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Old 03-09-2016, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by CORangefinder View Post
In reading some of the responses, I get the impression quite a few are planning to be on the move at the peak of a fully evolved event. It's poor planning and judgment to say the least, in my opinion and experience--parallel to those who waited for Katrina to be in full force on top of them and deciding it was finally time to get to higher ground.
I think your making an assumption in error.

It's no "be on the move"

It's potentially "be caught while on the move"

Again: Forrest Gump.
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Old 03-09-2016, 03:29 PM
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It always depends on the specific situation you're encountering. This is why I keep 'combat' stuff in a separate add-on bag. If I don't need it at all I don't need to carry the weight. If I do, then I can quickly dump as much of the bag as needed to leave me with an appropriate weight for the threat.
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Old 03-09-2016, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Nomad, 2nd View Post
I think your making an assumption in error.

It's no "be on the move"

It's potentially "be caught while on the move"

Again: Forrest Gump.
Hence, move before being caught moving is an issue. Not always possible, but I believe it is in most cases. Civil unrest and rioting don't generally happen spontaniously. There was at least 2 days warning before Katrina. There was a mandatory evacuation 20 hours before.
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Old 03-09-2016, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Nomad, 2nd View Post
I think your making an assumption in error.

It's no "be on the move"

It's potentially "be caught while on the move"

Again: Forrest Gump.
Break it down however you choose. But it's still the same beast. We're talking about a BOB or GHB. If you've waited till things have evolved to that point to be caught in the open where several hundred extra rounds is necessary or not enough, you have holes in your planning and procedures that a full battle rattle isn't going to likely solve. If you're bugging out, you have a location, routes, and contingencies in order. If you've done your homework, then you should know what kind of time you need for those routes under a variety of conditions, and how move within them. This is not uncharted territory. Everyone has a little different situation, but the dynamics of things most likely to occur in any given area are predictable.
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Old 03-09-2016, 08:16 PM
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Hence, move before being caught moving is an issue. Not always possible, but I believe it is in most cases. Civil unrest and rioting don't generally happen spontaniously. There was at least 2 days warning before Katrina. There was a mandatory evacuation 20 hours before.
I ABSOLUTELY AGREE with "in most cases".
But "in most cases" don't need my spair tire, the first aid kit in my car, or Good Sam. (Not to mention my insurance.)

This forum isn't about the usual.

The unusual can kill.
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Break it down however you choose. But it's still the same beast. We're talking about a BOB or GHB. If you've waited till things have evolved to that point to be caught in the open where several hundred extra rounds is necessary or not enough, you have holes in your planning and procedures that a full battle rattle isn't going to likely solve . If you're bugging out, you have a location, routes, and contingencies in order. If you've done your homework, then you should know what kind of time you need for those routes under a variety of conditions, and how move within them. This is not uncharted territory. Everyone has a little different situation, but the dynamics of things most likely to occur in any given area are predictable.

Good to know that you can predict earthquakes, acts of terrorism, CME, etc.

Does the government know about these superpowers of yours?
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Old 03-09-2016, 09:21 PM
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It doesn't take super powers, crystal ball, or tarot cards to know what kinds of impacts any of these events has on an area. Nor is it a phenomenon to have some understanding of how social order is affected. I'm not sure if you might remember or not the massive quake in 89 that dumped buildings, collapsed overpasses and road structures. I do. I don't seem to remember too many gun battles. 9/11? There's your terrorist attacks. I don't recall battles breaking out there before, during, or after the towers fell. EMP's etc still aren't going devolve into a social breakdown immediately. Do your homework if you haven't already experienced some of these yourself.
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Old 03-10-2016, 02:14 AM
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Originally Posted by CORangefinder View Post
It doesn't take super powers, crystal ball, or tarot cards to know what kinds of impacts any of these events has on an area. Nor is it a phenomenon to have some understanding of how social order is affected. I'm not sure if you might remember or not the massive quake in 89 that dumped buildings, collapsed overpasses and road structures. I do. I don't seem to remember too many gun battles. 9/11? There's your terrorist attacks. I don't recall battles breaking out there before, during, or after the towers fell. EMP's etc still aren't going devolve into a social breakdown immediately. Do your homework if you haven't already experienced some of these yourself.

Homework? I have a Bachelor's degree in the subject! (Graduated with Honors BTW)

I won't claim to be a SME, I'd say I know a BIT more about thd subject than most.


Rare:
certainly.
As you pretend:
Not hardly.


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=26ToSKdfeRY
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Old 03-10-2016, 05:13 AM
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Rodney king, yes--great example. Now take a look at the timeline and how the events evolved. I could see something along these lines sparking in small but multiple clusters of ghettos if something was to happen to their freebie king while in office. You'll also note that the open firefights of koreatown were a day after the first events began and began to propagate through other areas. nice try though. They originally developed from local Korean residents arming and protecting their property and businesses from looting and rioters much the same way places and people in Ferguson did. There's another one you can spend time with. Racial outbreaks in the so-called minority groups is volatile. If your bug out plan routes through the ghetto, I can see your desire for more ammo. You'd get farther with an MRAP.
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Old 03-10-2016, 06:25 AM
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I thought the forum was about survival, and the best survival tactic is to avoid situations that will get you killed. Maybe you can, but I can't think of a situation in my lifetime where reading the signs and bugging out in time wouldn't have totally avoided armed civil unrest or rioters.
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Old 03-10-2016, 06:42 AM
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Why not keep a few magazine bandoliers, fully loaded with the bug out bag but not in it.

If you have to flee, you assess the situation, your means of transport, and then grab the bandoliers for the weapons you are taking.

I went through this dilemma. I have several guns, some specialized for certain scenarios. In a Bug Out situation, I might grab one over the other, or if I have people with me or a vehicle, grab all of them. I dont want to fumbling with loose mags, or just mix all the hk, ak, ar, glock, beretta, etc mags in one bag. If each gun has one or more 6 mag bandoliers specific to it, it makes life much simpler.

I picked up a few surplus ar ones on amazon last week for like $11



https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00P4...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

You can buy pistol and ak ones on midwayusa for about the same:



http://ads.midwayusa.com/product/434...FYMdgQodu7MESQ


Also I think it needs to be said that this thread has began to go way off topic and has become too personal for some of you. We all live in different sections of the country or even the world and are planning for different events. What you think you may need is different from what somone else may need.


For instance:
I live in South East FL, between Miami and West Palm in a little city called Ft Lauderdale. I can drive up and down I95 from Miami to West Palm and never leave a city, they just flow from one to the next. Florida also happens to have the highest concealed weapons permit issued of any state. We have also issued multiple state of emergencies in the last 15 years including being uder one right now for Zika. On top of that I speak English and am white, which makes me a minority. I commute up to 45min each way in gridlock traffic. I prepare most for hurricanes (only had to ride through 5 so far), but the reality is, if there is any event, its not like I can get home quick. My AO is all urban, and given the ccw issuances, everyone is armed.

For me, my get home bag consists of a plate carrier, steel plates, 3 pistol mags, ham radio, and a flashlight. I also have an small back pack with some ration bars, bottles of water, first aid kit, iosat tabs, gas mask, hoodie, tshirt, jeans, boots, ball cap, AK pistol and bandolier.

Even though im most likely to encounter a hurricane and have 3 days to prepare for it and "hunker down". The reality is, if something happens while im at work, based on the traffic on a normal day let alone in a disaster, I may not be able to get home, and it may require a firefight to do so.

Now if I lived in the corn fields of Nebraska, I dont think Id need an assault rifle and plate carrier, Id probably be carring a sleeping bag, shovel, heat source, etc.

It is human nature to fall into the frenzy of pack mentality. Ive seen it first hand. If something big enough happens people go crazy (just look at how people act on black friday).

All Im saying is after reading the past 5 pages, most people have been squabbling over what scenario the OP is talking about, and how their logic is more right then somone elses. I think we should all just step back and take a look at the fact that everones AO is different, and we will each plan differently based on our AO and probable emergencies, and in doing so try to offer experience instead of trying to one up somone else.

This forum should be about helping one another, not tearing eachother down.
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Old 03-10-2016, 07:59 AM
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While we may have drifted from the OP, I don't think there have been any real attacks or tearing down of others. I know I don't feel that way.
And to answer your first sentence, I said earlier that I do have a rifle, shotgun, pistol and ammo that I can grab if needed, just that I feel 99% of the time it shouldn't be needed. I'd be more likely to toss them in the truck just because I don't want to leave them behind.
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Old 03-10-2016, 08:31 AM
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Part of planning for the worst is planning how to avoid it. Leaving before the storm hits. Moving again if it looks like I didn't go far enough and it is worse than first thought. My family doesn't go from ft Lauderdale to Daytona for a hurricane. They go to Illinois or Iowa. They have been through several and have never seen armed conflict.
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Originally Posted by CORangefinder View Post
No, I plan to maintain as much control over my particular outcome as I can. That means keeping ahead of the curve. Many things are predictable by simply paying attention to patterns, people are no different. Plan accordingly. Do you play chess? If you aren't thinking of moves and strategy beyond your current position, you find yourself in a corner pretty quickly. This is no different.

You both seem to think you can see the future.
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Old 03-10-2016, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by CORangefinder View Post
In reading some of the responses, I get the impression quite a few are planning to be on the move at the peak of a fully evolved event. It's poor planning and judgment to say the least, in my opinion and experience--parallel to those who waited for Katrina to be in full force on top of them and deciding it was finally time to get to higher ground.
You MUST be able to see the future if you know exactly when something bad is going to happen to you.
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Old 03-10-2016, 08:33 AM
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Hence, move before being caught moving is an issue. Not always possible, but I believe it is in most cases. Civil unrest and rioting don't generally happen spontaniously. There was at least 2 days warning before Katrina. There was a mandatory evacuation 20 hours before.
Which tells me you were not in the area and are talking about something you did not know. So, how is that future knowledge working out for ya?
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Old 03-10-2016, 08:34 AM
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I thought the forum was about survival, and the best survival tactic is to avoid situations that will get you killed. Maybe you can, but I can't think of a situation in my lifetime where reading the signs and bugging out in time wouldn't have totally avoided armed civil unrest or rioters.
Then why are you 'preaching' about maintaining a lack of supplies since you will 'never' need them? That is pretty unprepared.
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Old 03-10-2016, 08:35 AM
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While we may have drifted from the OP, I don't think there have been any real attacks or tearing down of others. I know I don't feel that way.
And to answer your first sentence, I said earlier that I do have a rifle, shotgun, pistol and ammo that I can grab if needed, just that I feel 99% of the time it shouldn't be needed. I'd be more likely to toss them in the truck just because I don't want to leave them behind.
So wait. You have the supplies we all have been talking about, ready to go, but are trying to convince others not to carry them?

Wow.
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Old 03-10-2016, 09:16 AM
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JDBushcraft,
I wasnt directly addressing you in my last post, it was a generalization on the whole thread. The whole thread was going down hill two pages earlier. For instance the last 5 posts above this one offer no valuable information. Thats all I was addressing.

I wasnt trying to single anyone out, I just think we all could be more productive sharing ideas of pro and cons on how to carry our ammo and how much in Bug Out as the OP had asked.

To add more info on my personal loadouts. Any of my rigs or plate carriers have between 4-6 rifle 30rd mags and 3 pistol mags. If I want additional ammo its in bandoliers, because any more on the rig itself is too heavy and bandoliers make it easier to add or remove quickly based on need. I also dont have to rip apart my BOB or GHB to find them.
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Old 03-10-2016, 09:34 AM
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You MUST be able to see the future if you know exactly when something bad is going to happen to you.
Brother, there's no reason to get all butt-hurt. You want to pack extra ammo, it's your pack--not mine. I know what good logistics can provide and how it affects what I need. Take it or leave it -- pretty simple. What I've pointed out was that many of the events that would cause a bug out or bug home have already happened at some level. Compare timeline information from multiple occurrences and you will see similarities in many areas. Where there are differences, you can tie them to a cause easier. If it's a type of event you are likely to face, then yes--in a way it is your crystal ball, glimpse at the professor's answer sheet, whatever. Nothing will ever be exact, but a little foresight can go a long way.
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Old 03-10-2016, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by CORangefinder View Post
Brother, there's no reason to get all butt-hurt. You want to pack extra ammo, it's your pack--not mine. I know what good logistics can provide and how it affects what I need. Take it or leave it -- pretty simple. What I've pointed out was that many of the events that would cause a bug out or bug home have already happened at some level. Compare timeline information from multiple occurrences and you will see similarities in many areas. Where there are differences, you can tie them to a cause easier. If it's a type of event you are likely to face, then yes--in a way it is your crystal ball, glimpse at the professor's answer sheet, whatever. Nothing will ever be exact, but a little foresight can go a long way.
Like I said, you are blaming people for not being able to see the future.
What are next week's lottery numbers?

You don't plan for the best scenario, you make plans for a variety and worst scenarios (to the best of your ability). If you are just a 'sunny day' person, when bad things happen they will bite you and cause you pain.
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Old 03-10-2016, 09:44 AM
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So wait. You have the supplies we all have been talking about, ready to go, but are trying to convince others not to carry them?

Wow.
I have never once said not to carry anything. I said, in almost every situation paying attention and leaving at the right time can keep you out of a situation where they are needed.
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