was good to go. Before i fired the first reloads I cycled them through the mag manually to make sure they fed ok.

COAL can affect the feeding too, so you'll want to pay close attention to that as well. Certain coals seem to produce better results for me than others....

Hope this helps!!!
B
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Old 02-15-2013, 09:08 PM
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^^^^^^^^^^Good Advice^^^^^^^^^^
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Old 02-15-2013, 09:37 PM
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Thanks all, I really need to get a pair of calipers, (please don't yell at me,.for not having them already)
I think it's my bullet seater adjustment, I'm gonna call a friend about it tommorow. The bulge bit is hard to describe in words. It is probably just the die adjustments.
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Old 02-16-2013, 08:39 AM
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You definitely need calipers! They could be the most important part of reloading safely.

I'm guessing the bulge you are referring to is just the bullet as it was seated in the resized case.

It's not uncommon to see the impression of the newly reloaded bullet.......if that's what you are seeing.

I don't know what kind of gun you have but it should be easy enough to see how well your loaded rounds fit in your chamber.

They should drop in and fall out easily!
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Old 02-16-2013, 09:48 AM
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When my dad got home last night, he looked at it. The dies are Hornady custom mark 3, When I go to put the crimp on it, the die shaves off part of the brass. I'm pretty confused
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:10 AM
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First off, you need to measure your case length.

I always lightly ream my case mouth (in between trimming) inside and out before charging and seating.

Is it possible the shavings you are seeing are copper?

If so, you need to lightly ream or set your die to where you get a little better bell on the case for seating.

Do Not put a roll crimp in it. If you are using a Lee crimp die, then you are alright. Your seating die, properly adjusted should give you a good taper crmip before it begins to roll the crimp.

Magnum revolver rounds and rounds fed out of a tube magazine need a good roll crimp.

A 9mm headspaces on the case mouth, length is real important, so is having a somwhat square case mouth
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:33 PM
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Red Dot has a large volume for it's weight. It's nearly impossible to double charge a case, which makes it good for beginners
3.7 gr should be the start load,4.1 should be the max load, with the numbers you provided.
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Old 02-16-2013, 02:46 PM
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A compressed load is usually more accurate simply because it has a more uniform burn rate.

Think of a gallon milk container, half full of milk, as similar to your brass cartridge half full of powder only.

Now turn that gallon of milk on its side, like your cartridge is, when loaded in your gun. All that space above the milk is similar to the area that can be exposed to flame from the primer in your round, that is wasted and not burning powder, or just burning the surface of the powder below it.

Old competition shooters that used lighter loads, used to load things like sawdust, oatmeal, cardboard, etc... to fill the space so the powder on the bottom was evenly distributed around the primer even when the case was on its side.

I load 3.5gr Unique (flake powder) in 9mm when loading 147gr STHP's. Those are long bullets so it still is a compressed load, same as when I load 5.5gr of Unique when loading 115gr Winchester 9mm bullets.

As far as the bulge you are describing, I get that too in my 9mm. When I load rifle brass, the deprimer rod has a "ball" on it, that resizes the mouth/neck of the cartridge both going in and coming out, while depriming/resizing. 9mm does not do this, instead, it sizes the case, then you have a seperate die to bell the mouth to accept a bullet. Minimal belling is best, just enough to accept this bullet. If the bullet just barely sits in the mouth, when you force it down below that with the seating die, the brass is stretched slightly to accomodate the bullet, and you can tell where the base of the bullet is in the brass sometimes.

If you had a cannelured bullet, you would crimp the mouth of the case into the cannelure. I do not load cannelured bullets, but I use the lee factory crimp die that came with my Lee 4-die set (sizer, expander, seater, and crimp). You can crimp the bullet just using the seater but that is for cannelures.

Use the factory crimp die, and if you do not have one, buy a LEE FACTORY CRIMP DIE for the caliber you are loading.

As for brass shavings, I have had those too, using Redding competition seating dies in 223, but ONLY when using Federal brass. You can change up your brass and see if this fixes the problem, or you can chamfer/debur your cases prior to sizing, and again prior to seating the bullet. If you do this two-step debur/chamfer, you tend to cull more brass, because you cannot chamfer/debur brass that has deformed mouths, due to the out of roundness resulting in uneven wear on the mouth and shaving more brass on one side, and none on the other.

Hope this helps.
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Old 02-16-2013, 03:11 PM
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A quick aside for all the New reloaders reading Xelera's Excellent Post: You need to understand that as you add "Stuffing" over your powder, it acts by itself just like you put a Heavier Bullet over that powder charge. That means that unless you further reduce the charge, you can get overpressures. This sort of Stuff is for Very Experienced Reloaders. Do Not Try this without direction from someone You Trust With Your Fingers and Eyes helping!

Reloading is Fun, Increases Your Enjoyment of the Hobby. BUT, Remember - You Do NOT want to become a "Test Pilot"!!!
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Old 02-16-2013, 10:26 PM
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Thanks all, I figured out what my problem is, a base of being inexperienced and not being used to crimping the bullet in the case. Called a friend of ours who owns a gunshop down the road. All I had to do was back the die out a quarter of a turn.

ManyFeathers, a set of Lyman calipers are on their way.....
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Old 02-17-2013, 02:41 PM
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Consider buying one of these for each caliber you reload:
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/888465/

Gives you a quick go-no-go test on each round you load.
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