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Old 08-17-2019, 11:25 AM
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SHTF a long way from home...

I go to the nearest airport. Find the right size plane with the legs I need and "borrow it." so I can get home. If close enough to home maybe even a helo if it is all that is available.

Not 3 miles from my home is a dead straight stretch of paved road about 2 miles long and has been clear cut on both sides. Plenty of room for even a twin to slide in without too much difficulty.

It has been about 30 years since I last flew, but it is like riding a bike. It comes back to you fast.

Even if too far away to get home without refuel, when it runs out and I would have to land I would be a whole lot closer than when I started.
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Old 08-17-2019, 09:36 PM
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Originally Posted by NW GUY View Post
SHTF a long way from home...

I go to the nearest airport. Find the right size plane with the legs I need and "borrow it." so I can get home. If close enough to home maybe even a helo if it is all that is available.

Not 3 miles from my home is a dead straight stretch of paved road about 2 miles long and has been clear cut on both sides. Plenty of room for even a twin to slide in without too much difficulty.

It has been about 30 years since I last flew, but it is like riding a bike. It comes back to you fast.

Even if too far away to get home without refuel, when it runs out and I would have to land I would be a whole lot closer than when I started.
You are seriously suggesting and going to implement a get home plan of breaking into an airport, stealing a plane, stealing aviation fuel and landing on a road. Great plan!
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Old 08-18-2019, 09:02 AM
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You are seriously suggesting and going to implement a get home plan of breaking into an airport, stealing a plane, stealing aviation fuel and landing on a road. Great plan!
OK..
First of all, - 90% of aircraft are on tie down points outside.

2nd-- When you are putting your plane away, you TOP OFF the tanks to remove the ability of condensation to build up in the tanks (Water build up is bad for planes)so if put away by a competent owner they are already filled.

3rd. I have about 400+ hours on single and twin fixed wing and about 100 hrs flying helicopters, and was dropping singles onto postage stamp size grass strips when I was 22 so a 2 mile long piece of pavement is a pretty easy landing site... and there are no wires or anything else to impede the landing except if a deer runs out. as for the road, it is a remote stretch of road that connects 2 very rural counties and there aren't 200 cars a day using it.
so yeah,
instead of dealing with the issues of traffic jams and mobs and hoards and who knows what all,... I will, depending on the aircraft be floating along at about 10,000 feet, above the reach of most ground fire from "ants" clocking along at 100-160kts and not drop down until over my home county and setting up for a final approach.

I think it is a great plan
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Old 08-18-2019, 10:33 AM
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I always pack a backpack. Stopped using a suitcase long ago. Sometimes even strap down sleeping bag on it. It is easy to move on a bus or train. Planes really hamper what you can pack. My expedition is always ready. I would not look forward to a long walk and scrounging sustenance but could and would if required. If in an urban area, I would start walking Asap just to get out of that environment. Over the years my pack has had great zipper pulls added i.e. a compass, metal match and mini multi tool.
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Old 08-18-2019, 11:14 AM
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OK..
First of all, - 90% of aircraft are on tie down points outside.

2nd-- When you are putting your plane away, you TOP OFF the tanks to remove the ability of condensation to build up in the tanks (Water build up is bad for planes)so if put away by a competent owner they are already filled.

3rd. I have about 400+ hours on single and twin fixed wing and about 100 hrs flying helicopters, and was dropping singles onto postage stamp size grass strips when I was 22 so a 2 mile long piece of pavement is a pretty easy landing site... and there are no wires or anything else to impede the landing except if a deer runs out. as for the road, it is a remote stretch of road that connects 2 very rural counties and there aren't 200 cars a day using it.
so yeah,
instead of dealing with the issues of traffic jams and mobs and hoards and who knows what all,... I will, depending on the aircraft be floating along at about 10,000 feet, above the reach of most ground fire from "ants" clocking along at 100-160kts and not drop down until over my home county and setting up for a final approach.

I think it is a great plan
Yes you are correct on proper placement and filling of a plane. So you are competent (2 decades ago) pilot. You are clearly saying that stealing, like the stealing of food and water, is what you plan to do. You sir are a common thug. If I caught you attempting to steal my plan in a shtf I would happily put you down. You are just as bad as the punk pushing down an old lady and stealing her last can of food.
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Old 08-18-2019, 01:39 PM
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Yes you are correct on proper placement and filling of a plane. So you are competent (2 decades ago) pilot. You are clearly saying that stealing, like the stealing of food and water, is what you plan to do. You sir are a common thug. If I caught you attempting to steal my plan in a shtf I would happily put you down. You are just as bad as the punk pushing down an old lady and stealing her last can of food.
ACTUALLY 3 decades ago, but yeah, I don't think it would be too difficult. It is like riding a bike or throwing a ball. It will come back to you quickly.
As to your "outrage"...???

I would NOT be stealing water or food.
ANd why would I want to steal your plan... when I am looking for a plane?

people say they would shoot people to keep them from taking their stuff, I have no problem with that.
but
by the time I found an aircraft suitable to my needs if folks had a place to FLY to they would already be gone. I don't do the airport bit until I know I cannot get home by my own transport.

there are a lot of folks who will do unthinkable things to get home or to BOL.

If someone set up a blockade on the only way to your BOL would you throw up your hands and say, well, I guess they have me cut off and now I can't get there, or would you do what you have to to get to your BOL? If you do what you have to then what is the difference except you might have to kill someone?

I have in my life already gone past the "unthinkable" so stealing a plane to get home so I don't have to hurt anyone or to otherwise accomplish it is just prudent on my part. I am not harming anyone but maybe the plane owner... if he has somewhere to fly to.

Tell you what... tell me what airport you keep your plane in and I promise I will not go there and steal it when TSHTF.

otherwise

I'll take my chances my way
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Old 08-18-2019, 02:37 PM
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Howell, MI

And yes stealing someone else’s plans for escape is stealing their life. I prepare and work hard so I don’t have to do hurt someone else for something I want. I won’t let you take what is mine. My “BOL”’s are set across hundreds of square miles. 3 of the 4 are fully stocked for 3-6 months with my family.
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Old 08-18-2019, 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Aerindel View Post
Let me guess....you live in a city? on the flood plane? don't have a home fire suppression system and didn't click on the OPs link?

The first place you start prepping is your own home. The common things should be very very uncommon in a preppers home. If you are mostly worried about your home being destroyed then you need to move, fortify, etc, solve that problem first. If your home is not the safest place in the world that you can get to (in your opinion of course) then why are you even living there in the first place?
I'm in the military - I've lived in every clime and place, on several continents. The most survivable cultures are not bound to geography or buildings. As for the carrington event, to my way of thinking, that is the one we as a nation are least prepared for, and therefore most likely not to survive. And most folks homes, even with a fire suppression system, in the country, aren't ready it for either. How many aircraft are overhead right now? Is your house guaranteed out of the path of a 200,000# lawn dart?

My point is to the OP: getting to safety is the goal, which may or may not be your home. The GHB in the car became the INCH bag for lots of Americans this past year. Doesn't matter if its a record CME/Solar Storm, black swan fire/flood/earthquake, or whatever you can imagine ...
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Old 08-18-2019, 04:37 PM
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I worked 35 miles from home when 9-11 happened. I put a day pack with a gas mask, protective suit and a 9mm in the pack. It stayed in the car for a year. I figured the suit and gas mask would protect me enough to get out of town (2 miles from job). Hiking in the suit would be hot. the suit would also keep me dry in bad weather and a little more warm. The walk home with one major river crossing and several streams in the foot hills would be doable but not easy. Never had to use it but it was there. and didn't occupy much space. I gave my sister a wool army blanket to keep in her car as she drove 30 mile to work in the snowy mountains. she had a mechanical issue with her car and waited 3 hours for a tow truck. the blanket was gone. He husband took it out to crawl under when he watched TV. Word to the wise, check your bag often to make sure it has not been moved or pilfered
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Old 08-18-2019, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by NW GUY View Post
SHTF a long way from home...

I go to the nearest airport. Find the right size plane with the legs I need and "borrow it." so I can get home. If close enough to home maybe even a helo if it is all that is available.

Not 3 miles from my home is a dead straight stretch of paved road about 2 miles long and has been clear cut on both sides. Plenty of room for even a twin to slide in without too much difficulty.

It has been about 30 years since I last flew, but it is like riding a bike. It comes back to you fast.

Even if too far away to get home without refuel, when it runs out and I would have to land I would be a whole lot closer than when I started.
My father was a ww2 pilot and I spent much of my teen age life at county airports. If I were really stuck, I would more likely cut the lock on the fuel pump, than steal a plane.

Besides, no one would be flying immediately after a solar flare. The high doeses of radiation would be dangerous at sea level, and fatal at high altitude.

Best response was; Even though we can not block the radiation from solar flares, we can see the event and predict the impact. If Im paying attention, I should have time to buy a couple fuel cans and simply drive home. So the best response is keep checking a site like Solarham, and carry cash.
http://www.solarham.net
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Old 08-18-2019, 05:23 PM
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SHTF is not going to happen instantaneously, so there is plenty of time if you become isolated to rent a car and get home, or buy a car and get home, or hitchhike.
Really!? Not from my perspective.
The two main long term collapse scenarios that are most possible for a shtf scenario would be EMP/electric grid crash or collapse of US dollar. Both would make it very hard to get home if far from home.

I have to travel frequently 3-5 hours from home to southern Maine or even NH and Mass. I feel like I'm a few days to a week walk when I cross the bridge in Kittery Maine from NH. Though that would really suck to walk from. But I do have a B.O.B and arms with me at all times where ever I go. I try not to think about it as it leads to paranoia.
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Old 08-18-2019, 05:28 PM
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I'm in the military - I've lived in every clime and place, on several continents. The most survivable cultures are not bound to geography or buildings. As for the carrington event, to my way of thinking, that is the one we as a nation are least prepared for, and therefore most likely not to survive. And most folks homes, even with a fire suppression system, in the country, aren't ready it for either. How many aircraft are overhead right now? Is your house guaranteed out of the path of a 200,000# lawn dart?
Good lord....are you honestly suggesting.....that what? I prep for an airplane falling on my house?

Listening, its all a probability game. You can't prepare for every bizzare thing that could possibly happen.

Carrington events are worth preparing for as there is a 50% chance of one occurring in a 70 year lifetime.

Seriously worrying that an airplane is randomly going to fall on my house....sure, it could happen, but it would be an insane waste of time to worry about something that likely. And if your trying to suggest that a CME would cause planes to fall out of the sky.....no, it wouldn't. Although navigation and communication would be a problem for a week or so.

Anyone can come up with some random threat. It's not hard. An airplane could crash into you RIGHT NOW. You could trip going down the stairs and break your neck. Anything could happen. Worrying about everything however is the same as worrying about nothing as you can't prep for 'anything'.

I would say most serious preppers are more prepared for it in they're homes than anyone just randomly out and about in the country, which is why that is the #1 place they would want to get to.

I asked where you live because generally the only people who really think that living off your skills in the wild are people who do not have a home base in good location.

When you have a purpose built fortified tower house hidden in the woods with years worth of food, ammo, fuel, water, etc.....yeah....getting back to it is pretty big goal if its at all possible.

Nobody imagines their home is immune to SHTF, but for most of us its going to always be the best option.

If you have an apartment in some city with your goldfish, xbox, and camping gear in it, yeah....seems pretty silly to go back there.

Quote:
No one would be flying immediately after a solar flare. The high doeses of radiation would be dangerous at sea level, and fatal at high altitude.
Well, it depends if you are talking about an extinction level even where the sun just sterilizes the surface of the earth with ionizing radiation, or just a carrington level even where and extra strong solar wind pushes our magnetic field out of shape and that moving magnetic field induces electric charge in long wires.

But any increased radiation from a CME is generally an insignificant short term problem. Certainly nothing that would stop you from flying.

Quote:
there are a lot of folks who will do unthinkable things to get home or to BOL.
The problem with 'the unthinkable' is that for a lot of people, even here....its literally unthinkable. Like the people who talk about happily shooting you who don't seem to ever think that they may just as happily get shot back.
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Old 08-18-2019, 05:31 PM
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ACTUALLY 3 decades ago, but yeah, I don't think it would be too difficult. It is like riding a bike or throwing a ball. It will come back to you quickly.
As to your "outrage"...???

I would NOT be stealing water or food.
ANd why would I want to steal your plan... when I am looking for a plane?

people say they would shoot people to keep them from taking their stuff, I have no problem with that.
but
by the time I found an aircraft suitable to my needs if folks had a place to FLY to they would already be gone. I don't do the airport bit until I know I cannot get home by my own transport.

there are a lot of folks who will do unthinkable things to get home or to BOL.

If someone set up a blockade on the only way to your BOL would you throw up your hands and say, well, I guess they have me cut off and now I can't get there, or would you do what you have to to get to your BOL? If you do what you have to then what is the difference except you might have to kill someone?

I have in my life already gone past the "unthinkable" so stealing a plane to get home so I don't have to hurt anyone or to otherwise accomplish it is just prudent on my part. I am not harming anyone but maybe the plane owner... if he has somewhere to fly to.

Tell you what... tell me what airport you keep your plane in and I promise I will not go there and steal it when TSHTF.

otherwise

I'll take my chances my way

NW- That's actually a good idea if you know how to fly. I think if I get stuck down in M******* land I might try to find a small plane operator if I end up walking my ass by an airport and hitch a ride. Id try to bribe a ride first TBH.
Reality is I could pay the pilot with preps back here if itd get me home. Sure if someone knows how to fly they are not totally useless. LOL
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Old 08-18-2019, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Hick Industries View Post
My father was a ww2 pilot and I spent much of my teen age life at county airports. If I were really stuck, I would more likely cut the lock on the fuel pump, than steal a plane.

Besides, no one would be flying immediately after a solar flare. The high doeses of radiation would be dangerous at sea level, and fatal at high altitude.

Best response was; Even though we can not block the radiation from solar flares, we can see the event and predict the impact. If Im paying attention, I should have time to buy a couple fuel cans and simply drive home. So the best response is keep checking a site like Solarham, and carry cash.
http://www.solarham.net
NOT SURE how well leaded Avgas will work in todays hi-tech autos. Might not get far.
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Old 08-18-2019, 05:36 PM
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NOT SURE how well leaded Avgas will work in todays hi-tech autos. Might not get far.
Actually in general modern vehicles handle fuel variations better than old ones, the computer adjusts timing, F/A ratio etc of the actual fuel rather than the fuel it expects to have.

I'll have to find the link but someone did a bunch of experiments trying to run different engines off different fuels and the modern EFI engines always did the best.
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Old 08-18-2019, 05:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Offrink View Post
Howell, MI

And yes stealing someone else’s plans for escape is stealing their life. I prepare and work hard so I don’t have to do hurt someone else for something I want. I won’t let you take what is mine. My “BOL”’s are set across hundreds of square miles. 3 of the 4 are fully stocked for 3-6 months with my family.
OK, I promise to stay away from Hardy.
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Old 08-18-2019, 05:53 PM
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NW- That's actually a good idea if you know how to fly. I think if I get stuck down in M******* land I might try to find a small plane operator if I end up walking my ass by an airport and hitch a ride. Id try to bribe a ride first TBH.
Reality is I could pay the pilot with preps back here if itd get me home. Sure if someone knows how to fly they are not totally useless. LOL
YEAH, flying has proven valuable in all sorts of ways as I went through life. And while it is a skill that you should keep up on, the real secret about flying is...except for take off and landing.. and even not the landings so much... FLYING IS BORING.
You take off, get to altitude, trim the ship and then... stare at a piece of sky for hours and every now and then check instruments to be sure you are in the right piece of sky. You can liven it up running treetop level and into valleys and such but that is a quick way to have your ticket cancelled in sooo many ways.

The only real exciting time is takeoff when bad things can happen and you have to have your bail out plan reconfigured every few seconds until you have enough altitude to remove some of the excitement. It will ALWAYS land.

I haven't flown a plane in over 30 years but it isn't that difficult if you understand the principles of flight and have a little experience under your belt. If I had to I wouldn't think twice about hopping in and taking off with a single or small twin

If I knew then what I know now I would have stayed with it, picked up my commercial and gone to Alaska to be a bush pilot.
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Old 08-18-2019, 08:18 PM
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Hick, this is a subject near and dear to my heart because I still travel a lot and long distances. Often speculate how to get home etc.

I'm not talking short distances. I generally make two major trips a year and both trips are thousands of miles away from my primary residence (two different seasonal places). A shack on each end and a way to survive.

Several things I have thought about and naturally much depends on where one might get caught on the trip. I might consider turning around and going back if I hadn't gone too far before something occurs. I do carry an extensive get home bag and seasonal gear depending which way I'm heading. Also I consider just hunkering down depending on what and where depending again on circumstances.

One big thing, if anything at all is still running, like trucks and trains, in another lifetime I drove truck and know the ropes and lingo (and maintain my CDL) and other truckers would be keen on getting home too. I am fairly confident (again if they are still running) I'd find a trucker that would appreciate help driving 24 hours a day to get in a general direction I am going. Might even convince him that I have a safe haven at home and be willing to share that if possible and if it would be a help to him.

The other thing I mentioned previously is trains and although it would be more difficult to succeed (because they'd likely be more heavily guarded in an emergency) I'd try hopping a freight going my direction.

I am fairly well equipped to exist where at or to continue moving towards a haven and much would depend on where I am at and the resources of that area. As Old F mentioned I do cross the border and that may be problematic. Also many times have a bike (but not always). On the daily prep thread, last week or so, one contributor mentioned a folding bike and now it is on my list as a necessity for my travels, much more convenient and compact.

One big thing, my son (he's like minded) lives right smack dab in the middle of the 48 states and we do have a gasoline cache and some very much needed equipment there. We could jointly make the decision on what to do and again much depends on circumstances and area the disaster hits (if localized but serious enough to affect the whole country). I'd much rather more than just me is heading in the same direction. I and we have plans A, B, and C so we do have a better than average chance of succeeding.

Only time will tell if anything happens and time will also tell (and the way the pot is stirring that time might be now) if the trips should continue.

One more, more vague possibility is that I do have a pilots license and am (very slowly) building a kit plane and at least for the shorter of the two trips mostly be flying instead of driving. With long range tanks and a couple of fuel caches I'd feel pretty confident of success and no concern about blocked highways or too much concern about banditos (plus darn faster) along the way. I wouldn't steal one but one big thing is old age is creeping along and likely I'll be able to drive longer that I will be able to safely fly (but who knows).

A good bit long winded but like I said, a subject near and dear plus one that is fairly constant on my mind.
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Old 08-18-2019, 11:06 PM
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Originally Posted by ROCK6 View Post

This is pretty interesting and I hadn't see these before. That's a lot of on-board fuel. Even with a gas guzzling truck, that will likely add an additional 1200-1500 miles to your range. If I was traveling 600-800 miles away, and was serious, this would be at the top of my list as a "get home" investment. I will likely get a new truck this next year and this is a looking like an excellent accessory

ROCK6
Had one on a company truck I was using. Plumbed into the fuel line somehow. It was handy, but I'll bet it wasnt legal.
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Old 08-18-2019, 11:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Hick Industries View Post
Simple question, triggered by having to nake several long trips to deal with family issues this year.

How do you survive if the SHTF while you are traveling, if the Airlines are shut down, and you are several days auto travel from home?


first:
Leave early, leave often.
If things are looking uncertain: stay home (us retired folks can do that)

near famiky:
I have "stuff" stashed.
Not just for me, but for their use of I'm not there.

Got the odd backpack, tote serving as a foot locker etc at some friends too.

How do you survive when with family?
Use prepositions resources.


What if power is out, no credible news or communication, credit cards, and GPS are not working, and fuel is very limited.?
Couple extra cans and I have enough to make it most of the way home.
I expect it not to be enough.
Carry extra resources to pay ass-rape prices for more fuel.
I also have a Montague folding bike.


I doubt shortwave and everything else will fail, but if it does:
Head home.

I have never had a credit card.


Basically have only what you carried with you and what you can buy with cash.

Liike you, I carry lots of supplies when I travel. I could harbor up for quite a while.

I don't Travel without cash.



Btw, I am suggesting a Carrington size solar flare fries all existing satelites, and most of the US power grid.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm_of_1859
As was said:
You'll know.

As some have said:
You'll know. Head home.


It's going to be HARD to equally be prepared elsewhere in a similar manner to those of us who live the walk.

Being on a different continent would be.... Interesting.

In the US, I'm confident I'll either get home or get dead.

Vehicle, bike, foot.

Note: doing a tactical patrol you can securely travel ~0.6 of a mile an hour.
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