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Old 12-03-2019, 03:27 PM
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I WAS told that IF I joined I would be a lifeguard at a Hawaiian nude beach where only girls who were 8's and above were allowed to swim... and they wouldn't be able to swim that well so I would be busy doing lifeguard stuff to them

They lied.
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Old 12-03-2019, 03:35 PM
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Originally Posted by TRyan View Post
In another thread one of our forum friends made the statement "Imagine the outrage if I said I didn't owe veterans anything!" So I decided to put it to the test.

I am here to say I dont owe veterans anything. IMO veterans made the choice to join (not counting the draft) and need to own all that comes with that choice (good and bad). Although I dont believe anyone owes the vets, or anyone else, anything I do choose to give them my respect and admiration. It's a tough job not everyone could do.

So let the test begin and flame on with your outrage. If, of course, you are outraged at my statement.

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Old 12-03-2019, 03:36 PM
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If the military were really sent on winnable missions that repel or destroy invaders, and that really defend democracy and the American people-- then almost every guy would join up, and women would find them much more irresistible. And everybody's enthusiasm and admiration for the military would be even much more than it is now.

As things stand now, what I can say generally about military people is that they are cool guys and gals with a cool job, who are definitely playing a bit of a tragic role at this point in our history. I think everybody is a little puzzled right now by the things the military is sent to do, including the people in uniform themselves.

Enthusiasm and admiration for the military, police, politicians, media, etc., can definitely go too far. And we should try to notice when the powers that be or certain kinds of activists are trying to make us go too far. People are only doing the healthy, normal thing when they start to look askance at it at the right times.

Ultimately, military people and law enforcement are just people. They can be treated as individuals, just like other people. They do that to each other all the time. If you could hear every honest thing a military person or a LEO had to tell you about his brethren, it probably would include a lot more besides just that he's thankful for their service.

When the ancient Greeks were still mercenaries for the Persians, how were the folks at home supposed to feel about it? 100% pleased? Some of the other stuff the Greeks eventually did was a lot different.
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Old 12-03-2019, 03:39 PM
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I once spoke to a vet.

He was soaked in filth and his own urine, stank as though he had never met a stick of deodorant, kept getting into my personal space, and asking me nosy questions when he wasn't begging for money.

He told me he had been given a bipolar diagnosis but wouldn't take the medication, and he was "just fine, not crazy like they said" and went back to begging when he saw a Lexus.

Did I give him any money? NO. The VA had plenty of programs for him if he wanted and only 2 bus rides from where we were standing.

He was also in much better physical shape than my husband, who works.
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Old 12-03-2019, 03:46 PM
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Find me someone who served that says I owe them more respect than someone who didn't serve.
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Old 12-03-2019, 03:48 PM
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Well you owe them the freedom you have to say stupid stuff & post it on the interwebz. Also the interwebz came from DARPA, a DOD agency. You should go Normandy next D-day & shout this to all who can hear.
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Old 12-03-2019, 03:49 PM
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A guy I worked with hated being in the Navy and talked endlessly about how he was getting out, how it is ruining his life, blah blah blah. Constantly missing work (which he hardly did anyway) for medical appointments or some drama. His wife would call the shop several times a day with some emergency. She wouldn't go to the off work functions because she hated the Command and the Navy was ruining her life.

Several years after being out, and after 9-11, Facebook became popular and I connected with them again. They were the biggest "Salute our troops, thank a Veteran" posters out there. They never missed an opportunity for a pat on the back.

They are who I think about when this topic comes up.
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Old 12-03-2019, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Loves_Chickens View Post
Find me someone who served that says I owe them more respect than someone who didn't serve.
Exactly. No vet I know asks for that. If they did, I'd wonder if they were really a vet.

But vets often say that people should respect other vets more, especially those that didn't come back, or only partially made it back...
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Old 12-03-2019, 04:10 PM
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I treat everyone with a fairly high base level of respect. But I afford no extra respect to veterans.

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Originally Posted by Chuckleberry View Post
Well you owe them the freedom you have to say stupid stuff & post it on the interwebz. Also the interwebz came from DARPA, a DOD agency. You should go Normandy next D-day & shout this to all who can hear.
The Veterans of which war?

I don't think any war the US has been involved in since WWII has actually been important for the safety or rights of American citizens.

If they are a veteran of any war in the past 60 years, I don't owe them anything more than I owe any of the other Exxon employees.

They weren't protecting me, my family or our rights. They were enriching the military industrial complex and getting paid by my tax money to do it.

On the other hand there are WWII veterans, they have my extra respect.
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Old 12-03-2019, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by TheFall View Post
If they are a veteran of any war in the past 60 years, I don't owe them anything more than I owe any of the other Exxon employees.
What a pile of ridiculous media fed horse pucky .

There was no oil in the Fulda Gap.
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Old 12-03-2019, 04:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFall View Post
I treat everyone with a fairly high base level of respect. But I afford no extra respect to veterans.



The Veterans of which war?

I don't think any war the US has been involved in since WWII has actually been important for the safety or rights of American citizens.

If they are a veteran of any war in the past 60 years, I don't owe them anything more than I owe any of the other Exxon employees.

They weren't protecting me, my family or our rights. They were enriching the military industrial complex and getting paid by my tax money to do it.

On the other hand there are WWII veterans, they have my extra respect.
You are also free to be that naive, thanks to veterans. Whether it was the cold war or any other war. If it wasn't for a strong U.S. military, including the post WWII military, you wouldn't have the freedom to bash that same military, or the govt. Because you don't have a clue how our military keeps us safe & free doesn't mean squat other than demonstrating what our public indoctrination centers have accomplished over the last 30+ years.
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Old 12-03-2019, 04:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckleberry View Post
Clearly responding to the OP,(
Not so clearly....but whatever.
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Old 12-03-2019, 04:27 PM
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I have few regrets in my life. "IF" I could go back in time, I'd join the Navy in the hopes of aircraft carrier duty working on aircraft. Like I wanted to when in High School.

I greatly admire our armed forces, absolutely love the USA, and kick myself (hard) for not doing my part in any branch of the military.

EDIT: Oh and yes, I am very thankful to our vets for stepping up and doing what needed to be done, whether they saw combat or swept the floors stateside.
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Old 12-03-2019, 04:40 PM
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I joined for myself and my country. I didnt join for accolades from people that never served.
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Old 12-03-2019, 08:50 PM
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I respect veterans in general but ones who are always looking for an extra handout, or a pass for truly abhorrent behavior have lost it.

The negligent driver who ran over my husband and put him in a wheelchair is a vet. Does he have my respect? Hell no. Does he get a pass for distracted driving and literally killing my husband (dead in the road for 10 minutes) - because he served? No.

What about the pervert? I will not go into details on him. Always looking for an extra disability rating even though he can pick up and walk with a 40# case of water, see, use both arms and legs, hear, drive, etc...wants 100% disability for a small skin growth? Cheated us, personally, out of hundreds of dollars? Deserves my respect for that? No, he flushed it years ago.

Since he is rated at 60% the State of Texas gave him a disabled veteran plate which he uses to take the handicapped spot everywhere he goes - even though he can walk just fine and does not need it. Just because he "can" because he is a veteran.

**** that, I say.

or Johnny the bipolar drunk. I don't owe him anything either.
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Old 12-03-2019, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRyan View Post
In another thread one of our forum friends made the statement "Imagine the outrage if I said I didn't owe veterans anything!" So I decided to put it to the test.

I am here to say I dont owe veterans anything. IMO veterans made the choice to join (not counting the draft) and need to own all that comes with that choice (good and bad). Although I dont believe anyone owes the vets, or anyone else, anything I do choose to give them my respect and admiration. It's a tough job not everyone could do.

So let the test begin and flame on with your outrage. If, of course, you are outraged at my statement.

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We ALL owe them our respect x 1000. I would have joined in 82 but there were no wars and I really don't like being told what to do for no reason.
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Old 12-03-2019, 09:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arleigh View Post
Personally I think that every citizen should be required some form of service for a specified length of time.
.
As a 100% disabled combat vet I would like to say that I am willing to pick up a rifle again to fight slavery such as you espouse.


I am owned nothing but what (such as GI Bill and health care for service connected injuries) was contracted (and I paid on my end) for. (Although veterans discounts are appreciated and repaid with a preference for business, and handicapped parking is appreciated when I have to use it on bad days.)

No outrage here, but if you'd like to kiss my feet the line starts to the left.
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Old 12-03-2019, 09:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFall View Post
I treat everyone with a fairly high base level of respect. But I afford no extra respect to veterans.



The Veterans of which war?

I don't think any war the US has been involved in since WWII has actually been important for the safety or rights of American citizens.

If they are a veteran of any war in the past 60 years, I don't owe them anything more than I owe any of the other Exxon employees.

They weren't protecting me, my family or our rights. They were enriching the military industrial complex and getting paid by my tax money to do it.

On the other hand there are WWII veterans, they have my extra respect.
THEN...
You never understood...GRENADA.........
I saw the cruelty in HEARTBREAK RIDGE... the movie of course not actually there for the battle(?)
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Old 12-03-2019, 09:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Nomad, 2nd View Post
No outrage here, but if you'd like to kiss my feet the line starts to the left.
And for the rest, the line is to the rear...
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Old 12-03-2019, 09:53 PM
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Odd thread from an OP I normally admire and agree with. I fundmentally disagree with this posting though.

Vets have an inherent level of respect and credibility from me. Now, they can tarnish it by contrary behavior, but I do believe as a whole WE do owe them.

Until the 1980s, the draft existed. So everyone in all wars prior to then (i.e. most wars in the world) lived under a different set of rules. Further, volunteers really gain more respect. And no, nobody REALLY knows what it's all about until they are in. Recruiting posters aren't reality.

It's a brutal profession and WE do owe public servants like military, police, fire, etc.
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