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Old 09-24-2017, 03:28 PM
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Using larger type doesn't make your words any more special either.
No but makes it easier for some people to read. Not everyone has 20/20...give people a break huh?
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Old 09-26-2017, 12:57 PM
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If you want access after the emp strike, you aren't going to get it. Best case scenario...get yourself a small reliable smart phone that you can access the battery. Buy several replacement batteries. Remove everything from the phone and add as much storage via SD as the phone can handle. Load information into the phone, including books, articles, movies, maps, music, etc. Create a survival library. Then turn off the phone or better, remove the battery, wrap everything in aluminum foil, put into a ziplock bag and rewrap with foil.
Get yourself a solar kit that will charge the phone. Wrap all of those components in foil twice as well. Now you have an accessible library with power source, safe from EMP. You also have the means to access the Internet if the power returns.
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Old 09-26-2017, 01:45 PM
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My guess is none will survive, at least for quite a while. There will be a lot of electronics damage, but even if it's minimal, there probably won't be any power to run anything. The electrical grid will likely be down and that won't come back over night.
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Old 09-26-2017, 02:11 PM
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What is wrong with some of you people? The OP is new, why so rude??
There is zero excuse for that kind of behavior, if you don't like the thread you know what to do.
And yeah, I like the bigger type also, easier to read.
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Old 09-26-2017, 02:58 PM
sygata sygata is offline
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Off course internet and email, as a whole, will survive a single localized EMP attack. The people affected will not have access though, but I expect internet to recover much faster then cell phone networks. small electronics, like phones, have a good chance of surviving, especially if they are not using the wall charger at the moment, and if they have internal EMI shielding (like iPhone 7, for example, Samsung was looking at it as well, if Iremember correctly). Antennas will be fried, so the use will be very limited.
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Old 09-26-2017, 07:10 PM
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Power is somewhat of a separate issue, so I'll ignore that for now.

The actual information....at least the majority of it, especially stuff on reliable hosts will survive.

As much as people think things will go poof, for the most part, large hosts have backups for their backups,(the really good ones have copies saved periodically that are not just in a secure location, but also offline and even airgapped except during updates) so the kind of stuff on those servers should survive. Major sites....Google hosted stuff..... Wikipedia etc, that should be pretty easy to bring back up. DNS servers might be a bit of a weak link temporarily, but there are enough out there (and there are secure backups) that they should come back fast. Self hosted stuff without backups could go, but that is becoming less and less common.

What could very likely be an issue is available bandwidth. The backups would be much slower than what's available today. Think garden hose instead of waterfall.

Last mile infrastructure might go down, but I'm guessing it would be hit or miss, and my money would be on a majority of it surviving.
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Old 09-28-2017, 08:33 PM
MikeOKC MikeOKC is offline
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This is some basic information about EMP E pulses culled from several internet sources.
E pulses occur when a nuclear detonation occurs. The effects of a high altitude nuclear EMP detonation depend on the altitude of the detonation, its energy yield, gamma ray output, the interactions with the Earth’s magnetic field, and electromagnetic shielding of targets.
The E1 pulse is the first of three pulse components of a nuclear EMP, and is very fast. This initial pulse is very short in duration but is a very intense electromagnetic field that induces very high voltages in electrical conductors, semiconductors — ‘solid-state’ electronics, microchips and integrated circuits, etc. E1 causes most of its damage by causing the ‘electrical breakdown’ voltages of semiconductors to be exceeded. Zapped… Permanently.
The E1 pulse occurs far too quickly for ordinary surge protectors to be effective. The pulse may rise to its peak value in 5 nanoseconds (0.000000005). To put that in perspective, ‘the blink of an eye’ takes about 300 milliseconds (0.300000000). The E2 pulse? Apparently substantially less than that of lightning. E2 is generally considered to be the easiest to protect against. The E3 pulse? It is caused by the nuclear detonation’s temporary distortion of the Earth’s magnetic field and has similarities to a geomagnetic storm caused by a solar flare. E3 lasts from tens of seconds to hundreds of seconds. E3 can produce geomagnetically induced currents in long electrical conductors, damaging components such as power line transformers The E3 component of the pulse is a very slow pulse. Like a geomagnetic storm, E3 can produce geomagnetically induced currents in long electrical conductors, which can then damage or destroy transformers of all sizes.
Essentially, unless you have invested in protective technologies like Faraday Cages and mylar anti static bags your Internet access and your communications are going to be non functional.
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Old 09-29-2017, 10:33 PM
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Good write up about EMP

http://www.futurescience.com/emp/emp-protection.html
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Old 09-30-2017, 10:05 AM
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Default I Thought Global-ness Was The Whole Point....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr4btTahoe View Post
The "internet" consists of hundreds of thousands if not millions of servers located around the globe. Unless you are talking GLOBAL EMP... the damage to the "internet" as a whole would be minimal. Might take a bit to gain access to it again in the areas directly effected.. but I'd say the majority of the information would still be there.

That good enough of a guess for ya?
This is what I was thinking, too. Why would the whole internet go down, just because your internet has gone down?
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Old 10-02-2017, 07:44 PM
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The internet in an area effected by an EMP will probably go down. The emails won't go anywhere. They will still be on the hard drives that stored them. Accessing the emails could be a huge problem if the EMP fried their controller boards.
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Old 10-03-2017, 10:08 AM
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the backbone is the weak link, and I don't know how well those data centers/switching centers are hardened if at all. many of them will have power backups however.

the weakest link however is going to be your DNS. if your DNS goes down, you are screwed if you don't know how to manually change it to another DNS

beyond that, the internet is widely distributed - how functional the internet is "for you" depends on what services you use and where they are located in particular.

high-end websites often have one (or more) automated failovers, so that if their primary goes down, it automatically rolls to the backup and continues to work seamlessly. if they're smart, this automated failover is located in another region. however it may not be. my employer has an automated failover located within 45 mins driving distance.


a lot of the IT infrastructure is located in the so-cal, dallas area, chicago, and atlanta. if you knocked those areas out, I could see the usable internet sites being reduced by 50%
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Old 10-03-2017, 02:38 PM
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Many relevant posts in this thread, lots of thought put into some of them.

Email messages might be recoverable in some cases, but would likely be really low priority. As to “what might happen”, too many variables to predict.

The company that I work for has told us to print and file any critical emails in the event that our servers are taken out by some unforeseen event.
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Old 10-03-2017, 08:02 PM
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Many of the larger hosting companies servers would survive.......the biggest websites have the most secure data that have drives swapped out constantly in sort of a Raid 5 configuration. The swapped drives are then store in vaults that are mostly underground. Dont think that Amazon has not thought of this already.

Military grade hardened wifi networks would also survive. Satellite uplinks would broadcast some wifi signal.

As a matter of prepping (this is an ongoing project for me). I have a digital office that is backed up on raid 5 then backed up again daily. That drive is stored in an EMP proof/fireproof bag.

I am in the process of adding a Samsung Galaxy Tab that has a file explorer in it. I will back up my crucial date on SD cards and store those in a similar way. Once this project is complete the Tablet will go into an EMP bag along with a router.

I am also working on an intranet network drive that will have all kinds of information stored on it.

If I chose to so I could broadcast that drive and share it with people in need.

That being said.....all of the local "cable" infrastructure would be wiped out. Exposed computers, cel phones, etc would suffer unknown damage.

I'm sure there would be a few surviving cel phones that would/could connect over some type of a mesh network if the apps were installed.

HK
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Old 10-05-2017, 08:58 PM
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Depends on if the data center has emp mitigation. It may temporarily lose connectivity, but in a proper facility all of the data can be protected.

Check out this it will operational next year and should be able to withstand quite a bit, incluing emp.

Http://www.datashelter.com
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Old 10-06-2017, 08:40 AM
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Every now and then I sell electronics components Last month I got in the what appeared to be a large coax adapter for cable lines. I thought they were junk until I researched them and found out they were EMP filters at $100 each.

I'm pretty sure many of the larger companies have these in their networks.
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Old 10-06-2017, 12:06 PM
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it's possible your important data would survive if it is stored in one of the largest company's data centers, but it might take some time for you to access it again.

Any given email server or website might be located across the country from you, and there's a lot of hops in between. Try running a traceroute from a command line. Look at how many hops.

I did a tracert between myself and survivalistboards.com

It took 7 hops to get from southwest ohio to chicago, and then it bounced around chicago 5 times before it hit the actual server. That's at least 12 hops from here to there, and if anything is wrong with any one of those (or my DNS!) it ain't happenin'
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Old 10-06-2017, 02:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by merlinfire View Post
the backbone is the weak link, and I don't know how well those data centers/switching centers are hardened if at all. many of them will have power backups however.

the weakest link however is going to be your DNS. if your DNS goes down, you are screwed if you don't know how to manually change it to another DNS

beyond that, the internet is widely distributed - how functional the internet is "for you" depends on what services you use and where they are located in particular.

high-end websites often have one (or more) automated failovers, so that if their primary goes down, it automatically rolls to the backup and continues to work seamlessly. if they're smart, this automated failover is located in another region. however it may not be. my employer has an automated failover located within 45 mins driving distance.


a lot of the IT infrastructure is located in the so-cal, dallas area, chicago, and atlanta. if you knocked those areas out, I could see the usable internet sites being reduced by 50%
DNS is a convenience, it isnt mandatory. As long as you have an IP address you can route through any connection to get to any computer that is connected. The internet is designed to be resistant to massive failures.

If you are bored you can setup your own DNS server that will replicate with the ISP ones and then use that, but that is just a convenience, not a necessity. (you might be thinking of routing tables which are different than DNS and are actually used to route TCP/IP traffic)
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Old 10-06-2017, 03:38 PM
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Just like the power company, the plant normally stays online after the storm. It is the last mile that will be the biggest problem.

The core of the Internet is inherently fault redundant. Twelve hops may actually be a good thing. That is twelve places to take an alternate route.

The "last mile," or first mile will be an issue at the server end also. Any large data center will have multiple connections. The good data centers have completely separate physical entrances of the cable. Others may have two or three connections that all run through one physical cable.

Congestion could become a big problem. With multiple failures on the big backbones, a lot of traffic will be forced through alternate routes. Pages will time out and message retrievals will have to be reinitiated.

If there are also long-term power outages, nodes that were functional could run out of their backup power supply.

The internet also rides on top of the phone system. Cables are always getting cut and equipment is always failing. With current active maintenance, redundant systems keep everything running until the equipment and cable repairs can be accomplished. If the workforce stands down, redundant systems will become primary, and then links will fail when the secondary systems fail.

An EMP may also damage the redundant system, which may go unnoticed until the primary fails. On long cable runs, there are many repeaters. There could be 100 repeaters and opportunities for failure. If anyone of these is impacted, then that route will fail. The Internet Protocols will automatically look for an alternate route. Eventually, there will not be any alternate routes.

An EMP will not have to impact every piece of equipment to take down the Internet. There are, however, many opportunities to loose key equipment and associated reducent systems that will cause isolations of large sections of the internet.
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Old 10-06-2017, 04:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justme11 View Post
having just had my internet router and VOIP phone modem blown to crap from lightning that hit my neighbor's house, I would say that unless you have really protected the crap out of your modem, it will go bye bye.

Internet server farms might have more sophistacted protections though. But I would encourage everyone to check on a few things:
If you have a copper cable that comes into your modem from outside, run it though a surge protector like I just picked up from Monster.
https://www.amazon.com/Monster-EXP-8...M56PRG6KRW0GGE
or Belkin.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000J2EN4S..._t1_B00BV89WOU



Then of course supply the electrical power to modems, phones and computers via UPS.

And try to prevent other wires from getting close to the wires you are protecting.

And consider putting a smoke alarm in the attic. If my neighbor was fast enough, he could have entered his attic with a fire extinguisher maybe and not lost anything. Instead about 15 minutes went by and he pretty much lost his house and everything in it.
Just to add to this, since its really great advice, you can also install a whole home surge protection right at the electrical box so that every single outlet in your home has a layer of surge protection, then using another surge protector at the outlet on critical devices for extra security. Most people do not think of the cable TV coming into their home, it can also be surge protected right where it comes into the house to have full home protection. I also had lighting take a few devices out in my home, the whole home surge protection cost me about $75
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Old 10-07-2017, 01:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by formulass670 View Post
Just to add to this, since its really great advice, you can also install a whole home surge protection right at the electrical box so that every single outlet in your home has a layer of surge protection, then using another surge protector at the outlet on critical devices for extra security. Most people do not think of the cable TV coming into their home, it can also be surge protected right where it comes into the house to have full home protection. I also had lighting take a few devices out in my home, the whole home surge protection cost me about $75
Some good info here about "lightening" protection.

http://www.arrl.org/lightning-protection

Few years back had lighting strike out HAM antenna 155 feet up a old growth fir tree at our BOL. Cooked the tree, but didn't damage anything in the comm's-radio room.

We also have HughesNet & I wonder about a way to protect it from EMP? Also wonder how it will effect the satellites?
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