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Old 10-08-2016, 06:09 AM
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Default Review this 'present from holster' video and comment



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It's only about 4 minutes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0WG2hjOveE

thoughts on this method?
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Old 10-08-2016, 06:39 AM
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This is exactly how I do it and how instructors are currently teaching first responders. This is the most basic representation of the concept of this draw. It can be modified a lot beyond this.
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Old 10-08-2016, 09:28 AM
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I agree with V69. This is essentially how the Swatties are teaching it at the classes I go to (Lighthorse Tactical), assuming you're drawing to a fully-extended firing position.
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Old 10-08-2016, 10:00 AM
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This almost exactly how they taught us our draw when I trained at FLETC. The only differences was that they would tell us that as soon as the muzzle was in the direction of the target, even if you hadn't fully extended the firearm yet, to start firing. So say even at rib high once you got the muzzle pointed at the target, start firing. I never liked that, and thought it was dumb unless you were at a distance of not much more than arms length or less, then yeah, it would be a good idea, but if your target is say 20 feet or more, I am going to try and aim properly, of course if the person was already shooting at me, I might end up doing that anyway.
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Old 10-08-2016, 10:09 AM
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Nah, too slow.
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Old 10-08-2016, 10:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flex View Post
Nah, too slow.
Here, I just shot some cellphone video of how I do fast-draw -- just for you:

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Old 10-08-2016, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMonsantoPlanto View Post
Here, I just shot some cellphone video of how I do fast-draw -- just for you:

Bob Munden (Super Human) Fastest Gun that has ever lived on Earth. - YouTube
That's not fast, almost 9 1/2 minutes. Now this is fast!

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Old 10-08-2016, 01:57 PM
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This guy is on point and in my opinion had great technique and flawless fundamentals/execution.
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Old 10-08-2016, 03:36 PM
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Quote:
This guy is on point and in my opinion had great technique and flawless fundamentals/execution.
I agree, he seems to have things down.

I also agree with being able to shoot anywhere along the presentation as it might be needed.

Im always amazed at the number of people I know who have, and especially those who carry a gun, that have never drawn and fired it from a concealed holster. Wonder what the percentage of gun carriers overall is that actually have. Im willing to bet its actually pretty low.
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Old 10-08-2016, 07:32 PM
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Looks ok if you're open carrying, or for competition. I prefer the modified Weaver stance to the isosceles. Whatever gets you through the night.
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Old 10-08-2016, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Palma View Post
Looks ok if you're open carrying, or for competition. I prefer the modified Weaver stance to the isosceles. Whatever gets you through the night.
It's the same technique I've been trained on, but the focus was on the modified weaver stance as well. The isosceles is too static and makes maneuvering and movement awkward. I have done most of my training with an OWB holster while in class, but I practice the same technique when carrying IWB; it's just that my weak hand is used to clear shirt/jacket first.

The immediate draw and rotate to target before punching out is done specifically to counter a fast-approaching threat. If you try and rotate your arm up at length, it's much easier to block and give control of your arm and pistol to the threat. That initial draw and rotate to target while close into the body allows you to still fire at close distance. We don't train shooting from that position unless it's within arm distance; if possible, punching out to the target with both hands is much more accurate and controlled for follow up shots. It's still good to practice those in close to the body drills, ensuring your cant your pistol slightly to the outside of the body so you don't induce a malfunction.

The weaver or modified weaver just positions your strong-side and firearm away from a close threat and allows you a better balanced position for transitioning into movement drills. I've never really considered it a "smaller target" as much as a allowing your stance to be become a moving shooter vice a static shooter.

ROCK6
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Old 10-09-2016, 02:19 AM
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Re: video... Pretty much how it's taught at better US military training schools, including rotation of gun immediately upon clearing holster. Because pistol events are often a bad breath distance proposition.
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Old 10-09-2016, 07:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK103K View Post
Im always amazed at the number of people I know who have, and especially those who carry a gun, that have never drawn and fired it from a concealed holster. Wonder what the percentage of gun carriers overall is that actually have. Im willing to bet its actually pretty low.
I haven't seen a range that allows it without a membership. Perhaps that's part of the reason so few people train properly. I used to do about 4 hours a week drawing and firing. Lucky to get an hour in these days.
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Old 10-09-2016, 07:20 AM
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Ive found the stance thing needs to be adaptable and fluid, and not just being stuck on one. You cant always shoot just one, especially if youre shooting while youre moving offline and/or the targets are at odd angles.

Over the years, Ive progressed through the various stances as they became the stance of the moment, and by doing so, its been beneficial in the respect that I dont have to think about anything, everything is already preprogrammed, and I just morph into whatevers needed, even if its a combination of a couple of things.

I do find these days, the thumbs forward, Isocolese combo do work the best for a majority of things, but especially anything directly in front of you. It offers better stability and recoil recovery, and I find it to be the fastest to shoot well with.

While moving, things need to be more adaptable as youre constantly morphing as you go. Straight ahead might be Isocolese, shooting to the left (right hand shooter) tends to go Weaverish, and shooting right goes to one arm, as the support arm doesnt get over that far.

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I haven't seen a range that allows it without a membership.
Even with those that do require membership, most I ever belonged to, wouldnt allow it. Most wouldnt allow you to wear a gun, let alone draw and fire.

I belonged to clubs that were DCM affiliated and had shoots once a month, but you werent allowed to practice the rapid fire strings the rest of the month, due to their rapid fire rules.

Anymore, PC and insurance rules, control a lot of things when it comes to ranges and shooting.

Theres no doubt, dry fire practice is beneficial, especially in this respect, and I do it basically every night, but you still need the live fire, and to be comfortable with handling a loaded weapon, and especially in ways other than a controlled range.
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Old 10-09-2016, 07:57 AM
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Fluidity is key, and fluidity only comes with practice.

Two things to also consider, one having been mentioned by AK ... 1) How many people actually practice drawing their respective CCW? 2) How many people have actually experimented with different holsters and chosen the best ones? Based on my experience and observations, the answer to both if "Not enough" which is rather telling considering the "draw and get on target" process could save one's life.
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Old 10-09-2016, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wtr100 View Post
thoughts on this method?
What are your thoughts on this? You must have posted it for a reason. With perhaps some very minor variations, that's pretty much the standard technique being taught in the vast majority of pistol shooting schools today. It's what I was trained to do and what we teach to our CHL students.
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Old 10-09-2016, 10:09 AM
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Even with those that do require membership, most I ever belonged to, wouldnt allow it. Most wouldnt allow you to wear a gun, let alone draw and fire.
The only range I have been a member at allowed it. They had a separate section called the "Training Bay" for members and law enforcement. They allowed drawing from the holster and had no restrictions on the speed you could fire so long as you could safely control it.

Places like that are in my opinion the only worthwhile places to shoot once you master the basic fundamentals and even at that they only allow you to fire at one target and your movement is extremely limited. I refuse to waste the time and ammo on anywhere I can't increase my skill. For now I am making the half hour drive to a forest service road accessible only to 4x4 and training exclusively outdoors.
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Old 10-09-2016, 10:47 AM
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Im lucky enough now to belong to a local club that allows pretty much anything (as long as youre safe), including full autos, another thing that can be difficult, especially in the eyes of the fudds.

Its a very nice, basically "private" range (you rarely ever see anyone else), and I get to practice pretty much anything I need to, anytime I want. All that for $25 a year, and its just two minutes down the road from my place.
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Old 10-09-2016, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by AK103K View Post
Im lucky enough now to belong to a local club that allows pretty much anything (as long as youre safe), including full autos, another thing that can be difficult, especially in the eyes of the fudds.

Its a very nice, basically "private" range (you rarely ever see anyone else), and I get to practice pretty much anything I need to, anytime I want. All that for $25 a year, and its just two minutes down the road from my place.
You have it made then. Most don't and I feel that's why so many people, despite being accomplished marksmen (is is marksperson these days?) they are useless for defense. You can practice shooting or you can practice drawing but unless you are doing them together, you aren't learning enough.
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Old 10-09-2016, 02:00 PM
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I refuse to go to ranges which are so sterile you have to shoot from a bench. I understand why they do this I just don’t like it. If you really want to start the process I suggest, “The Art of Modern Gunfighting”. http://internationaltactical.com/boo...15496&stype=43
The guy who wrote this is the real deal. There is nothing wrong with watching a video however you have to follow it up with good instruction. A good instructor will ensure your presentation is correct. Many times an instructor will start out on the range correcting bad habits a student has learned over the years or has been taught by others.

One of the biggest problems I see is the gun does not fit the shooter. If you have small hands you will have a very difficult time shooting something like a Sig or Beretta double action pistol. I know people who shot them just fine however I am talking about someone starting out. I would prefer they shoot a S&W M&P, Glock (4th generation) or similar weapon which has several different sizes of grips. These types of guns will fit most hands and yes they do have guns with smaller grips but then you are getting smaller calibers and I recommend 9mm or larger. I know x amount of people have been killed with a 22 or a 32, I don’t care I am talking about someone starting out new.

Here are a few things you should do.
Stance – comfortable stance, feet about shoulder width apart, leaning slightly forward your shoulders over your toes. It is a good fighting stance more of a combination of the isosceles and the weaver positions.
Grip – like a nice firm handshake, not limp and not white knuckled
Sight alignment – top of the front sight level with the top of the rear sight with equal amounts of light on either side when viewed from the rear.
Sight picture – that front sight is imposed upon the target, the rear slight blur as well as the target however the front sight needs to be crisp and clear. The front sight can be in the center, top or bottom of the target whichever the shooter chooses is best for them.
Trigger pressure – steading increasing pressure to the rear of the trigger guard causing the weapon to fire.
Follow through – when the gun fires you want to concentrate on realigning the front sight on the target and not looking at the target. So if you were to fire once you would see the front sight twice.
Eye dominance – are you left eye or right eye dominant? This may determine how you hold the weapon.


One other thing I highly recommend is if you are a shooter don’t teach your family how to shoot, have someone else do it. I sent both my kids to other people. I don’t know about you but I have a tendency to lose my patients with my kids much faster, I want them to be perfect. So rather then turn them off to shooting I sent them to someone else and now we all shoot together.

Chuckberry someone at FLETC did not explain it correctly. Once the gun clears the holster and is pointed down range it can be shot relatively accurately at short ranges. Too many times a person will wait to extend the weapon all the way out before even putting their finger on the trigger. You are spot on when the distance it increased you want to use your sights to the best of your ability. I think what they wanted was, in an emergency situation where someone is pulling a gun on you, you want to shoot as fast as you can. However, to start shooting every time you rotate the gun up would be wrong, I agree with you, close in no problem.
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