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Old 07-09-2019, 02:15 PM
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We are family 3 plus 2 little dogs great alarm system. How do you plan to get through first 30 then what? We're storing gathering but limited space. We know basics interested in apartment dwelkers strategies. Add to those challenges firearms difficult to obtain and expensive!
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Old 07-09-2019, 10:24 PM
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We are family 3 plus 2 little dogs great alarm system. How do you plan to get through first 30 then what? We're storing gathering but limited space. We know basics interested in apartment dwelkers strategies. Add to those challenges firearms difficult to obtain and expensive!
FIRST question?
Where are you located?
Your sentence construction means English may be a 2nd language
ergo
do you live in the USA?
If not...

Only reason I ask is the answers good for one country may need to be entirely different for another, what may be available, what can be procured, what can be shipped...?

ie A response of "find a vacant piece of ground nearby and dig a pit to store extra items." is not a good operative if you live in permafrost or you are iced over half the year.
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Old 07-09-2019, 10:51 PM
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First, welcome to the forum!

Your question is extremely broad. I agree with NW GUY, knowing your [general] location would be helpful. Knowing the types of threats you have in mind helps, too.

Others have a lot more experience than I and can offer detailed advice and ask better questions than I, but I'll offer some general advice, including this threat analysis matrix I made when I first started doing this about 2 years ago. Link below:

https://www.survivalistboards.com/sh...2#post19140372

Your details will differ from mine, but the matrix will help narrow down exactly what kinds of events you're preparing for, which will bring clarity and focus to your efforts, which you need when you have limited resources (I can relate to that).

Second tip, prioritize your preps in the same way as the matrix prioritizes threats--the top priorities are high-damage, high-probability threats, like retirement. If you're unprepared, retirement (especially forced retirement) can wreck your life. Similar thing for preps--the top priorities are high-need high-probability preps.

Third, start small and don't feel like you have to do it all at once.

Fourth, don't overemphasize equipment at the expense of skills and knowledge. Seeds will start a garden, but they need a gardener to end up as food.

Last thing, read a lot. This forum is a great place to start--the search function is useful, or just browse thread titles. I read stuff on here for probably 12-18 months before I started posting much.
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Old 07-09-2019, 11:12 PM
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If the power goes out apartments will be unsustainable after 30 days.
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Old 07-09-2019, 11:49 PM
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First, welcome to the forum!

Your question is extremely broad. I agree with NW GUY, knowing your [general] location would be helpful. Knowing the types of threats you have in mind helps, too.

.
ThAT is what I thought.
If in the US one set of suggestions works
If he lives in Beirut that is a different situation
If he lives in Yemeni...time to leave.
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Old 07-10-2019, 09:11 AM
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I had an article published on survivalblog.com a while back that discusses some short-term survival options in an urban environment that might be useful:

https://survivalblog.com/surviving-u...nt-part-1-j-m/
https://survivalblog.com/surviving-u...nt-part-2-j-m/
https://survivalblog.com/surviving-u...nt-part-3-j-m/
https://survivalblog.com/surviving-u...nt-part-4-j-m/
https://survivalblog.com/surviving-u...nt-part-5-j-m/
https://survivalblog.com/surviving-u...nt-part-6-j-m/
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Old 07-10-2019, 10:04 AM
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One of the biggest dangers to apartment dwellers is other apartment dwellers. When the power goes out the chance of fire increase dramatically as people try to use open flames to cook or heat their apartment.
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Old 07-10-2019, 11:18 AM
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FIRST question?
Where are you located?
....

-Ottawa, Ontario
-Not much chance of digging or making a cache too many people in area fear of it or them being found. Risk can't afford financially or for survival.
-NO English not 2nd language - LOL I'm horrible at grammar and was on phone damn thing drives me crazy have to stick to PC.
-been doing the small and steady process thanks for threat assessment link will chk it out for sure
-totally agree no point buying bunch of anything if you don't know how to use it; I practice fire starting, research what I don't understand this is a key point of mine... how important building allies, groups, whatever one small group can't have as much knowledge, supplies, whatever then a larger group or group of groups as near by allies! i think this is hard one to build but important and needs to start before, way before
-I did not join for long time lurked on many sites waiting to find one to join, choose here and some Facebook sites one here but not as many in Canada and active. Other sites were not very active lot of regurgitating plus copy and pasting links.


Thx for ideas will follow-up for certain... thanks!
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Old 07-10-2019, 12:15 PM
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-Ottawa, Ontario
-Not much chance of digging or making a cache too many people in area fear of it or them being found. Risk can't afford financially or for survival.
-NO English not 2nd language - LOL I'm horrible at grammar and was on phone damn thing drives me crazy have to stick to PC.
-been doing the small and steady process thanks for threat assessment link will chk it out for sure
-totally agree no point buying bunch of anything if you don't know how to use it; I practice fire starting, research what I don't understand this is a key point of mine... how important building allies, groups, whatever one small group can't have as much knowledge, supplies, whatever then a larger group or group of groups as near by allies! i think this is hard one to build but important and needs to start before, way before
-I did not join for long time lurked on many sites waiting to find one to join, choose here and some Facebook sites one here but not as many in Canada and active. Other sites were not very active lot of regurgitating plus copy and pasting links.


Thx for ideas will follow-up for certain... thanks!
OTTAWA to too close to CUEbek,that might have influenced the writing.

You are Canadian and you aren't automatically born with wilderness survival skills and you admit it? You are ruining the picture of the Great White North stereotype.

Last time I was in Ottawa I was riding a BMW GS motorcycle coming back from Nova Scotia. Stopped at the Beemer/Harley dealer for a Tshirt.

I really can't tribute a lot to apt living and survival situations since I have a home in the bush and only worked in the city
But welcome and you are in good hands here.
A lot is here to be learned.
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Old 07-10-2019, 01:14 PM
Florida Jean Florida Jean is online now
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How high up are you in this apartment? do you have a fire escape?

What is your present 'fire' escape planning?

What is your present 'no power/heat' planning?

The above to can happen anytime. Being in Canada you don't need to worry about not having power for 3-4 days in the summer. But what about a blizzard situation? do you just plan in bundling up in six layers of clothing? Do you have a way to insulate your windows? [think bubble wrap]. If you lose power even for a short period of time -- do you have enough flashlights?

How is the health of the three of you? How old is the youngest? After Sandy, with no elevators due to no power people had to haul food and water up how ever many floors.

Could one/all of you do that? Have you tried doing it? How many times in a row could you do it?

Remember SARS. Shut things down. How long can you presently eat in your apartment before you needed to figure out where a grocery might be open? [i.e. power and water still working].

Don't think 30 days. Think 3 days, then 7 days, then 10 days. Work up to it and take advantage of sales and how you store X amount first.

A pistol may be nice, but it advertises you. Baseball bats, frying pans, tazers and wasp spray are good short contact choices [you are dealing with someone smashing in your door, not shooting at you down the street].


Do you have space in the fridge to keep a pitcher of water? Do you have space in your freezer to freeze some juice?

Plan on initially not cooking in a short term power loss. Peanut butter and crackers, canned fruit, canned 'spaghettios'. At least limit the possibility of you starting a fire.

Do any of your windows face the sun? A solar charger for your phone/gagets should the phone system work. Or to perhaps recharge batteries? You get the idea?

Do you have first aid kit [or enough stuff to count as one]. Has anyone in your apartment taken a basic first aid course? [Red Cross]. What meds are regular taken?

Do you have a battery or crank radio/flashlight combo?

How far do anyone of you work/go to school from your apartment? Could you find your way back on foot if the normal route was blocked and your phone couldn't give you directions?

Do you have at least one suitcase/backpack ready packed for an emergency departure? Preferably per person. See, now you have somewhere to store stuff.

***************
Does your apartment building provide a storage area? It is often in the basement, but you can stash a some stuff under your boxes of Christmas ornaments and get it soon after a situation develops.
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Old 07-11-2019, 09:14 AM
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If the power goes out apartments will be unsustainable after 30 days.
This.

My son lives with a couple roommates in apartments just off his college campus. He's right at 100 miles from our home. We've discussed in length his preparations and plans. Given the eventual threat of crime (especially in a college town), few to no alternative power options, and limited storage, his initial plan is to hopefully bug out before conditions degrade too far making vehicle transportation a difficult option.

While the area does have threats of hurricanes (already one last year) and severe thunderstorms that cause power outages, we've assessed 6-7 days is feasible to bug-in. Longer term bug-in is simply not tenable in an apartment complex. Water is the biggest challenge aside from heat and/or AC depending on your location and season. He also has a dog, so it's not like they can just hunker down for a low profile. Fire is another concern. If in a colder clime, other apartment dwellers (likely much less prepared), will do erratic and stupid things to survive, including open fires in their apartments which puts all at risk.

For anyone living in an apartment, which is many and for many reasons, find an alternate location (family, friends, cabin, etc.) and plan to bug out for any extended emergencies. If a SHTF situation isn't a short term event, departing sooner rather than later is pretty much a necessity.

ROCK6
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:02 PM
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If you live in an apartment your first thing to understand is that you're NOT the problem. Your main survival problem will the morons living in the other parts of the building all around you. Sooner or later one of them will do something to start a major fire or flood the building in some fashion.

In winter, one of them might try to build a fire to warm up his part of building when the cold hits -40 below. Trouble is that the idiot won't vent the fire, he'll build it too big or he won't build the base with fireproof material. He could build it too close to a wall and the fire soon crawls up the walls and into abandoned units. Before long, your whole building is a raging inferno and your family gets trapped inside of it. If such an event happens, and you do survive, there goes all your supplies that you've worked so hard to build-up over a long time.

Most successful guerrilla groups are taught to store supplies in 3 locations to avoid losing everything if some of their stuff gets found out or accidentally destroyed. I would suggest that you consider having a small stash of the most basic goods in the trunk of your car or back end of your van in a locked box or in a rucksack of some kind.

The second place that you might also store some of your supplies could be in a locker in the basement of your apartment building. Check with your building's supervisor to see if there is a place, like a basement area that's secure, that you could put a locker or storage box with supplies. You will need access to the secure area so see if it's okay for you to have a key to that area.

The third area would be inside of your apartment itself. That's probably the area where you would keep the majority or most important items of your storage items. Keep them in secured, locked boxes or containers so that nosy people don't go checking them when you aren't present.

One other option would be to rent a storage unit not too far from your apartment. I would rent one that's close enough for you to walk to if things get bad. You could store stuff there too and still be able to access it with very little work on your part. If you can not afford a nearby storage unit, how about using a shed from a friend's or family member's place? If you have somebody you can trust you might use a shed or garage on their property to store stuff. You don't need to tell people that you prep as in being a survivalist but you could opt to tell them that you believe in what the government tells you "about generally being prepared for bad weather." Most levels of government normally urge their citizens to prepare for bad weather and you can easily find these sites by doing a little research.

https://www.getprepared.gc.ca/index-eng.aspx

https://www.mcss.gov.on.ca/documents...EMO_ENG_LP.pdf
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Old 07-12-2019, 11:11 AM
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As others have said, I think neighbors could quickly become your biggest problem. Even if you do everything perfectly and are totally prepared(you wont and aren't) you have the added risk of fire from cooking and heating, possibly flooding, garbage and waste building up, pets and pests all caused by neighbors in the same building.

What type of apartment to you live in? A single family home turned into 2 or 3 apartments my be better than a 15 floor apartment complex.

Do you have friends or family in the area that could allow you to stay at their place in case of an emergency? If so, will they let you keep a couple totes of food, clothes, blankets, copies of papers there? Some sort of bug out location or back up location with friends or family may be your best option if money is tight.
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Old 07-12-2019, 12:37 PM
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I lived in an apartment for a couple of years as I tied up loose ends, sorted out my affairs and made preparations to move out of the city. I was never truly comfortable living in an apartment. I was fully aware of the short comings of that lifestyle and the potential for my apartment to be a death trap if disaster struck.


It was not a survivable situation beyond the shortest of terms.
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Old 07-12-2019, 03:28 PM
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My first "real" apartment after college (meaning not just renting the basement of someone's house) was on the third floor in one of several buildings in a large complex. Late one winter night, everyone in my building was ordered to evacuate due to a fire, which turned out to be a false alarm. Of course, not knowing it was a false alarm, I was scrambling to grab essential items and get out. I did have a roommate, but no small children or pets that would need to be guided or bodily hauled out of the (supposedly) burning building.

The thing was, there were no alarms going off, no obvious signs of fire. Had it actually been real, but with no evacuation due to no functioning fire department as in a potential SHTF scenario, either 1) people wouldn't have known there was a fire until it quite possibly too late to escape, or 2) they would have been fleeing with very little except the clothes on their back into a cold, snowy environment. Again, view this in the context of a SHTF scenario, with no emergency services responding, no means of extinguishing the fire, and perhaps no means of transporting your belongings out of a burning building and immediate vicinity (think underground parking, detached garages, etc.) Or, if those conditions seem unlikely where you are, then use your imagination to come up with more applicable challenges. I'm just using an example from my own experience.

My point is that, living in an apartment building, condo or other "multi-family" environment, your situational awareness will be much more limited in scope due to not having knowledge of what is going on in other units, you quite likely won't have any means of dealing with threats to your safety if they are initially introduced in other units, and avenues of escape may be considerably more limited. This is to say nothing of limited storage space, defensive capabilities and plain old privacy. You will be operating at a disadvantage for a number of reasons in an already challenging situation.

Trust me, I understand that there are reasons why an apartment may make sense for you, but bugging out would certainly seem to be a far more viable survival option than bugging in for whatever duration your supplies hold out. There are just so many factors completely out of your control.
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Old 07-12-2019, 06:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NW GUY View Post
FIRST question?
Where are you located?
Your sentence construction means English may be a 2nd language

LOL Good question I have horrible grammar plus damn phone was on it likely typing in bed sorry...


Quote:
Originally Posted by NW GUY View Post
FIRST question?
Where are you located?
ergo
do you live in the USA?
If not...

We live in Canada, Ontario, Ottawa


Quote:
Originally Posted by NW GUY View Post
FIRST question?
Only reason I ask is the answers good for one country may need to be entirely different for another, what may be available, what can be procured, what can be shipped...?


We have serious restrictions! Exchange rate on dollar is killer. Most items are available through US websites. Add shipping potential duties prices lot stuff out of our budget! Cannot order pepper spray more then 2% caspian, any weapon fires greater than 500 fps must be registered. That is anything including crossbows, air rifles, etc Calibers over .177 are restricted. We need a certificate $170 to purchase firearms and ammo. Pistols are prohibited, folding stocks and there is a length restriction forget right now. No batons, nuncucks, brace knuckles, etc. Plus, no stun guns at all. I think postman can get a small powered one for dogs. They report there are dog/s on route then they are alotted one - at least they use too. Once you have a firearms permit you purchase weapons and apply for prohibited or concealed permit. prohibited you can obtain if you belong to a club or practice range. Concealed permit you must have proof why it is needed for work or something for protection you carry money or work in backwoods. Knew guy on pipeline in Alberta had a 44 Mag for bears.


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Originally Posted by NW GUY View Post
ie A response of "find a vacant piece of ground nearby and dig a pit to store extra items." is not a good operative if you live in permafrost or you are iced over half the year.

Thought about caches but too many people around. Have limited budget lost job Jan. hurt at work WSIB battle! >:-( Can't risk losing stuff. Plus, with my issues couldn't build good enough caches that could be concealed. If you know direction you would be going when you, "Get Out of Dodge" think cache/s would be great! But if you lose one or all of them you are screwed!

Last edited by dan2x38; 07-21-2019 at 12:31 PM..
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Old 07-12-2019, 07:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Surviving Suburbia View Post
First, welcome to the forum!
Your question is extremely broad. I agree with NW GUY, knowing your [general] location would be helpful. Knowing the types of threats you have in mind helps, too.

Others have a lot more experience than I and can offer detailed advice and ask better questions than I, but I'll offer some general advice, including this threat analysis matrix I made when I first started doing this about 2 years ago. Link below:

https://www.survivalistboards.com/sh...2#post19140372

Your details will differ from mine, but the matrix will help narrow down exactly what kinds of events you're preparing for, which will bring clarity and focus to your efforts, which you need when you have limited resources (I can relate to that).

Thanks will go check out this link.


Lot of our risks I think come from climate change, EMP and political fall out as USA allie and how close we are. Not saying bad thing for most part that is awesome happy and proud to the USA as our Allie, neighbour and friend! Throw in disease like CDC looks at pretty serious as well.


We use to have less snow here. Moved here in 89 it was usually -35C during winter days in Jan. and Feb. We were 2nd coldest national capitol Worldwide compared to Moscow - then. Since We have ice storms in Jan. 2 serious ones 1998 and 2015. Plus tornadoes last year one serious we were less then 1 km from tough down of one it took out power station. We were with power for 3.5 days. I am always prepared but that was the last straw started prepping then. We had blizzard dumped 58 cm. in 7 hrs cars left in streets people had to walk home. The downtown was shutdown in passable for 6 or 8 hrs.


EMP no way we can prevent those at all. We avoided a few huge ones but more on the way in next couple years! About 12 years or so major EMP strike took out some old SATS that were being replaced. It affected communications but the new ones were deployed faster. Not sure what else was affected it was not broadcast widely to avoid panic. The big EMP strike/s come it couple cripple the World over night for sure.


Politics - WOW!!! Trump's International and domestic plans have raised tenses: North Korea, Iran, China, Russia, Saudi Adria, etc... We are the capitol that makes us a military target. Washington, D.C. is not far, New York, Boston, Phillie, etc Any missile strikes would be those targets we get the fall out if we aren't targeted. Also terrorism since we are capital and near US capitol. The USA has huge Embassy here downtown. It is a fortress but it would also be a target. We had a crazy ass attack and killed a solider standing guard at our Military Statue tribute to both World Wars. >:-( We're at 1 million people now. Tones of shootings and murders are up. Moved from where we were, "New Canadians" in gangs selling dope shooting each other. After 3rd shooting on our 2 block area got our family out of there. I had some defenses for my wife and son when there but no firearms. They had/have guns! These new gangs do not give a rat's ass about any one especially if we are not of their ancestry. BTW I'm no bigot period actually we are Christians. Makes me conflicted with some of the prepping!


Then disease well with speed of travel. Now this anti-vaccination movement is causing out breaks creating a pandemic! terrorists can infect themselves as suicide disease carriers. Fly here infect everyone on flight then go to malls at Christmas, movie theaters, etc.


So yeah lot of possible scenarios and what ifs. Will read that link might we helpful do just that prioritize our risk/threat. We can never predict what will happen but no one has to convince me I know something is going to happen. :-(


Thanks for info...


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Originally Posted by Surviving Suburbia View Post
Second tip, prioritize your preps in the same way as the matrix prioritizes threats--the top priorities are high-damage, high-probability threats, like retirement. If you're unprepared, retirement (especially forced retirement) can wreck your life. Similar thing for preps--the top priorities are high-need high-probability preps.

Thanks again need lots of input... by injury semi-retired my hopes build supplies, food, etc. Plus learn research practice when I/we can. As I learn stuff test, practice make notes. Have book/s write down results of tests and ideas. Including list - inventory of all items. List of food with dates and quantities. Bought a decent dehydrator and vacuum sealer doing food research for re-hydrating and recipes... tough for canning and bottling such limited space. Have some bottling but most cans are store bought rotated in pantry and cupboards including dog food and treats.


Trying to figure out how to calculate how much food we need for one year. Can't do everything but can do a lot to store for one year especially fruits and veggies with drying and sealing. More research in food department needed for sure and seriously. We are set up for water for 1 week. Have collapsible jugs to fill when warnings come. Have gravity feed water filtration system 180,000 liters. have tabs need to grab some pure bleech for dishes and hygiene.


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Originally Posted by Surviving Suburbia View Post
Third, start small and don't feel like you have to do it all at once.

Yes great advice did this for first months now looking at bigger decisions and purchases. While looking, researching, etc. can still be prepping food since not at work it helps keep me active and bit sane.


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Originally Posted by Surviving Suburbia View Post
Fourth, don't overemphasize equipment at the expense of skills and knowledge. Seeds will start a garden, but they need a gardener to end up as food.

Totally agree! Never lit a fire using tools I have now. So I realized not good. I've gone practiced at different times making fires in bush after rain, in wind, high noon sun... not gotten out at winter yet. I use to do winter camping loved it. My father was in military WWII taught me skills I'd never forgotten. Been doing lot of research on things I know zip about. Been revisiting stuff I thought I remembered so realize need notes. I want to hand these notes, supplies, everything to my son when I'm gone. Harvesting will be tough that is for sure. Hunting too so need to learn those skills practice them. Some we can't practice but can read or watch. My memory I need notes now.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Surviving Suburbia View Post
Last thing, read a lot. This forum is a great place to start--the search function is useful, or just browse thread titles. I read stuff on here for probably 12-18 months before I started posting much.

Over a year prepping now. Hate using this word but, "lurked" on this site as well as some others reading watching etc. Finally decided to join this forum and donate. I've done a lot on my own in prepping now at a place where gathering more questions then supplies... LOL


Not sure if adding this detail helps but it's more of where we stand... Thanks to everyone again for welcoming me in. Hope I can get lots of answers and maybe add 1 or 2 myself... have a strong survival instinct but also have strong instinct to help others.
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Old 07-12-2019, 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted by NW GUY View Post
OTTAWA to too close to CUEbek,that might have influenced the writing.

You are Canadian and you aren't automatically born with wilderness survival skills and you admit it? You are ruining the picture of the Great White North stereotype.

Last time I was in Ottawa I was riding a BMW GS motorcycle coming back from Nova Scotia. Stopped at the Beemer/Harley dealer for a Tshirt.

I really can't tribute a lot to apt living and survival situations since I have a home in the bush and only worked in the city
But welcome and you are in good hands here.
A lot is here to be learned.

Never said I had no wilderness skills. ;-) I grew up in New Brunswick. We went camping as babies that was 60 years ago. Camping was not as it is now. I also use to hunt and fish with my mother more than father. He didn't have her patience. He taught me military survival skills my mother also wilderness skills. She grew up in depression so did my father but not in same situation. She hunted for survival with my grandfather. He was a dual war vet WWI/WWII. He was a sniper WWI and was in artillery WWII. My father was a tanker. Grew up in the country on an apple orchard.


Either way my issue is I live in the city limited funds and I suffer as chronic pain suffer. But lucky not over weight none of us are. We have no serious illnesses. None of us smoke nor drink. But me I'm on pain meds... narcotics and marijuana. Without the narcotics there will be withdrawal then lots of pain lack of sleep no fun...! Been squirreling away meds but not easy. Whatever I don't take I feel later!


Use to ride but I can't now with my back and other issues. Can't hold arms on handle bars nor the vibration not to mention bumps, etc. This realization was a sad, sad, sad day. I'm around a lot of bikes still but that's another story and too much info not always best! ;-)


PS - no nothing to due with Que-bec... LOL write poorly A.D.D. thoughts wander... squirrel... LOL
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Old 07-12-2019, 07:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Florida Jean View Post
How high up are you in this apartment? do you have a fire escape?


...

Thanks awesome ideas. Have implemented some already thought about them. Planned for some too or planning. Will look into ones I haven't thought of or started researching.


We're in awesome shape 3 - 5 days, good shape up to 10 days, can survive 2 weeks, 30 days somethings and if able to get supplies outside apartment can survive but not comfortably.


New goal is 30 days any weather any season. We are good any weather/season for 10 days to 2 weeks. Like to have close to years supply of food that would be comfort zone.


But I believe prepping is not something you can do the say OK we're good stop there...


Thanks great ideas; great check list... :-)
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Old 07-12-2019, 09:04 PM
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dan2x38 dan2x38 is offline
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Originally Posted by Nomad, 2nd View Post
If the power goes out apartments will be unsustainable after 30 days.

Not comfortably that is my goal to date. Two weeks no problem, 3 weeks yeah but... full month needs work!
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