SHTF. You can only grab one rifle: Which do you take? - Page 39 - Survivalist Forum
Survivalist Forum

Advertise Here

Go Back   Survivalist Forum > >
Articles Classifieds Donations Gallery Groups Links Store Survival Files


Notices

Firearms General Discussion Rifles, pistols, shotguns, scopes, grips and everything in between.

Advertise Here
Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rethinking SHTF Rifle And Ammunition Stockpile kev Military Weapons Forum 147 02-11-2019 08:42 AM
Pellet Rifle Myths. nomadshooter Firearms General Discussion 14 12-25-2017 01:55 PM
Extreme cold weather considerations johnmcd Military Weapons Forum 108 12-22-2017 09:59 PM
Russian SVT 40 7.62x45r Semi Auto Rifle (Used) Cope's Distribuitng Cope's Distributing 0 06-05-2017 08:50 AM
Japanese Arisaka Type 99 Bolt Action Sporterized Rifle w/Monte Carlo Stock (USED) Cope's Distribuitng Cope's Distributing 0 05-17-2017 01:21 PM

View Poll Results: SHTF - Which do you grab?
AR15 / M16 type system 168 69.14%
AK-47 or similar system 42 17.28%
M14 type system 33 13.58%
Voters: 243. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-02-2019, 11:47 AM
fragout's Avatar
fragout fragout is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 6,348
Thanks: 5,535
Thanked 6,710 Times in 3,479 Posts
Default



Advertise Here

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel8 View Post
Yup!
I'm running both the POF revolution and the Scar 17's. Don't believe POF on weight vs. the Scar. They are the same. But Scar is way more reliable.
I'm sending my POF back for service cause it keeps jamming empty brass in the chamber. If not for that though I was having a huge time debating with myself which one i like better.

SO if comparing and ar15 with an older style heavy battle rifle i too would go ar15. But my Scar's and Ar10's are all in the 8lb category.
They have similar enough recoil that it's worth it to go 7.62nato.
The capacity of a 25 round sr25 mag is close enough.
You get more distance and penetration.

NOW in a military unit... why 5.56 vs 7.62 I don't know. They all have their reasons. But in an tEOTWASKI scenario its the way to go.
But for night operations like that video said 5.56 makes more sense.
Have both!
It is not a " 5.56mm vs 7.62x51mm" per say in the Army Infantry at squad level. In short......both.

FWIW. .... That is what I do for a living .

Weight of ammo:

20rd M14/ pmag/ Sacr17/ FAL/ G3 topped off with M80A1 is 1.4 to 1.7 lbs each.
30rd M4 mag topped off with M855A1 is 1.2 to 1.3 lbs each.

Note: 30rd AK mags have a large variation in terms of weight per loaded mag. Since this is one of the rifles listed in this thread.........

Rifle in pic below ( M14S/ Arms 18 optics mount/ sling/ modified stock/ topped off CMI SS 20rd magazine )......as pictured = 9.9 lbs
The difference in total bare naked dry weight between this rifle and a SCAR17 is 4.8 ounces.

11B
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	20190727_134128.jpg
Views:	19
Size:	45.2 KB
ID:	291290  
Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to fragout For This Useful Post:
Old 09-02-2019, 12:20 PM
PalmettoTree PalmettoTree is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 13,980
Thanks: 2,843
Thanked 18,886 Times in 7,922 Posts
Default

My AR 15 is not the one I prefer to shoot but it is the one I prefer to fight with. That said in a situational choice I prefer to be a sniper. In that case the AR 15 is not my preferred choice. In any case I hope I have one of my handguns also.
Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to PalmettoTree For This Useful Post:
Old 09-02-2019, 12:47 PM
Mike IE Mike IE is offline
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Southeast WI
Posts: 14
Thanks: 4
Thanked 17 Times in 8 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForgedInTheFlame View Post
SHTF "Red Dawn" style and you can only take one of:

AK-47
AR-15
M14


Which do you reach for and why?



Sent from my Note 8 using Tapatalk
I never owned an assault type weapon until I finally bought a panzer arms ar-12. It is a 12 gauge semi auto shot gun. With [2] 5 round mags and [3] 10 round mags. I feel this is the only weapon I need to protect my home.
Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to Mike IE For This Useful Post:
Old 09-02-2019, 03:57 PM
ForgedInTheFlame's Avatar
ForgedInTheFlame ForgedInTheFlame is offline
Fix Bayonets!
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 6,204
Thanks: 22,333
Thanked 9,808 Times in 4,199 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike IE View Post
I never owned an assault type weapon until I finally bought a panzer arms ar-12. It is a 12 gauge semi auto shot gun. With [2] 5 round mags and [3] 10 round mags. I feel this is the only weapon I need to protect my home.
Well said.

I've never fired a semi shotty. Sounds like a great weapon for home defense.

Sent from my Note 8 using Tapatalk
Quick reply to this message
Old 09-03-2019, 09:23 AM
NCalHippie's Avatar
NCalHippie NCalHippie is online now
Survivor
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 14,045
Thanks: 30,602
Thanked 25,575 Times in 9,716 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForgedInTheFlame View Post
Well said.

I've never fired a semi shotty. Sounds like a great weapon for home defense.

Sent from my Note 8 using Tapatalk
I had my model 1100 set up with 9 rounds in the tube and 1 in the chamber. Haven't gotten around to putting a mag extension on the replacement. Fun to shoot.
Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to NCalHippie For This Useful Post:
Old 09-03-2019, 10:58 AM
ForgedInTheFlame's Avatar
ForgedInTheFlame ForgedInTheFlame is offline
Fix Bayonets!
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 6,204
Thanks: 22,333
Thanked 9,808 Times in 4,199 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NCalHippie View Post
I had my model 1100 set up with 9 rounds in the tube and 1 in the chamber. Haven't gotten around to putting a mag extension on the replacement. Fun to shoot.
Decent recoil I assume?

Sent from my Note 8 using Tapatalk
Quick reply to this message
Old 09-03-2019, 11:21 AM
Vodka Wizard's Avatar
Vodka Wizard Vodka Wizard is offline
Prepared
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Posts: 396
Thanks: 229
Thanked 617 Times in 268 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NCalHippie View Post
I had my model 1100 set up with 9 rounds in the tube and 1 in the chamber. Haven't gotten around to putting a mag extension on the replacement. Fun to shoot.
Love my 1100. It's a pure skeet gun in my setup, though.
Quick reply to this message
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Vodka Wizard For This Useful Post:
Old 09-05-2019, 11:01 AM
NCalHippie's Avatar
NCalHippie NCalHippie is online now
Survivor
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 14,045
Thanks: 30,602
Thanked 25,575 Times in 9,716 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vodka Wizard View Post
Love my 1100. It's a pure skeet gun in my setup, though.
Yes, great gun! The biggest problem with 9 in the tube is that it gets very front heavy.
Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to NCalHippie For This Useful Post:
Old 09-05-2019, 12:11 PM
Marlin94's Avatar
Marlin94 Marlin94 is online now
Survivor
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Virginia
Posts: 4,038
Thanks: 7,216
Thanked 7,289 Times in 2,525 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NCalHippie View Post
Yes, great gun! The biggest problem with 9 in the tube is that it gets very front heavy.
Yep, I'm perfectly content with my CZ712 with a 4+1 capacity for this very reason. After several hours in the field the light weight is welcomed.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
Quick reply to this message
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Marlin94 For This Useful Post:
Old 09-05-2019, 07:24 PM
Daniel8 Daniel8 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Maine
Posts: 120
Thanks: 3
Thanked 181 Times in 74 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fragout View Post
It is not a " 5.56mm vs 7.62x51mm" per say in the Army Infantry at squad level. In short......both.

FWIW. .... That is what I do for a living .

Weight of ammo:

20rd M14/ pmag/ Sacr17/ FAL/ G3 topped off with M80A1 is 1.4 to 1.7 lbs each.
30rd M4 mag topped off with M855A1 is 1.2 to 1.3 lbs each.

Note: 30rd AK mags have a large variation in terms of weight per loaded mag. Since this is one of the rifles listed in this thread.........

Rifle in pic below ( M14S/ Arms 18 optics mount/ sling/ modified stock/ topped off CMI SS 20rd magazine )......as pictured = 9.9 lbs
The difference in total bare naked dry weight between this rifle and a SCAR17 is 4.8 ounces.

11B

Yeah, I have both LOL. I do honestly lean to 7.62nato for SHTF for the distance and barriers. But would rather shoot 5.56 TBH. When it comes down to it I honestly believe that most preppers who are doing any significant stocking of ammo that they get 5.56 cause its cheaper and then convince themselves because of weight and other things that 7.62nato isn't needed. I started that way. Got a handful of rifles. Shot the **** out of em, bought TONS of rounds and then rethought the load out and got the larger rifle. Yeah, it's a lot more weight I agree. ANd that is something to take into consideration. But it's also pretty cool that most will be carrying 5.56 who are shooting back and I'll have the .308 round to penetrate barriers and reach out that extra few hundred yards. Then again I'm patrolling a retreat from scavengers who will prob have 5.56 or a .308 bolt gun.
I see you posts and think that you and a handful of others are pretty much all the sense I'm finding round here
Quick reply to this message
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Daniel8 For This Useful Post:
Old 09-09-2019, 11:38 PM
pfc0311's Avatar
pfc0311 pfc0311 is offline
Prepared
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Louisville,Ky.
Age: 70
Posts: 281
Thanks: 27
Thanked 290 Times in 194 Posts
Default

I have a very good shooting Ruger AR 556 rifle.
Quick reply to this message
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to pfc0311 For This Useful Post:
Old 09-10-2019, 11:56 PM
Herkemer's Avatar
Herkemer Herkemer is offline
Shill for the Federal Gov
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 363
Thanks: 442
Thanked 396 Times in 204 Posts
Default

Going with the AR.
Used it when I was in and am very familiar with how it works. I have a few of them and all of the "Support" kinda things to support them, the least being having more than one. Not saying its the end all be all, but, as I am getting older, I can still hump it down the block if need be
Quick reply to this message
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Herkemer For This Useful Post:
Old 09-12-2019, 04:28 AM
ROCK6's Avatar
ROCK6 ROCK6 is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Georgia/Virginia
Posts: 5,968
Thanks: 6,943
Thanked 13,732 Times in 4,424 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel8 View Post
Yeah, I have both LOL. I do honestly lean to 7.62nato for SHTF for the distance and barriers. But would rather shoot 5.56 TBH. When it comes down to it I honestly believe that most preppers who are doing any significant stocking of ammo that they get 5.56 cause its cheaper and then convince themselves because of weight and other things that 7.62nato isn't needed. I started that way. Got a handful of rifles. Shot the **** out of em, bought TONS of rounds and then rethought the load out and got the larger rifle. Yeah, it's a lot more weight I agree. ANd that is something to take into consideration.
I think this is exactly how one forms their opinions and decisions. I don't think a single answer will fit everyone's situation or requirement, but making a decision needs not only an environment, but training and testing. Fragout makes a good point as it's really not an either/or, but what is the best choice. I'm having great luck with my POF Revolution in .308, but I'm now shifted almost exclusively to an AR15 pistol as my primary training firearm. Most of my dynamic stuff is done inside 100 meters and the DDM4V7 in 5.56 is more than adequate. That doesn't mean I ignore training and shooting beyond 100 meters, I just have to balance my focus. What I do like is the POF has proven very effective out to 500 meters for me and with similar AR-controls, transitioning is easier.

The good news is that if I have to bug-anywhere and in a vehicle, I will be grabbing more than just one

ROCK6
Quick reply to this message
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to ROCK6 For This Useful Post:
Old 09-13-2019, 07:00 AM
Not PC's Avatar
Not PC Not PC is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Montana
Age: 42
Posts: 231
Thanks: 581
Thanked 401 Times in 164 Posts
Default

Considering where I live, the right answer is an AR-10. However, I went AR-15 when I started prepping so that's not an option for me.

I don't live in urban area where I think I'd need my AR. If SHTF out here, I'd be much more likely to shoot at food vice bad guys. My plan is to take my hunting rifle and have some ammo/cleaning supply caches around.
Quick reply to this message
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Not PC For This Useful Post:
Old 09-13-2019, 07:40 AM
TENNGRIZZ TENNGRIZZ is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: IN TRANSITION
Posts: 8,131
Thanks: 145,675
Thanked 23,204 Times in 6,299 Posts
Default

I am going with my Ruger Mini- 14 and Taurus 1911 if I had never been a Marine my choices would probably be a Marlin 30/30 and a 357 revolver of some sort. the dope behind the weapon is more important than the dope on the weapon. Jmho and S/FI
Quick reply to this message
The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to TENNGRIZZ For This Useful Post:
Old 09-14-2019, 01:39 PM
fragout's Avatar
fragout fragout is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 6,348
Thanks: 5,535
Thanked 6,710 Times in 3,479 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel8 View Post
Yeah, I have both LOL. I do honestly lean to 7.62nato for SHTF for the distance and barriers. But would rather shoot 5.56 TBH. When it comes down to it I honestly believe that most preppers who are doing any significant stocking of ammo that they get 5.56 cause its cheaper and then convince themselves because of weight and other things that 7.62nato isn't needed. I started that way. Got a handful of rifles. Shot the **** out of em, bought TONS of rounds and then rethought the load out and got the larger rifle. Yeah, it's a lot more weight I agree. ANd that is something to take into consideration. But it's also pretty cool that most will be carrying 5.56 who are shooting back and I'll have the .308 round to penetrate barriers and reach out that extra few hundred yards. Then again I'm patrolling a retreat from scavengers who will prob have 5.56 or a .308 bolt gun.
I see you posts and think that you and a handful of others are pretty much all the sense I'm finding round here
Started out similar here, although our " low cost centerfire load has always been 7.62x39mm.....especially in a 125gr JSP .

And similar to you.....our primary plans include defending what is ours ...primarily from looters ( scavengers) if balloon goes up. From personal experience, 7.62x51mm is a substantial gain over 5.56mm in terms of terminal performance as well as barriers......as well as a few other reasons. ( 1 example not mentioned as much here = night hunting.....in which 7.62x51mm has a huge advantage overall.)

Unlike my day job, I see individual rifles with riflemen behind them as a higher priority simply because we wont have the same ability to generate the same level of combat power either. Among other requirements that the Army does not need ( Hunting for example), 7.62x51mm/ 308 win makes for the more logical solution as our groups primary centerfire cartridge overall. ( " Prolonged firefights" are much less an issue vs our primary threats either)

As for weight, overall loadout is quite different compared to the bugout idea where everything to survive is attempted by stuffing it into a rucksack and moving on foot for days at a time. More emphasis here towards an extremely reliable semiauto chambered in 7.62x51mm with a typical security minded ammo load of seven 20rd M14 mags, combined with group rehearsed tactics iot improve as a group. ( Pic below shows one set up with ten 20rd mags, 2 qts of water, and a small pack.
Note: XD in photo replaced with sidearm in 2nd photo. ( Primary reasons : Very low cost, lightweight, compact , " quiet" ammo and a means to justify small game .....other than trapping.)

11B
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	20180629_153715.jpg
Views:	27
Size:	54.1 KB
ID:	291752  
Attached Images
 
Quick reply to this message
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to fragout For This Useful Post:
Old 09-14-2019, 07:34 PM
OldCorps's Avatar
OldCorps OldCorps is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Midwest Arkansas
Posts: 2,678
Thanks: 3,677
Thanked 5,596 Times in 1,881 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kl0an View Post
Yes I do.

My next purchase will more than likely be a Keltec P-30 which is a .22 magnum caliber pistol with a 30 rounds magazine.

Ohh, I'm sorry, should that have been clip??
I have the kel-tec sub2000, 9mm glock mags. Matches wife and my pistols. I also have the PMR-30, .22 mag pistol. I really like it. It shoots extremely accurate. It would mess up anyone's day.
Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to OldCorps For This Useful Post:
Old 09-14-2019, 08:20 PM
brashears9567 brashears9567 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Age: 41
Posts: 37
Thanks: 411
Thanked 86 Times in 30 Posts
Default

Ar pistol. 10.5" and runs like a champ.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to brashears9567 For This Useful Post:
Old 09-15-2019, 01:12 PM
ForgedInTheFlame's Avatar
ForgedInTheFlame ForgedInTheFlame is offline
Fix Bayonets!
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 6,204
Thanks: 22,333
Thanked 9,808 Times in 4,199 Posts
Default

a.) AR
b.) Pistol

Pick one

Sent from my Note 8 using Tapatalk
Quick reply to this message
Old 09-15-2019, 07:31 PM
fragout's Avatar
fragout fragout is offline
Survivor
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 6,348
Thanks: 5,535
Thanked 6,710 Times in 3,479 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ROCK6 View Post
I think this is exactly how one forms their opinions and decisions. I don't think a single answer will fit everyone's situation or requirement, but making a decision needs not only an environment, but training and testing. Fragout makes a good point as it's really not an either/or, but what is the best choice. I'm having great luck with my POF Revolution in .308, but I'm now shifted almost exclusively to an AR15 pistol as my primary training firearm. Most of my dynamic stuff is done inside 100 meters and the DDM4V7 in 5.56 is more than adequate. That doesn't mean I ignore training and shooting beyond 100 meters, I just have to balance my focus. What I do like is the POF has proven very effective out to 500 meters for me and with similar AR-controls, transitioning is easier.

The good news is that if I have to bug-anywhere and in a vehicle, I will be grabbing more than just one

ROCK6
Agreed. For example...... Folks who cannot identify threats at 500+ yards would or could drop a requirement for a cartridge capable of dealing with a threat at that distance altogether. Same applies to hunting large game at those distances as well.

Also have more confidence in 7.62x51mm at distances inside 100 yards vs the common items multiple threats could use as cover, barriers, and vehicles. ( Same with 7.62x39mm for that matter)
As you mentioned, testing / training has proven either to be a better choice here, and better suits our overall analysis, mindset, doctrine, strategies, and tactics concerning future threats as well as a direct means of gathering protein to supplement our primary means . ( Raising livestock, fish, and trapping for examples .)

The AK pistol is simply a compromise weapon that serves duty out of convenience when the primary tasks are more of an " administrative" nature .......and doesn't replace the M14 in the perimeter security role......if you are trackin the meaning here.


Also agree in regards to taking multiple boomsticks along if forced to bug out in a vehicle, provided it does not interfere with other items included in the load plan, and those boomsticks are chambered in something that our cache program supports.

As for other logistical issues ( namely a plan to self sustain long term on foot only), 5.56mm has some merit compared to 7.62x51mm, but in my experience......not enough, and where 22lr is a very enticing choice vs weight and available space. ( This includes the cart and/ or bicycle ideas once put into practice.....)

We have several of what you see in below pic.....if vehicles were not being utilized for a long duration permanent withdrawal.
Note: Livestock is also "self mobile" to a certain extent.


11B
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	pack set 4.jpg
Views:	26
Size:	62.3 KB
ID:	291826  
Quick reply to this message
The Following User Says Thank You to fragout For This Useful Post:
Reply

Bookmarks



Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Survivalist Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:
Gender
Insurance
Please select your insurance company (Optional)

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:23 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright © Kevin Felts 2006 - 2015,
Green theme by http://www.themesbydesign.net